Gun Control

[GEddie]

Oh that can’t be true at all. More guns means more shootings. Just look at all those mass random shootings we have at banks, court houses, police stations, FBI offices, and military bases. We’d all be a lot safer if everyone was unarmed. It’s not like we ever see mass random shootings at movie theaters, malls, or schools. /sarcasm

Well, we DID have a mass shooting on a military base, remember?

What I don’t get is why the culprit is still breathing. The Army could have convened the firing squad long ago.

As to those other places you mentioned, the intense security for them has as much to do with crime not happening there as armed people walking around.

ICXC NIKA

 

[Brendan]

Is there a connection?

There are actually two possibilities,

1. That there is a connection, and that increased gun ownership decreases the murder rate
2. That there is no connection at all to gun ownership and the murder rate. That they are independent of each other

Neither one is good news for any premise that gun control aimed at reducing gun ownership will reduce murder rates.

 

[oldcatholicguy]

Well, we DID have a mass shooting on a military base, remember?

What I don’t get is why the culprit is still breathing. The Army could have convened the firing squad long ago.

As to those other places you mentioned, the intense security for them has as much to do with crime not happening there as armed people walking around.

ICXC NIKA

Yes, and that armed presence to discourage crime is what leads the mass shooters to not select them as targets. Mass shooters, like terrorists, go after the “soft targets.” “Soft target” in this case means areas in which there are a high number of victims and little to no risk of any of them being armed.

 

[kingston1]

Yes, and that armed presence to discourage crime is what leads the mass shooters to not select them as targets. Mass shooters, like terrorists, go after the “soft targets.” “Soft target” in this case means areas in which there are a high number of victims and little to no risk of any of them being armed.

I agree and wonder why people who advocate “no guns because the federal government says so” believe the federal government or anyone else has one’s family’s self defense interests in mind?

I too am for no guns but not because the federal government says so, we should seek peace as followers of Christ. But we also believe in self defense. The government, the police, the military would all keep their guns. The criminals would make money off the black market and would welcome “no guns” laws as it is profitable. The only ones who are left out are the law abiding folks who don’t believe in Santa Claus or fairy tales that people are generally good.

I do not own guns myself and am former and retired Marine so I know how to handle one, how to be safe with one. I know what they do and I can use them but I am a peaceful person too. I believe violence and wickedness are a reality and cannot fault someone who wants to protect himself from intruders and from government/law enforcement. We only have to look at history to see that a government can be oppressive (see Romania, Cambodia, China, America, Poland, Russia, S. Africa, Germany, etc, etc.). Not to say it would or would not happen here but as a human being I have inalienable rights, and I can prepare myself from reasonable threats. Criminals being the most obvious of course. I have the right to reasonably protect myself.

 

[on_the_hill]

The right to bear arms has little to do with it.
If there is no gun, people will simply find another way to kill.

Mmm…I don’t think so. I’ve never killed someone, but from what I understand it’s much easier, from a psychological standpoint, to kill someone with a gun.

 

[vz71]

Mmm…I don’t think so. I’ve never killed someone, but from what I understand it’s much easier, from a psychological standpoint, to kill someone with a gun.

You are mistaken.
The psychology of murder is the same regardless of the tool.

 

[GEddie]

Mmm…I don’t think so. I’ve never killed someone, but from what I understand it’s much easier, from a psychological standpoint, to kill someone with a gun.

Psychologically and physically.

Only the very strong can kill easily with their hands; poison and the like require premeditation.

Whereas with a firearm, anybody can end anybody without.a thought.

ICXC NIKA

 

[on_the_hill]

You are mistaken.
The psychology of murder is the same regardless of the tool.

I do not accept your hypothesis and replace it with my own.

 

[Eagle1937]

Normal US citizens can’t purchase automatic weapons (machine guns). Doing so takes a lot of government paperwork and effort.

And this is for old automatics! USA citizens can not buy brand new selectfire firearms.

Only the old guns that have been floating around since the 1920s, 30s, 40s, 50s thru the 1980s. I forget the actual cutoff date. I do think it was in 1986. So basically, Americans can buy automatics that were made in 1986 or before…I could be wrong on this…I will need to check.

And these old circulating autos are exspensive! $10,000 for a M16 for example.

At one time, 1920s thru the early 30s, one can walk into a hardware store, buy a shovel and a Thompson…

They good old days…My Grandfather days.

 

[freeRadical]

Honestly, it’s irrelevant.

If America were to be a firearm free nation, any attempt at doing such has long passed. Even in states which have passed ridiculously stringent standards, the percentage of formerly legal firearms owners who turned them in is absolutely dismal. What’s even more startling about the forfeiture rates is that these dismal rates were of citizens in states with the most rabidly anti-firearm cultures. Attempting to impose forfeiture laws or massive regulatory reforms in a state with a flourishing gun culture like Texas, Michigan, Georgia, etc… and the request would just be laughed at.

What’s even worse though is the proponents of firearm registration or additional regulations of almost every state which has enacted major reform, has been caught in massive lies about the limits and purposes of the reform. Look at NY, NJ, or CA which have strong anti-firearm cultures and some of the most intense regulations… all of them were caught after not just promising to not go after people who register, but openly and vocally went after people who registered firearms even when their own laws stated that they couldn’t. That overzealousness has put the nail in the coffin of any major regulatory reforms or changes - IMO.

Not to mention there are many states that have enacted, or are thinking about enacting, amendments to their state constitutions that basically nullifies any attempts by the federal government or agents of the federal government to enforce gun control legislation that they deem is unconstitutional in their states.

 

[freeRadical]

To be frank, I really do not know much about the current gun laws on the books. If you say that they are already too stringent then I take your statement as accurate. I don’t own guns and do not know much about the culture of owning 1. I simply wonder how these crazies always manage to get weapons that shoot tons of rounds per second. Again, I am really ignorant about guns. I just wish a normal US citizen would be unable to purchase a gun that works like a machine gun.

First off, to purchase a gun in this country everyone must go through a background check.

Second, citizens cannot posses fully automatic guns or select fire guns, guns that fire multiple rounds per trigger pull.

Third, most guns used in school shooting are semi-automatic rifles or handguns, guns that fire one round per trigger pull, or shotguns. So these “crazies” do not use guns that shoot multiple round per second.

 

[Eagle1937]

“Second, citizens cannot posses fully automatic guns or select fire guns, guns that fire multiple rounds per trigger pull”

USA citizens can. But, very difficult and takes forms and 6 months. And money…

And as time goes by, these older firearms will become more and more rare.

In the late 1960s, some USA High Schools had Gun Clubs. Competition shooting - 22LR rifles.

I remember reading an article were students carried their rifles on the Bus - City Buses. Unloaded of course. The bus driver made sure of this…

 

[hu324b]

All I can say is thank God I’m not American.Not on my list of Countries I want to live in.

 

[freeRadical]

Well, we DID have a mass shooting on a military base, remember?

What I don’t get is why the culprit is still breathing. The Army could have convened the firing squad long ago.

As to those other places you mentioned, the intense security for them has as much to do with crime not happening there as armed people walking around.

ICXC NIKA

Soldiers are not allowed to be armed on military bases, ie, they can’t carry a gun with ammo in it. Ammo is locked up and guarded heavily on military bases. So, soldiers are basically defenseless while they are on a military base.

 

[freeRadical]

All I can say is thank God I’m not American.Not on my list of Countries I want to live in.

I thank God everyday that I was born in America. I couldn’t imagine living anywhere else.

 

[freeRadical]

“Second, citizens cannot posses fully automatic guns or select fire guns, guns that fire multiple rounds per trigger pull”

USA citizens can. But, very difficult and takes forms and 6 months. And money…

And as time goes by, these older firearms will become more and more rare.

Yes, I should have pointed out that they can but it requires substantial government paperwork, jumping through hopes, and substantial money.

Thank you for correcting me.

 

[chadair]

Should I hold my breathe?

please do!!

if u do not wish to own a gun, than please don’t. but please don’t try and take mine away from me!!

 

[Buck_Crosswhite]

I can guarantee more children die in backyard swimming pools than by guns. Why not outlaw swimming pools.
40,000 people a year die in car wrecks. Are we going to outlaw cars?

 

[GEddie]

I can guarantee more children die in backyard swimming pools than by guns. Why not outlaw swimming pools.
40,000 people a year die in car wrecks. Are we going to outlaw cars?

I’m not particularly worried about children. That’s what parents are for, to protect and train them in a world full of guns, pools, open water, speeding cars, poisons, 120V sockets, etc.

Nor am I particularly worried about suicide. Our bodies die so easily, there would be suicide even if guns were gone forever.

I am mostly concerned about people who die needlessly because their heads occupy the sight line of a madman who armed themself before going mad.

ICXC NIKA

 

[Phil_Marinus]

Well folks… I think this one goes into the to hard basket…