Happy Feast of Christ the King!

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So you think the hierarchy instituted a new calendar so the old one can still be followed? Makes no sense.
Actually you make no sense. Today in the EF, is Christ the King Class I. I go to a FSSP parish, which are in full communion with Rome and we are not denying the new calender, but the EF is celebrated usually with the pre 1969 calendar.
 
So you think the hierarchy instituted a new calendar so the old one can still be followed? Makes no sense.
Several people have patiently tried to explain things to you in this thread while you make unfounded accusations.

If you disagree with the Feast of Christ the King being celebrated today in those parishes using the Extraordinary Form of the Roman Rite then you need to take that up with the Holy Father. It is with Pope Benedict’s permission (and the permission of his predecessor Pope John Paul II) that this is done.

You have been nothing but uncharitable in your accusations and in your unwillingness to listen. Please stop it now.

James
 
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estesbob:
Only if you live in 2007.
What was the point of that remark?

What is the problem? We celebrate Christ the King a couple of weeks before you. What’s the big deal?

Those who attend the Old Mass use the Old Calendar. Those who attend the New Mass use the New Calendar. It’s that simple.

Personally, I believe that the EF should now use the New Calendar so that the entire Latin Rite celebrates the same feasts at the same time. However, I’m no expert and I can’t say why the Tridentine Mass needs the old Calendar. It obviously does so the Pope has allowed the use of the old Calendar.
 
🤷
What was the point of that remark?

What is the problem? We celebrate Christ the King a couple of weeks before you. What’s the big deal?

Those who attend the Old Mass use the Old Calendar. Those who attend the New Mass use the New Calendar. It’s that simple.

Personally, I believe that the EF should now use the New Calendar so that the entire Latin Rite celebrates the same feasts at the same time. However, I’m no expert and I can’t say why the Tridentine Mass needs the old Calendar. It obviously does so the Pope has allowed the use of the old Calendar.
I guess you’re like Episcopalians correct? They have recognized no new saints since the split with the Catholic Church. I guess if one is stuck in 1962 great Saints like St. Edith Stein and Maxmilliam Kolbe are left out in the cold.
 
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estesbob:
I guess you’re like Episcopalians correct? They have recognized no new saints since the split with the Catholic Church. I guess if one is stuck in 1962 great Saints like St. Edith Stein and Maxmilliam Kolbe are left out in the cold.
Personally, I believe that the EF should now use the New Calendar so that the entire Latin Rite celebrates the same feasts at the same time. However, I’m no expert and I can’t say why the Tridentine Mass needs the old Calendar. It obviously does so the Pope has allowed the use of the old Calendar.

Did you miss this part of my post?
 
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I guess you’re like Episcopalians correct? They have recognized no new saints since the split with the Catholic Church.
Actually, they kind of have.The American branch recognises everyone from Wilberforce/MLK Jr./Tubman to Cramner/Luther to Martyrs of Japan/St. Thomas Aquinas/St Ignatius of Loyola. (What St. Thomas or St. Ignatius would have made of that, I can’t imagine)

Don’t you think your comment is a little extreme and unwarranted?
I guess if one is stuck in 1962 great Saints like St. Edith Stein and Maxmilliam Kolbe are left out in the cold.
The celebration of such saints are authorized in accordance with the martyrology using the new Latin orations published for them.

And the comment could conceivably work both ways, could it not? The great saints or feasts on the old calendar left out in the new?
 
And the comment could conceivably work both ways, could it not? The great saints or feasts on the old calendar left out in the new?
You mean like great historical figures like St Christopher?
 
You mean like great historical figures like St Christopher?
I was thinking along the lines of St. Paschal Baylon.

And that does not even take into account the great saints and Doctors of the Church whose memorials are optional on the new general calendar. St. John Damascene. St. Robert Bellarmine. Examples of virtue? St. Maria Goretti. St. Rose of Lima.
 
I was thinking along the lines of St. Paschal Baylon.

And that does not even take into account the great saints and Doctors of the Church whose memorials are optional on the new calendar. St. John Damascene. St. Robert Bellarmine. **Examples of virtue? **St. Maria Goretti. St. Rose of Lima.
Yes-which is why they are on the calendar
 
Yes-which is why they are on the calendar
Optionally.

Honestly, I cannot for the life of me figure out why the calendar of all things, is the sticking point and perceived as disobedience or exaggeratedly compared to Protestantism. If the Pope approved the Extraordinary expression in the motu proprio, he approved it as it was calendar and all. If he says changes at a later date, there will be changes. Until then, he has approved it- one may disagree and wish for a unified calendar and/or legitmate developements and that comes under the private prudential disagreement each is entitled to make or hope for- but one can’t say, and to me it is absolutely wrong to say, it is disobedient. Or compare it to the TEC.
 
Ok people, the lack of charity here has gone far enough.

Rome allows those who wish to use the Liturgical books in force in 1962, including the Liturgical calendar. If anyone wants to criticize this, then take it up with the Holy Father. And while your at it, you might as well go over to the Eastern Christianity forum and demand that the Eastern Rites take up the Latin calendar.

I have no doubt that at some point new Saints will be added to the older calendar. In fact I think that their Feasts can already be celebrated using old proper prayers.
 
So you think the hierarchy instituted a new calendar so the old one can still be followed?
Probably wasn’t the original intent - but it’s the reality we have today. Here are the words of the Holy Father
…But in some regions, no small numbers of faithful adhered and continue to adhere with great love and affection to the earlier liturgical forms. These had so deeply marked their culture and their spirit that in 1984 the Supreme Pontiff John Paul II, moved by a concern for the pastoral care of these faithful, with the special indult “Quattuor abhinc annos” issued by the Congregation for Divine Worship, granted permission to use the Roman Missal published by Blessed John XXIII in the year 1962. Later, in the year 1988, John Paul II with the Apostolic Letter given Motu Proprio “Ecclesia Dei”, exhorted bishops to make generous use of this power in favor of all the faithful who so desired.

Our predecessor John Paul II having already considered the insistent petitions of these faithful, having listened to the views of the Cardinal Fathers of the Consistory of 22 March 2006, having reflected deeply upon all aspects of the question, invoked the Holy Spirit and trusting in the help of God, with this Apostolic Letter We DECREE the following
And then follows the new specifics of the law established by Pope Benedict XVI in the recent Motu Proprio - which “frees” the (now called) Extraordinary Form of the Latin Rite. As you might know, the 1962 Missal is tied to the Old Liturgical Calendar - the propers of each Mass, the feast days, everything about it really is intricatly tied in with the Old Calendar. It’s like I said, you can’t really have one without the other. As such, parishes that are entirely following the Extraordinary Form - and in oratories and parishes run by those religoius orders who celebrate the Extrodinary Form exlusively - you’ll find the old calendar followed as well.

And so, even if it seems a little confusing, trust in the Lord. Good things are happening here - it will be worked out in the long run with much prayer and cooperation among the faithful.

Peace in Christ,

DustinsDad
 
For anyone confused about the older liturgical calendar - there’s a wonderful synopisis here: http://www.fisheaters.com/time.html

Here’s the old calendar at a glance - the 25 key feast days and how they/it follows the life of Our Lord:Advent ----- He is coming
Nativity ----- He comes
Circumcision ----- He follows Old Testament Law
Epiphany ----- He reveals Himself as God -----
Holy Family ----- He grows up in a human family
Candlemas ----- Simeon’s prophecy
Septuagesima ----- We are in exile without Christ
Ash Wednesday ----- Without Christ, we are dust
Lent ----- Christ is in the Desert
Passion Sunday ----- Jews make plans to kill Jesus
7 Sorrows ----- Mary’s suffers at what is to come
Palm Sunday ----- He triumphantly enters Jerusalem
Spy Wednesday ----- Jesus is betrayed by Judas
Maundy Thursday ----- He offers the first Holy Mass
Good Friday ----- He is put to death and fulfills OldTestament Law
Holy Saturday ----- He is in the tomb
Easter ----- He is risen
Ascension ----- He ascends into Heaven
Pentecost ----- He sends the Holy Ghost
Trinity Sunday ----- The Most Holy Trinity has been fully revealed
Assumption ----- Mary is assumed into Heaven & crowned Queen
Christ the King ----- We recognize Christ’s Kingship now and forever
All Saints ----- We will triumph as have our heroic Saints
All Souls ----- We pray for those who are awaiting their triumph
Last Sunday in Time after Pentecost ----- Apocalypse. He will come to judge the world.

Peace in Christ,

DustinsDad
 
…I guess you’re like Episcopalians correct? They have recognized no new saints since the split with the Catholic Church. I guess if one is stuck in 1962 great Saints like St. Edith Stein and Maxmilliam Kolbe are left out in the cold.
As a “traditional” catholic, and as one who has a strong devotion to St. Maximillian Kolbe and who is a member of St. Maximillian Kolbe’s Militia of the Immaculata - I take just a wee bit of offence at that remark. I’ll take it as you are just confused.

Peace in Christ,

DustinsDad
 
Thank you for posting this. We said it at the end of Mass today before the Leonine prayers. Then we sang all the versus of To Jesus Christ Our Soverign King before the servers (including me) and priest recessed. For those who don’t know what they are, here are the Leonine prayers:

Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with thee; blessed art thou amongst women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus.
Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners, now and at the hour of our death. Amen.
(Said 3 times)

Hail, Holy Queen, Mother of Mercy, our life, our sweetness, and our hope. To thee to we cry, poor banished children of Eve. To thee do we send up our sighs, mouring and weeping in this valley of tears. Turn then, most gracious advocate, thine eyes of mercy toward us, and after this exile, show unto us the blessed Fruit of thy womb, Jesus. O clement, O loving, O sweet Virgin Mary.

Pray for us, O holy Mother of God. That we may be made worthy of the promises of Christ.

Let us pray.
O God, our refuge and our strength, look down with mercy upon the people who cry to Thee; and by the intercession of the glorious and immaculate Virgin Mary, Mother of God, of Saint Joseph her spouse, of the blessed Apostles Peter and Paul, and of all the saints, in Thy mercy and goodness hear our prayers for the conversion of sinners, and for the liberty and exaltation of the Holy Mother the Church. Through the same Christ Our Lord. Amen.

Saint Michael the Archangel, defend us in battle; be our protection against the wickedness and snares of the devil. May God rebuke him, we humbly pray: and do thou, O Prince of the heavenly host, by the power of God, thrust into hell satan and all the evil spirits who prowl about the world seeking the ruin of souls. Amen.

Most Sacred Heart of Jesus, Have mercy on us.
Most Sacred Heart of Jesus, Have mercy on us.
Most Sacred Heart of Jesus, Have mercy on us.
ACT OF CONSECRATION OF THE HUMAN RACE TO THE SACRED HEART OF JESUS
(By Pope Pius XI)

------------------------------------------------------------


Most sweet Jesus, Redeemer of the human race, look down upon us, humbly prostrate before Thine altar.

We are Thine and Thine we wish to be; but to be more surely united with Thee, behold each one of us freely consecrates himself today to Thy Most Sacred Heart.

Many, indeed, have never known Thee; many, too, despising Thy precepts, have rejected Thee.

Have mercy on them all, most merciful Jesus, and draw them to Thy Sacred Heart.

Be Thou King, O Lord, not only of the faithful who have never forsaken Thee, but also of the prodigal children who have abandoned Thee, grant that they may quickly return to their Father’s house, lest they die of wretchedness and hunger.

Be Thou King of those who are deceived by erroneous opinions, or whom discord keeps aloof and call them back to the harbour of truth and unity of faith, so that soon there may be but one flock and one shepherd.

Be Thou King of all those who even now sit in the shadow of idolatry or Islam, and refuse not Thou to bring them into the light of Thy kingdom. Look, finally, with eyes of pity upon the children of that race, which was for so long a time Thy chosen people; and let Thy Blood, which was once invoked upon them in vengeance, now descend upon them also in a cleansing flood of redemption and eternal life.

Grant, O Lord, to Thy Church, assurance of freedom and immunity from harm; give peace and order to all nations, and make the earth resound from pole to pole with one cry: Praise to the Divine Heart that wrought our salvation: to it be glory and honour forever.

Amen
 
I celebrated the feast of Christ the King today in a parish that is 100% faithful to the Magisterium. The Prior of the local Dominican Monastery celebrated the Mass. He is also a theological professor who teaches seminarians on Vatican II.

Before you start claiming that my parish is disobedient, make sure that you know what you are talking about. I attend the Tridentine Mass and we follow the older calendar. It is not disobedient, it’s just the way things are done.
no, it sounds like SSPX to me, that yuo can go about as you wish as long as you dont agree with it, but when someone else disagrees with Traditionalism, you scream, “Obedience!”. You cant have it both ways. This is a post Vatican 2 church, deal with it.
 
As a “traditional” catholic, and as one who has a strong devotion to St. Maximillian Kolbe and who is a member of St. Maximillian Kolbe’s Militia of the Immaculata - I take just a wee bit of offence at that remark. I’ll take it as you are just confused.

Peace in Christ,

DustinsDad
You should be offened that he is ignored by those who adhere to the 1962 Calendar.
 
no, it sounds like SSPX to me, that yuo can go about as you wish as long as you dont agree with it, but when someone else disagrees with Traditionalism, you scream, “Obedience!”. You cant have it both ways. This is a post Vatican 2 church, deal with it.
Your the one sounding SSPXto me. Rome has made it clear that any who wish can use the Liturgical books of 1962, though you peg any who utilize their rights as schismatic.

Regardless of Vatican II, this is the Catholic Church, deal with it.
 
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