Has Anyone anything to say about the Adoremus Hymnal

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Anathama_Sit

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Greetings to Catholic Answers Forum,

I am considering getting the Adoremus Hymnal as it is more traditional and has a great deal of Latin in it. What I am concerned with does it have Responsorial Psalms in the hymnal. I am going to be getting the organ edition.

Has anyone used this hymnal before? What do you have to say about this? Is the the only hymnal out there that is mainly traditional with a less emphasis on contemporary music?

Thanks.

God Bless.
Anathama Sit
 
We have two, which are now outdated with the new translations. have to get another one.
They are good though the hymns during mass are not always in there.
 
The Adoremus Hymnal is well versed with Latin and traditional hymn texts though it does not contain a Psalter for the Responsorials from the Lectionary.
 
There are better hymnals than the Adoremus Hymnal. I have the AH, and when my parish music director and I started looking for new hymnals, we found these two that trumped Adoremus by far:

St. Michael Hymnal

Vatican II Hymnal

The Vatican II Hymnal has the Chabanel Psalms for Responsorial Psalms. The V2 Hymnal also has the scores for the Propers. Wow!
 
Ironically, the Vatican II Hymnal is just about the best for the OF out there.
 
Greetings to Catholic Answers Forum,

I am considering getting the Adoremus Hymnal as it is more traditional and has a great deal of Latin in it. What I am concerned with does it have Responsorial Psalms in the hymnal. I am going to be getting the organ edition.

Has anyone used this hymnal before? What do you have to say about this? Is the the only hymnal out there that is mainly traditional with a less emphasis on contemporary music?

Thanks.

God Bless.
Anathama Sit
I have one (the new one, 2012 version).

It does not have the responsorial Psalms.

It’s not just “less emphasis” on contemporary music, it is, as far as I can tell, totally free of it. Some of the music is new, but not in the awful new style that was so popular lately, but is now going away.
 
I should have mentioned, I think that the Adoremus is a great hymnal. I’m considering them for my own parish.

The St Michael has too much contemporary stuff in it (reason alone to look elsewhere), and at my own parish we don’t need the Spanish hymns, (St. Michael has a lot) so that was another reason to eliminate it.

The Vatican II hymnal: still looking at it. I’ve heard their versions of the R. Psalms. I don’t like them at all—very difficult to sing. The end of the lines is exactly what someone would expect them “not” to be. The do-not-at-all flow like proper chant.
 
Greetings FrDavid96,

Thank you so much for that other feedback on the other two alternative hymnals. Yes I did want to steer away from the contemporary music as much as I could.

I do have a question, what would you recommend me using as for some psalm music. I want traditional sounding psalms. There’s a book called Respond and Acclaim but most of it sounds too contemprorary. I have taken to writing my own settings for the Psalms, of which the priest and the congregation approves, but I wanted to try to incorporate some other traditional arrangements of them.

Thanks about the Vatican II hymnal feedback on those psalms. I would like something that is easy for people to follow along with but not contemporary.

God Bless.
Anathama Sit
 
Greetings YoungTradCath,

How much Latin does the Vatican II hymnal have in it?

What attracted me to the Adoremus hymnal is the plethora of Latin as compared to other hymnals.

God Bless.
Anathama Sit
 
Greetings Windmill,

I am sorry for my ignorance but what are the Chabanel Psalms? Are those traditional?

God Bless.
Anathama Sit
 
Greetings YoungTradCath,

How much Latin does the Vatican II hymnal have in it?

What attracted me to the Adoremus hymnal is the plethora of Latin as compared to other hymnals.

God Bless.
Anathama Sit
There is LOTS of Latin for the mass ordinary in the Vatican II Hymnal. In fact, everything is in both Latin and English. And actually, the Vatican II Hymnal has the Chabanel psalms included in the hymnal itself. See the index here:

ccwatershed.org/media/pdfs/11/08/16/18-20-45_0.pdf

Admittedly, there aren’t many Latin hymns, really, but most of the classic Latin stuff is in there, like Ave Maria, Tantum Ergo, etc.

As far as psalms alone go, I would definitely check this:

ccwatershed.org/liturgy/

out. TONS of free, very good stuff there, not only psalms. That CCWatershed site is a real goldmine. Also peruse www.musicasacra.com

I wish they would remove option 4 in the GIRM and then we wouldn’t have to have such discussions! I digress…
 
Greetings FrDavid96,

Thank you so much for that other feedback on the other two alternative hymnals. Yes I did want to steer away from the contemporary music as much as I could.

I do have a question, what would you recommend me using as for some psalm music. I want traditional sounding psalms. There’s a book called Respond and Acclaim but most of it sounds too contemprorary. I have taken to writing my own settings for the Psalms, of which the priest and the congregation approves, but I wanted to try to incorporate some other traditional arrangements of them.

Thanks about the Vatican II hymnal feedback on those psalms. I would like something that is easy for people to follow along with but not contemporary.

God Bless.
Anathama Sit
I was hoping that someone else on this forum could answer that same question for me.

I’m still looking for a good source for the Sunday Psalms set to music. So far, I’ve come up empty.

If I find anything, I’ll let you know; but chances are that if I do, it will be from reading posts here, so you’ll know as soon as I do.

The problem I have with the Vat II hymnal is not that the Psalms sound “contemporary.”

I have no musical abilities, so I have a hard time describing this.

Each line of the Psalm starts off just fine. But the ending of each line, instead of being an “expected” chant ending, it goes way off as something entirely un-expected. Someone described this to me as “dissonance.” I don’t know what that means, but I do know that it just doesn’t sound right. It just doesn’t sound like chant.
 
Honestly Fr., I’m not really sure if there exists any other English responsorial psalm music that would fit your needs. It’s either banal and contemporary, or it’s traditional, of which I only know the Chabanel psalms, which you don’t like. Anyone else? You might look in to using the graduals instead (perhaps?).

However, I must ask, why do you have to sing the resp. psalms yourself? Does not the organist or a cantor or even the choir do that?
 
Honestly Fr., I’m not really sure if there exists any other English responsorial psalm music that would fit your needs. It’s either banal and contemporary, or it’s traditional, of which I only know the Chabanel psalms, which you don’t like. Anyone else? You might look in to using the graduals instead (perhaps?).

However, I must ask, why do you have to sing the resp. psalms yourself? Does not the organist or a cantor or even the choir do that?
Yes, the choir does it.

It’s not just a matter of personally not liking them. The issue is that they just don’t sound like chant. They’re very difficult to sing. There is a certain natural flow to chant—one can do it without any reference to musical notes.

I remember back in the 70s our missallettes used to have all the psalms and antiphons. The whole congregation could chant them all based just on the printed words because there was a natural flow to them. They were always the same tune day to day.

Here’s an example
Introit Sun. Feb. 5
Come let us sing to the Lord
Let us make a joyful noise unto God our Savior

Without being able to read music, I can chant that immediately without even thinking about it.

Co----me let-us-sing TO the-Lord
Let-us-mak-a-joyful-noise-unto GOD our sa—vior

alternately:
Co—me let-us-sing-to THE Lord
(although the emphasis on “the” doesn’t make a lot of sense, so it gets moved to “to”)

I couldn’t write the musical notes if I wanted to, so bear with me here. It’s the best I can do to describe it. If you hand me ANY introit from any Mass, any Gospel acclamation, any antiphon, I can chant it immediately just like the above.

It comes out very naturally. It’s the second to last syllable of the first line that gets emphasis, and the 4th to last syllable in the last line. (at least I think so. I can do it easier than I can describe it).

Back in the 70s our missallettes had all the antiphons printed for every day (even weekdays). We never chanted the psalms (literally never).

Even as schoolchildren, we could chant every day’s antiphons based on nothing more than the written words and the fact that they were printed with some emphasis on that syllable that gets it (bold or all caps, I don’t recall, maybe it was underlined?). The whole congregation could do this quite easily and most of all, naturally.

That’s what I’m looking for today. All the psalms I can find use a musical form that is just “unexpected” All of them sound “forced.” It’s that dissonance I mentioned earlier. I don’t know what it means, but that’s how it’s described to me.

If you know an Eastern priest (Catholic or Orthodox won’t matter) ask him about this. He can chant any text–anything at all–without even thinking; because there’s a natural flow to chanting. You can hand him a book of the Gospels and he can chant it immediately. You can hand him a copy of whatever happens to be at the top of the best-seller list in fiction or economics and he can chant it without any thought. I’m not kidding here. Any text. Hand him a copy of Last of the Mohicans and say “in the first tone” and you’ll see what I mean.

That’s what I’m looking for. The kind of chant that is so natural that the whole congregation can just follow along without giving any thought to the actual mechanics of the music.

I only wish those psalms from the 70s (even though we didn’t use the psalms themselves) were available today–and according to the current lectionary (so much for finding an old printing). Alas, they’re not. I’ve already looked. The closest thing is what’s now being used in certain missallette printings, but those versions are “adapted” and they’ve replaced the natural ending with dissonance.

Much frustrated.
 
So are you looking for a hymnal that contains satisfactory responsorial psalms?
 
So are you looking for a hymnal that contains satisfactory responsorial psalms?
At the risk of derailing the thread…

Not necessarily. I’d be happy to find any source that has all the psalms of the year in an easy to learn, “natural sounding” chant form. The kind of thing that people can use the missallettes to read the words but just follow along with the chant without needing to have the notes (the cantor can do that alone).

I would rather not get parish hymnals that have the lectionary readings in them, because there’s too much possibility that the Lectionary will change. I want more “permanent” hymnals that we don’t have to think about replacing every few years, or that have lectionary readings that just “don’t apply anymore, so ignore the whole section.”
 
Greetings YoungTradCath,

Thank you so much for replying to my inquirires yesterday.

I am looking for Latin hymns too. I may have to just order one of these these just to look it over.

Oh and thanks for the other links. I am a member of musicsacra forums, it has been awhile since I have logged back in.

Okay option 4 in the GIRM have not read the new GIRM what is that?

And one more question, if you were to say what are the drawbacks of Vatican II hymanl what would they be? I just want a full picture, thanks.
God Bless.
Anathama Sit*
 
Greetings FrDavid96,

I sure would appreciate it if you do happen to run across anything.

I understood what you are describing and this makes sense to me. I had another question, have you heard of the gradual and do you use this? [Oh anyone else is welcome to chime in on this by the way.]

I was thinking maybe of doing the Psalms from the gradual since those do sound like what they are supposed to, but I had wondered if they had English versions of it or if everthing was still done in Latin. I don’t think it would be helpful to do the responsorial psalm in Latin for Masses as most of the Congregation does not understand it, even though they have expressed a desire and interest for more Latin in the services in regards to music, hence this having to look for a new hymnal, of which I am very glad to comply. 😃

God Bless.
Anathama Sit
 
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