Has science falsified macroevolution?

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This is a carryover from the “The 6000 year old earth” thread that has exceeded the 1,000 post limit.

Buffalo claimed that science has falsified part of macro-evolution. I am asking for his supporting documentation that macro-evolution has been falsified.

Peace

Tim
 
Yes, macro-evolution has been falsified by scientist for philosophical reasons. The 6,000 years theory has not much to do with macro-evolution and I am not even sure if its Biblical since days in God’s eyes is not the same as days in human’s eyes.

I agree with Dr. Jonathan Wells with regards to evolution. I spent many hours reading and watching debates about evolution and realized that scientist act like religious sects do and not like scientist are supposed to act.

Anyways there is much videos and lectures about this but my favorite is Jonathan Wells.

You can look it up in google video also. Johnathan Wells has some videos there and so do others who question evolution.

Harun Yahya also have some good videos and so do others. There is many questions regarding evolution that is not being revealed by scientist who are now telling us about dark matter and dark energy that comprises 95% of the universe. So what were they seeing all ths time? Its very hard to trust them because most of them are atheist or naturalist and have a religious dogma.
 
Yes, macro-evolution has been falsified by scientist for philosophical reasons.
Someone forgot to tell scientists!
I agree with Dr. Jonathan Wells with regards to evolution. I spent many hours reading and watching debates about evolution and realized that scientist act like religious sects do and not like scientist are supposed to act.
Why not spend many hours learning science rather than watching debates?
Harun Yahya also have some good videos and so do others. There is many questions regarding evolution that is not being revealed by scientist who are now telling us about dark matter and dark energy that comprises 95% of the universe. So what were they seeing all ths time? Its very hard to trust them because most of them are atheist or naturalist and have a religious dogma.
Actually, if you spent your time learning real science rather than listening to Jonathan Wells or Harun Yahya, you would know that neither of them are telling you the truth.

Peace

Tim
 
Found you - I said it has been partly falsified.

Here from TO:

Macroevolution

Its Definition, Philosophy and History



Falsifying macroevolution

Is macroevolution a testable hypothesis? Can it be falsified?
Antievolutionists try to make out that macroevolution is a tautology, the way they claim that natural selection is a tautology. The implication is that macroevolution cannot be tested and shown to be wrong, and therefore it is not science.
To clarify this, consider what it is that scientists test when they test a hypothesis. Let’s suppose that we are testing the idea that global warming is caused by a rise in CO2 in the atmosphere. There are two parts to this – one claim is that CO*2 causes the retention of solar and other heat, and the second is that this has happened in the past and is actually happening now. If you show that in a particular case global warming didn’t happen (say, in the period of the last interglacial), you haven’t thereby shown that CO2 doesn’t cause global warming, nor that it isn’t doing so now. All you have tested is a particular case.
We can test a particular claim of macroevolution. We can test, for example, if weasels are more closely related to red pandas than bears are (Flynn and Nedbal 1998, 2000et al.). This is a test of a particular evolutionary tree or scenario. It tests a historical reconstruction. If shown, on the basis of the evidence and the best data, to be wrong, then that history has indeed been falsified. But can we test the idea of common descent? It is not possible to show that something never occurred, but it is very easy to show that where it ought to occur, it either has or it hasn’t. Science will not retain a bad idea when it is shown repeatedly not to explain what we have a right to expect it to explain (this is one reason why creationism was dropped from science back in the 1850s). If macroevolution persistently were shown to run counter to the data, then science would drop it and look for another solution.

Moreover, science has to an extent falsified the initial conception of macroevolution. The original idea was that evolution formed only tree-like patterns – species split like branches. A growing consensus has argued that both hybridisation (species recombining) and lateral genetic transfer (genes crossing the taxonomic boundaries individually or as part of symbiotic organisms that are taken into the “host” taxon’s cellular machinery) are more common than we had previously thought. Macroevolution of species is still regarded as the most common way that the diversity of life has developed, but the “tree” now has “vines” that hang across the branches of single celled organisms (Fig. 4).
 
I’m not sure who you mean by “science.” “Science” is neither a person nor a group of people. “Science” isn’t capable of falsifying anything.

Individual people have certainly falsified purposely, or allowed to continue the teaching of disproven theories/experiements, for the purpose of advancing the theory of evolution.

A short list of either outright falsification or subsequently disproven theories are:

haeckel’s embryos
Miller-Urey experiment
peppered moths
homology in vertebrate limbs
Darwin’s tree of life
Darwin’s finches
four winged fruit flies

…and others

Note: The fact that some scientists have outright falsified data, and other previous experiments or theories have been disproven is not an indictment against the theory of evolution as a whole. It neither proves nor disproves anything beyond the fact that those individual items must be discarded from the discussion.
 
Found you - I said it has been partly falsified.
Ok, now can you tie all this together for this simple minded guy? How does the falsification of an initial concept equate to falsification of macro-evolution?

And keep in mind, you claim only partly. Macroevolution is a fact. How does it happen? That is what we are trying to work out.

Peace

Tim
 
I’m not sure who you mean by “science.” “Science” is neither a person nor a group of people. “Science” isn’t capable of falsifying anything.

Individual people have certainly falsified purposely, or allowed to continue the teaching of disproven theories/experiements, for the purpose of advancing the theory of evolution.

A short list of either outright falsification or subsequently disproven theories are:

haeckel’s embryos
Miller-Urey experiment
peppered moths
homology in vertebrate limbs
Darwin’s tree of life
Darwin’s finches
four winged fruit flies

…and others
That’s a good observation and any data can be interpreted differently depending on individual belief or view-point
 
I’m not sure who you mean by “science.” “Science” is neither a person nor a group of people. “Science” isn’t capable of falsifying anything.
Clearly. Now, if you are not sure what science is, why did you continue your answer? Heck, you sound like edwest2 when he argued that science doesn’t even exist and then went on arguing that science is wrong. Go figure.
Individual people have certainly falsified purposely, or allowed to continue the teaching of disproven theories/experiements, for the purpose of advancing the theory of evolution.
None of that falsifies macroevolution.
A short list of either outright falsification or subsequently disproven theories are:
None of those are theories and you are not correct that they are even wrong.

Peace

Tim
 
It’s not a fact.
Of course it is.
If it were a fact, how it happened would not be an unknown. Actually, it’s not even “how” that remains the question. “If” remains the question.
Really? How does gravity work? Is the existence of gravity in question?

Peace

Tim
 
Clearly. Now, if you are not sure what science is, why did you continue your answer?
I stated “science” can’t falsify anything, which is true. I then stated people can falsify data about scientifc theories, which is also true.

I don’t have to agree that “science” falsified anything in order to comment on the topic of people falsifying data.
Heck, you sound like edwest2 when he argued that science doesn’t even exist and then went on arguing that science is wrong.
I sound just like Ed, except for the part where I have said neither of these things.
None of that falsifies macroevolution.
I never said that it did. In fact, I specifically said it did not.
None of those are theories and you are not correct that they are even wrong.
Yes, I am correct that they have been displaced by further evdience and advances in science (haeckel’s embryos, for example) or outright falsified (peppered moths, for example).
 
Because for evolution to occur(macro-evolution) new info would need to be added to the DNA structure and that is impossible.

I used to believe in it although I did not know what it was. But then i realize it was a religion and not science. It relies on time being able to achieve the impossible. They us catch phrases but all they have is simpler organisms appear before more complex ones. So what, even the Bible says that. They then connected the species together based on similar genes. Species that look similar tend to have similar genes, so what. The question is how can a species to evolve to another species. Even if it takes time, it need a way to acquire new info in its DNA and thats impossible. I then focussed on the fossil recirds and found that there are no transitional speacies. There are species that look transitional but they themselves suddenly emerged. All species suddenly emerge in the world. There is no gradual, slow and tedious change that we can see. They just appear more complex than the previous species that emerged. Darwinist connected the dots. To connect the dots is big business.

Plus scientist can not even explain how life can emerge in the first place. The probability of that happening from some proteins and amino acids is astronomical. There is not even enough space in the universe for a chance like this. Let alone for the process to continue. But scientist believe in this because the alternative is special creation and they can’t believe that.

We were raised to view science as hard facts. But now I know anybody who talks about creation and life on Earth has an agenda like anybody else. You have to rely on yourself for knowing who you are and where you came from and where you are going. No science lab will provide you that answer. Scientist are human beings and most top biologist are atheist. Atheism is a religious conviction. Thats why they won’t allow an open debate about evolution because the deception will be exposed.

But you live and learn. 👍
 
Yes, I am correct that they have been displaced by further evdience and advances in science (haeckel’s embryos, for example) or outright falsified (peppered moths, for example).
I am familiar with Well’s “Icons of Evolution”. Most of what he wrote was wrong.

talkorigins.org/faqs/wells/iconob.html

I’m curious about your reply. Do you agree with buffalo that science (or scientists, if that is more comfortable) has falsified at least part of macroevolution?

Peace

Tim
 
Because for evolution to occur(macro-evolution) new info would need to be added to the DNA structure and that is impossible.
Ok, now it is time to start spending time learning science rather than listening to a debate. I’m going to be giving you links to sites that explain the science that refutes Well’s claims. Please take some time reading them.
talkorigins.org/indexcc/CB/CB102.html
I used to believe in it although I did not know what it was. But then i realize it was a religion and not science.
talkorigins.org/indexcc/CA/CA610.html
It relies on time being able to achieve the impossible.
Actually, even time cannot achieve the impossible, so this is kind of a silly argument, isn’t it?
They us catch phrases but all they have is simpler organisms appear before more complex ones. So what, even the Bible says that.
Those “catch phrases” are scientific terminology.
They then connected the species together based on similar genes. Species that look similar tend to have similar genes, so what. The question is how can a species to evolve to another species.
Exactly! That is what science is working on.
I then focussed on the fossil recirds and found that there are no transitional speacies. There are species that look transitional but they themselves suddenly emerged. All species suddenly emerge in the world. There is no gradual, slow and tedious change that we can see. They just appear more complex than the previous species that emerged. Darwinist connected the dots. To connect the dots is big business.
Ah, the big “no transitional fossil” lie. Tell me, what would you expect to find in a transitional fossil? I’m willing to bet that I get an answer that doesn’t have a scientific basis. I say this because you have learned your arguments from Wells, et al.

talkorigins.org/faqs/faq-transitional.html
Plus scientist can not even explain how life can emerge in the first place. The probability of that happening from some proteins and amino acids is astronomical. There is not even enough space in the universe for a chance like this. Let alone for the process to continue. But scientist believe in this because the alternative is special creation and they can’t believe that.
Would is surprise you to know that how life began is irrelevant to evolution? Do you know why?
We were raised to view science as hard facts. But now I know anybody who talks about creation and life on Earth has an agenda like anybody else.
Including Wells and friends?
You have to rely on yourself for knowing who you are and where you came from and where you are going. No science lab will provide you that answer. Scientist are human beings and most top biologist are atheist. Atheism is a religious conviction. Thats why they won’t allow an open debate about evolution because the deception will be exposed.
Evolution is open for debate. All one has to have is scientific data (evidence) to support their position. That is why Wells et al are not engaged in scientific debate but are relegated to writing popular books.

Peace

Tim
 
I am familiar with Well’s “Icons of Evolution”. Most of what he wrote was wrong.

talkorigins.org/faqs/wells/iconob.html

I’m curious about your reply. Do you agree with buffalo that science (or scientists, if that is more comfortable) has falsified at least part of macroevolution?

Peace

Tim
Ok, Tim (I still laugh when I think of the “debil” comment you made in a previous thread), I believe in the theory of evolution, but I’m trying to sort out in my mind whether or not “natural selection” is true? Can you explain what in essence it means and whether we have proof of this “natural selection” process? Is this a confirmed part of macro-evolution? How much evidence do we have for macro evolution? These questions may sound silly, so sorry in advance.
 
I stated “science” can’t falsify anything, which is true. I then stated people can falsify data about scientifc theories, which is also true.

I don’t have to agree that “science” falsified anything in order to comment on the topic of people falsifying data.
I’m not sure what you mean, it seems to me you have misunderstood the definition of falsify in regards to science.
 
Because for evolution to occur(macro-evolution) new info would need to be added to the DNA structure and that is impossible.
Except for mutation; however, mutation is generally destructive or neutral in nature. Micro-evolution is proven, but macro-evolution remains a highly-favoured theory only. even if I believed in macro-evolution, I would have to say there’s no way I believe the proposterous theory that man came from apes.
 
Ok, Tim (I still laugh when I think of the “debil” comment you made in a previous thread), I believe in the theory of evolution, but I’m trying to sort out in my mind whether or not “natural selection” is true? Can you explain what in essence it means and whether we have proof of this “natural selection” process? Is this a confirmed part of macro-evolution? How much evidence do we have for macro evolution? These questions may sound silly, so sorry in advance.
Macro evolution IS evolution.

Natural section basically states that those individuals best suited to survive until reproduction, will do just that. They will survive until reproduction and pass on their genes. The trails they possess that enabled them to survive are then handed down to the next generation and retained in the gene pool.

Natural section is as proven as anything can be, as is evolution. Evolution is a FACT. There people on this forum that deny it amuse me. They clearly know nothing about the subject, yet they are happy to deny evolution based on nothing but ignorance.
 
Except for mutation; however, mutation is generally destructive or neutral in nature. Micro-evolution is proven, but macro-evolution remains a highly-favoured theory only. even if I believed in macro-evolution, I would have to say there’s no way I believe the proposterous theory that man came from apes.
Oh dear. I’m going to go out on a limb here and guess you don’t have much of an education when it comes to biology???
 
Macro evolution IS evolution.

Natural section basically states that those individuals best suited to survive until reproduction, will do just that. They will survive until reproduction and pass on their genes. The trails they possess that enabled them to survive are then handed down to the next generation and retained in the gene pool.

Natural section is as proven as anything can be, as is evolution. Evolution is a FACT. There people on this forum that deny it amuse me. They clearly know nothing about the subject, yet they are happy to deny evolution based on nothing but ignorance.
Adaptation (micro-evolution) is observed and accepted. Speciation also occurs by adaptation and isolation.
 
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