Have we forgotten fatima?

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The Pope himself after the consecration to the world in 84’ prayed in front of the statue of Our Lady of Fatima and said these words, “Enlighten especially those of which You, are awaiting our consecration and our confiding!” (taken from L’osservatore Romano news paper) Sounds to me like he knew this was not the complete consecration!
The Consecration of Russia is supposed to be a colligial consecration, with ALL Bishops of the world not just those who wished to join. AND Most of all, Russia was spesifically NOT mentioned in this consecration because some were afraid to offend Russia. I believe we have not been given the full 3rd secret, we have the vision of the secret but not the words Our Lady told the Lucia explaining the vision.
Just my opinion
CCMom4
 
Lets throw a spanner into the works of this topic.

Fatima and other apparitions are examples of pious fraud.
To believe in them in my opinion seriously distracts from
the development of a genuine spiritual journey through the faith.
It is also potentially dangerous to believe in nonsense.

I invite you to do your own research.Here are some links to get you started. Enjoy.
skepdic.com/piousfraud.html

sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/chronicle/archive/2000/06/27/MN7921.DTL

skepdic.com/refuge/funk13.html#fatima
 
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SueG:
I wish the priests would teach the people what the visions revealed: that we must pray the rosary daily, attend First Saturdays, go to confession often, and do penance.
I wish they would teach our children this.
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:confused:

I hate to ask this very basic question after all of the scholarly debate but…what are “First Saturdays”?

Thanks!
 
I hate to ask this very basic question after all of the scholarly debate but…what are “First Saturdays”?
Thanks!
[/quote]

Here is a good web page that summarizes what the First Five Saturday devotion is and why we have been ask to do it.

nd.edu/~mary/firstsat.html

If you search the web you can find many other sites that go into more detail.

I performed this devotion for the first time this year and during that time Our Lady truly help me incredibly. I can not encourage you enough to perform this devotion for Our Lady.

If you do perform this devotion there are two things you need to know; first you must state that your intentions are too make reparation to the Immaculate Heart at confession, and second if you can not receive Holy Communion on Saturday you must ask the priest at confession for permission to receive Holy Communion on Sunday, and you need to have a legitimate reason.
 
:love: God really loves us…

Amazing side-note. Just before the assassination attempt on JPII in 1981, the pope caught sight of a girl off to his side wearing a Fatima tee-shirt with Mary on it…the pope was turning slightly to look at the shirt as he was shot with the bullet barely failing to cause fatal injuries. This is one reason why the pope credits Mary for saving him during this incident…esp. since the third secret of Fatima (if I remember correctly) detailed a pope being shot.

God works in mysterious ways:thumbsup: praise God that 23 years later the John Paul II is still with us
 
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Adam:
Can someone please recommend me a good book on Fatima?.
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Two classics books have already been mentioned, Fatima The Great Sign by Francis Johnston, and Our Lady Of Fatima by William Thomas Walsh. I would add to these, The Sun Danced at Fatima, by Joseph A. Pelletier, A.A.

The book mentioned in post # 40 looks good, but I haven’t read it. I would NOT recommend “The Whole truth About Fatima” by Michel de la Sainte Trinite.
 
I’ll second Br. Dan’s recommendation of Calls. Sr. Lucia has a profound command of Scripture, and of course is a wonderful resource on Mary’s message through the Fatima apparitions! In the book, Sr. Lucia shows us how to follow the “calls” of the message.
 
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Hananiah:
First, that the Holy Father can be wrong on this matter is evident in the fact that previous Popes have tried to fulfill Our Lady’s requests yet failed. Second, the Fatima Seer herself has given contradictory testimony on this matter. Between 1984-1989 she stated 5 times that the consecration was not fulfilled because Russia was not mentioned by name. She has since said three times that the consecration was fulfilled. Which is it? Third, I challenge you to find anything bordering on schismatic in Sungenis’ writings. He assosiates with people whom I would consider quasi-schismatic, I will grant you that much, but he himself is not. Fourth, that he is a geocentrist has no bearing on the issue at hand. That is simply ad homenim. Try to deal with his arguments on their merits.
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Me thinks your reading the wrong reports.
 
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Matt16_18:
Two classics books have already been mentioned, Fatima The Great Sign by Francis Johnston, and Our Lady Of Fatima by William Thomas Walsh. I would add to these, The Sun Danced at Fatima, by Joseph A. Pelletier, A.A.

The book mentioned in post # 40 looks good, but I haven’t read it. I would NOT recommend “The Whole truth About Fatima” by Michel de la Sainte Trinite.
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How about “FATIMA” in Lucia’s own words" It is her Memoris.
 
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quasimodo:
We must be careful to remember that Fatima is only private revelation not Public Revelation. It is worthy of belief nothing more. Belief in it has no bearing on Salvation.
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I don’t believe God would send the Mother of His Son, who died for our Salvation, to Earth with such an important message, just so we could brush it aside and say it has no bearing on Salvation… EVERYTHING God does for us has bearing on our Salvation. The Church has declared it “Worthy of Belief” and I think we are FOOLS if we don’t learn all we can about the TRUTH of the Fatima Message.
 
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EUSTACHIUS:
This is not true after Our Lady of Guadalupe appeared to Juan Diego there was a mass conversion.

“The conversion of Mexico from devil-worship to the Catholic Faith is the most sudden and spectacular mass conversion in all of history. In Aztec Mexico, before the arrival of Hernan Cortes and the Spanish, human sacrifice was practiced on a far greater scale than anywhere else in history. Hundreds of victims were slaughtered every day. Cortes’ conquest, against odds of ten thousand to one, ended the human sacrifice, but over the next ten years only a small part of the the Mexican people accepted Christianity. But after Our Lady of Guadalupe appeared to Blessed Juan Diego and left her portrait with him, still miraculously preserved in Mexico, nine million Mexicans were baptized in the next twenty years. Mexico became and has remained a Catholic country.”

See reference:
straphael.net/pl/pages/community/articles/details.html?ra=1;id=119

Russia has had twenty years and there is nothing like that going on over there.

The Communion of Reparation is needed! We all have to do are part!
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Read, “Our Lady of Guadalupe, Conquest of Darkness”, by Warren Carroll. It is a real eye opener. The first part is a bit difficult because of the names of the cities and their evil gods but once you get thru that, you won’t be able to put it down. He also has a great book on Fatima called “White Mantle, Red Banner”, that is so very interesting.
 
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Hananiah:
None that I know of, but the relevant section from Sungenis’ essay is fairly short.
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Very few and I do mean VERY FEW have ever been able to talk to Sr. Lucy, (she is cloistered) and then only with the permission of the POPE and her Bishop.
 
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Adam:
Can someone please recommend me a good book on Fatima?.
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Adam, go to www.fatimafamily.org. This is the website of the Fatima Family Apostolate run by Fr. Robert J. Fox. Fr. Fox has devoted his life to spreading the message of Fatima. You will find books, etc., there–all very good and orthodox. (You may have seen him on EWTN). There is a little pamphlet called, “First Saturdays” that will explain Our Lady’s request for First Saturday devotions. Not everyone has forgotten! My children and I have been keeping this devotion for years. Only one church in our area even has Mass on Saturday morning. It’s not too late to start! I especially like the book, “Fatima, The Great Sign”, mentioned above. A very interesting point is that the secular press showed up on the day of the Miracle of the Sun expecting to debunk the seers and were very surprised when they witnessed the Miracle of the Sun and reported it in the secular papers. Fr. Fox has a new book out that may also interest you called, Messages from the Heart of Your Mother. It is available at the same website–check it out!
 
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BobCatholic:
Or a schismatic seKKKt whose followers worship the mirror? 🙂
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My goodness, this discussion certainly does bring out the worst in some people, doesn’t it?

Myself, I’ve found it very interesting and informative.
 
Yes I have. I have written a letter to my son’s principal about saying a rosary as a school. I told her that the children can lead the way,but we have to show them and inform them of the power of not only the rosary but of prayer and what it can do to strength the family and the world. I also suggested that when we figure what we are going to do lets get the other schools involved. I believe that we gain strength in numbers and that the children are more favored my the Blessed Mother so we need to start there. My hopes would be that the kids will go home and say to mom or dad should’nt we be saying a rosary. I do usually say the rosary every morning on my way to work, but I will be starting to get the family to participate. I did mention to sister that that was what the Blessed Mother was trying to say at Fatima, so no I haven’t forgotten.

God Bless
Kathy
 
robin hood:
Adam,
My favourite book on Fatima is ‘Fatima the great sign’ by Francis Johnston. Clear and very readable, available from Tan books.
God bless/QUOTE

Any book by Fr. Robet J. Fox is excellent, but his book “Fatima Today” is great and for young people he has one titled “Catholic Truth for Youth”, which is based on the Teachings of the church and how Fatima is a reaffirmation of the gospels. I used it when I taught High School CCD.
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Sue G, you asked why priests don’t speak out about abortion, don’t tell people about sin etc Maybe they are scared they will be sued if they ‘traumatize’ someone. A priest here in Australia was sued by a man who said that his son comitted suicide a couple of days after hearing the prests’s sermon. The priest had to take a transcript of his sermon into court to prove that he said nothing which would have tipped this unstable young man over the edge. :mad:

Our priest said that he can’t say anything to ‘offend’ people who come late to Mass, Sunday after Sunday after Sunday because he doesn’t want to be ‘judgemental’. :mad:
 
They speculate that, inasmuch as the errors spread by Russia were in the form of communism, it is possible that the message meant conversion away from communism

This is exactly the subject of my research. What did Our Lady mean by the errors of Russia??? I must admit, when I was much younger, I did not believe this. Other than the nuclear bomb thing, how could such a backward country spread any errors to us in the North American way? Well, I have matured a little since:eek: , and providentially I have been lead into reading books that just ‘pop’ up. One of them is ‘The Occult in Soviet and Russian Culture’. This book is written by a number of philosophers, Jewish and non-Jewish (but no Catholics that I can perceive) about the occult in the late nineteenth and early twentieth centuries…mmmm…just about when our Lady appeared to the Lucy and her cousins. It is written so objectively that there is no bias, christian or otherwise. One of the authors is my friend and i mentioned to her that Our Lady said that these errors would spread to the rest o fthe world. She commented that I thought a lot like Vladimir Soloviev! This was a great eye-opener. I do not pretend to be a philosopher, but Our Lady had a real reason to be concerned. And there is still a great concern. The errors have already been spread…:crying:

Communism on the surface seems to be ‘eradicated’ but it is far from not being able of spreading its errors. Abortion, women being mandated to work, day care subsidized by government to raise the children, feminism, materialism, secularism, New Age, and so many other ‘isms’.

I know Catherine Doherty (she has been declared a Servant of God). She has passed away but she was a refugee of the Bolshevic war. She landed in Canada and was asked by Archbishop McNeil from Toronto to write about the communistic activities in said city and she almost lost her life talking against bolshevism. But she continued her mandate in obedience to the bishop and this, in Toronto, Ontario, Canada! Go figure! And in her case, yes, it was about the late 1920’s and early 1930’s. In that same time span. Interesting…:hmmm:

Anyway, my research continues…
Hail Mary, so full of grace…:bowdown:

Blessings,
Shoshana
 
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Shoshana:
They speculate that, inasmuch as the errors spread by Russia were in the form of communism, it is possible that the message meant conversion away from communism

This is exactly the subject of my research. What did Our Lady mean by the errors of Russia??? I must admit, when I was much younger, I did not believe this. Other than the nuclear bomb thing, how could such a backward country spread any errors to us in the North American way? Well, I have matured a little since:eek: , and providentially I have been lead into reading books that just ‘pop’ up. One of them is ‘The Occult in Soviet and Russian Culture’. This book is written by a number of philosophers, Jewish and non-Jewish (but no Catholics that I can perceive) about the occult in the late nineteenth and early twentieth centuries…mmmm…just about when our Lady appeared to the Lucy and her cousins. It is written so objectively that there is no bias, christian or otherwise. One of the authors is my friend and i mentioned to her that Our Lady said that these errors would spread to the rest o fthe world. She commented that I thought a lot like Vladimir Soloviev! This was a great eye-opener. I do not pretend to be a philosopher, but Our Lady had a real reason to be concerned. And there is still a great concern. The errors have already been spread…:crying:

Communism on the surface seems to be ‘eradicated’ but it is far from not being able of spreading its errors. Abortion, women being mandated to work, day care subsidized by government to raise the children, feminism, materialism, secularism, New Age, and so many other ‘isms’.

I know Catherine Doherty (she has been declared a Servant of God). She has passed away but she was a refugee of the Bolshevic war. She landed in Canada and was asked by Archbishop McNeil from Toronto to write about the communistic activities in said city and she almost lost her life talking against bolshevism. But she continued her mandate in obedience to the bishop and this, in Toronto, Ontario, Canada! Go figure! And in her case, yes, it was about the late 1920’s and early 1930’s. In that same time span. Interesting…:hmmm:

Anyway, my research continues…
Hail Mary, so full of grace…:bowdown:

Blessings,
Shoshana
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Russia has spread her errors all over the world, look how country after country seems to have lost its faith in God. Right here in America we have become soooo secularistic we’ve almost shoved God out of our lives. And only 200 years ago (Short span of history) we were founded on very strong Christian principals. We are in a Post Christian era and should be know better. I think we are worse off than the pre-Christian era and will be held responsible for whatever happens to the human race. I don’t know what the future will bring but I do know we will NEVER be able to say that God did not try to warn us and help us. Our Lady of Fatima did that. Just about everything she said has come true except the Third and even greater war and that may be the War on Terrorism we are in right now. And this war is more terrifing than any other we have ever faced if we really stop and think about it. I think we are to comfortable with our heads in the sand.
 
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