You are the one that made the statement you will excercise your obligation. Does one submit completely or just on the items one agrees with? That is where my confusion comes in. When the Pope or Cardinal speaks contrary to your local Bishop’s practive/interpretation - who do you follow?
I will repeat myself again. You are first and foremost not my ecclesiastical authority. When given the choice to follow you (a lay person w/ no authority) and your interpretation and that of my Bishop, I am wiser to ignore you especially when this lay person (me) agrees with my Bishop’s interpretation. My Bishop obviously sees a distinction in liturgical dance and the such in the middle of Mass and something that takes place after the closing prayer and the final blessing.
I never claimed to be your authority. This is a discussion. But you are admitting since you and your Bishop agree you are OK with it. My question is what if your Bishop no longer allows this practice?
Look, clapping during the liturgy of the word or the liturgy of the eucharist would be obviously out of order.
After mass people need to clear the parking lot for the next mass and the missionary needs to stick around for that next mass…
Ok, so even taking that…
It looks like the USCCB does have a distinction on things done after the Prayer after Communion and prior to the final blessing.
In all the cases that I referenced, our Pastor called them up to the front (1st communicants, 50 year anniversary couple, scouts) and gave them a greeting and blessing. We then expressed our appreciation w/ a heartfelt applause for their participation in our parish life.
Finally, if my Bishop thinks it is ok to clap for the newly confirmed, my Pastor is right to conclude it is right to clap for the little 2nd graders on their biggest spiritual experience to-date.
Could you please tell me where this statement can be found? My thought is this…this statement was made by CARDINAL Ratzinger not Pope Benedict correct?? And I know they are the same person and yet he was not pope when this statement was written??? So it is an opinion of a Cardinal not an infallible Pope. Just a question.
See my point yet!!! Thanks Orion couldn’t have said it better myself!!
I think that main distinction is that he (Cardinal Ratzinger then/Pope now) is specifically referring to liturgical dancing. To expand his statement to something done at the end of the Mass during the Concluding Rite which specifically provides for special blessings (and according to my Bishop the American customary expression of appreciation “clapping”) is an attempt to use the Cardinal’s (now Pope’s) words to make an inference that just doesn’t hold water.
Yes, I do feel that people are worshipping themselves when they get in line for a round of applause during Mass. Mass is still not finished until the final blessing when the priest says, “The Mass is ended. Go in peace.”
No takers by the naysayers?
. And it wasn’t before the closing, either. It was between the Liturgy of the Word and the Liturgy of the Eucharist. Even the cardinals were applauding (respectfully, of course).YinYangMom said:
This very mass - a solemn funeral one, no less, led by Cardinal Ratzinger, with all the cardinals present and many dignitaries, was allowed to have a long “respectful” round of applause (and chanting, mind you) for gasp the “human achievements” of John Paul the II
Thus, a prime example of why taking the Cardinal’s words regarding a separate matter out of context to suggest a more universal application is erroneous.
I’m so glad you said this! That’s what this whole thread made me think of. Random applause in Mass is a bad thing; honoring and recognizing something that God has brought about, like say, a 50th anniversary, an ordination to the priesthood, or the funeral Mass of a man who gave his life to God and His people, is a wonderful thing.
He did not call for the round of applause but he didn’t raise his hand to stop it once it started. I clearly remember thinking he’d let it go on for a polite amount of time, as has been done elsewhere, but he let it go on for a long time, including the chants. I was really surprised because I thought he was such a conservative guardian of the liturgy. He seemed truly moved with love though.
Our last priest used to have visitors stand up and announce where they were from. Of course, this initiated a round of applause, which always made me cringe inside. A more appropriate place for this is after the Mass when the priest is greeting everyone as they leave.
Ah I see. Do you believe JPII was into self-worship? Do you believe he sought to be singled out for applause, especially at his funeral mass? I assure you, as a faithful obedient Catholic and staunch defender of the faith, you too, would be worthy of applause for your works though I fully understand you don’t do the works for that reason - that’s what makes it so noteworthy. Your humility is warranted and pleasing to God, as was JPIIs so please don’t take offense if one day your church does recognize you for your efforts toward promoting and defending the faith. I don’t know that it will happen but you sound like a wonderful Catholic and if you volunteer enough at your parish and they are accustomed to recognizing those they value for their service it could happen. If that were the case you, me and everyone else here on this board would know without a doubt you are not into self-worship, I suspect everyone in your parish would know that about you too.
How can you possibly interpret what I said about John Paul II in that context? Perhaps you need to re-read my post. Maybe it’s just late and you need to get some sleep
Paramedic, I totally understand your perspective on not wanting to get applause. I was raised and it is imbedded deep in me that praise can foster pride.