Have your arm relaxing on pew inside the church?

[chicago]

Where is Sister Mary Whackamole with her ruler when you need her?

Some people just like everything at Church to be extremely formal and disciplined. Any variance is something which disturbs them. Now, kindly fold your hands, children, keep them placed nicely on your desk, and look straight forward.

(But, really, doesn’t anyone understand that your arm is not supposed to be draped on the pew, afterall? No, it should be at the back on the pew in front of you, playing with the hat hanger pin, where it belongs!)

 

[water]

Some people just like everything at Church to be extremely formal and disciplined.

Some folks automatically think that just because someone asks a question here, they think it is bothering him so much.

Not all the time is like that, it is an awareness that we should be reminded that we are in the church - in front of God.

How can one act in front of a president, a king?
At least do something better in front of the King of the Universe.

**This forum, Liturgy and Sacraments , is NOT for me. ** :tiphat:

Thanks for all of your replies.

 

[chicago]

I’ve seen young guys and old guys do the same. Just like they are sitting on the sofa – relaxing.

Well, what is wrong with relaxing in the Lord’s presence. If one feels at home in the Church and with God, it is probably a good thing!

 

[lak611]

Thank you, estesbod and rayne89. You both seem like voices of reason and balance.

I have met so many wonderful Catholic Christians over the years. One of the main reasons why I was willing to even study the Catholic Church is the because of the Christian love that I saw in these Catholics.

And since 2001, when I first started attending Mass and studying the Catholic Church, I have met hundreds of wonderful, friendly Catholics who have literally loved me into the Church.

There is an elderly couple in our parish who I give the credit to for my “final decision” to become Catholic. These dear people “chat” before and after Mass (except when she is acting as an extraordinary Eucharistic minister and delivering Holy Communion to the sick). They even laugh out loud before Mass. They are physically affectionate, but not excessively so (they’re in their 70s at least!).

And several times before I made the decision to become Catholic, they acted kindly towards me and my husband and greeted us like old friends and treated us like pals.

I was so overwhelmed by their lovingkindness–a stark contrast to the “ousting” that we had received at our Protestant church–that I started sobbing one day during Mass. (I suppose that was distracting to someone, or irreverent?)

Like I said, I was literally “loved” into the Church by so many loving people.

So when I come here, I am a little taken aback by what I see as a “lack of love.” Sometimes, people present the argument that “it IS loving to correct people.” Well, I agree, if wrong is truly being perpetrated. But putting an arm across the back of a pew?!

I have heard often that our diocese is one of the most conservative, orthodox, and well-run dioceses in the U.S. We actually have a surplus of vocations, so our Bishop is definitely doing something right!

I feel that I have been well-catechized by knowledgeable Catholics and priests. I have not been led astray by “liberals.” If something needed to be taught (e.g., not putting my arm across the back of the pew), I think my teachers and priests would have mentioned it, right?

Anyway, thanks again for kind, sensible Catholic words.

As for others, well, I’m trying very hard to appreciate your rather rigid point of view. But I have to agree with those who have said that if you are truly focusing completely on Jesus during the Holy Mass, you will never even notice what others around you are doing or not doing. I am just a new Catholic, and I can honestly say that often I will leave Mass with no memory of anyone other than Jesus Christ in the most Holy Sacrament of the Altar.

I have read several bios of saints who prayed in the most horrible circumstances. They saw Jesus in the midst of the circumstances. I want to be like them, undistracted by my surroundings. But in order for me to learn how to not be distracted, I have to be in a place where there are distractions so that the Lord can teach me how to concentrate solely on Him. A silent place will not help me to get stronger. **Has it ever occurred to you that maybe all the distractions in your Mass are the “teaching tools” that our Lord is providing to help you learn to concentrate solely on Him? ** Thank You, Lord, for all the distractions in my parish’s Mass! Teach me to draw close to You in the midst of all the human distractions that occur in Mass and in my daily life.

Cat, I agree with you. I have better things to do during Mass than to look at what other people are doing and how they are sitting. I choose to pray and think about our Lord.

 

[chicago]

Not all the time is like that, it is an awareness that we should be reminded that we are in the church - in front of God.

How can one act in front of a president, a king?
At least do something better in front of the King of the Universe.

That is fine as one way of looking at things. But let’s say that you know the president or king personally. You are his friend. You feel quite comfortable coming and being with him. Must you act very formally and stiffly structured? Or is it alright to be at ease, enjoying and taking in the conversation, offering him your sincere attentiveness and devotion as such?

**This forum, Liturgy and Sacraments , is NOT for me. ** :tiphat:

I think a LOT of people here think that!

 

[Walking_Home]

That is fine as one way of looking at things. But let’s say that you know the president or king personally. You are his friend. You feel quite comfortable coming and being with him. Must you act very formally and stiffly structured? Or is it alright to be at ease, enjoying and taking in the conversation, offering him your sincere attentiveness and devotion as such?

I think a LOT of people here think that!

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Those who have fallen into low Christology—would see it that way.

 

[water]

I think a LOT of people here think that!

Thanks for confirming that.

I humbly exist this forum.

 

[water]

I guess this is just another way of having God bend His knee instead of ours.

Thanks for your reply. :tiphat:

 

[chicago]

Thanks for confirming that.

I humbly exist this forum.

I must make sure I am being clear in my mention. It was not directed at your belonging in this forum or not, but merely noting humorously that a lot of people tend to feel as you do about this forum being a rough spot which causes a fair amount of disconsternation in it’s extremes. In other words, you’re not alone in finding it an uncomfortable place. Even among those who hang out here regularly, I think most of us have experienced a similar feeling. We can identify with your sentiments, then, is what I meant to say.

 

[water]

I must make sure I am being clear in my mention. It was not directed at your belonging in this forum or not, but merely noting humorously that a lot of people tend to feel as you do about this forum being a rough spot which causes a fair amount of disconsternation in it’s extremes. In other words, you’re not alone in finding it an uncomfortable place. Even among those who hang out here regularly, I think most of us have experienced a similar feeling. We can identify with your sentiments, then, is what I meant to say.

Thank you, Chicago. Your explanation also helps others who might be reading our replies. It certainly helps me.

Regarding your reply “If one feels at home in the Church and with God, it is probably a good thing!”

Yes, it is a good thing, but one should not turn God’s home into his other home. Two homes are quite different places.

When I was younger and most of the time surrounded by Religious Sisters and Brothers at mass, I learn a lot from them what to be like inside a church. They are the ones who have so much deep love for the Lord and others, and I had never seen one being relaxing the way we discuss here. (Of course, I have come to learn that some have disability problem and I “try” to understand it.).

 

[chicago]

---

Those who have fallen into low Christology—would see it that way.

Perhaps this is true. However, I don’t necessarily think that one must have fallen into a low Christology in order to take such a position. One can fully understand Christ’s divine lordship and come to Mass for the purpose of his worship and sharing in his sacrifice and still feel very much comfortable and at home with him. It is not a requirement to insist upon formality in presentation in order to accomplish both effectively.

 

[THutch04]

I’ve never actually seen anyone doing that. The only way I would even notice it would be if somebody next to me started doing it, and then I would have a problem just because I don’t like close contact with people. I don’t know if I think it’s really wrong. I mean I don’t do it just because for me it would be being lazy, but in my opinion there are more important things to worry about.

 

[Walking_Home]

Originally Posted by Walking_Home​

Those who have fallen into low Christology—would see it that way.

Perhaps this is true. However, I don’t necessarily think that one must have fallen into a low Christology in order to take such a position. One can fully understand Christ’s divine lordship and come to Mass for the purpose of his worship and sharing in his sacrifice and still feel very much comfortable and at home with him. It is not a requirement to insist upon formality in presentation in order to accomplish both effectively.

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Symptoms of low Christology —are usually reflected in this manner.

 

[water]

but in my opinion there are more important things to worry about.

many times, one can accomplish things by doing little things first. Over time, all these little things become very important.

Sometimes, one focuses on big thing and ends up accomplishing nothing.

 

[anniemart]

many times, one can accomplish things by doing little things first. Over time, all these little things become very important.

Sometimes, one focuses on big thing and ends up accomplishing nothing.

wow…this profound! these words truly move me.

I immediately thought of Jesus as he walked the earth for you and me—speaking to groups large and small, and at times; to just one person. But never once did he think that just one was less important than the other. Every word we speak in His name, every action we take in His name, and every thought we have in His name matters to Him. How Blessed we are.

 

[chicago]

Regarding your reply “If one feels at home in the Church and with God, it is probably a good thing!”

Yes, it is a good thing, but one should not turn God’s home into his other home. Two homes are quite different places.

Since the Church is both God’s home and the home of all Catholics (and in some extended sense all people), however, who determines what is allowed and not? Obviously, nothing vile or seriously inappropriate should be allowed. But when it comes to mere preference or personal differences, I think that we may need to offer some greater openness in expression.

When I was younger and most of the time surrounded by Religious Sisters and Brothers at mass, I learn a lot from them what to be like inside a church. They are the ones who have so much deep love for the Lord and others, and I had never seen one being relaxing the way we discuss here. (Of course, I have come to learn that some have disability problem and I “try” to understand it.).

I’m certain that the sisters and priests were devout and well intentioned. However, that does not make everything that they taught as far as practice absolutely right or the only correct way of doing things. Plus, remember, that they were trying to keep children disciplined. So teaching certain particular methods as standard practice helped to foster this. Now that isn’t to say that someone shouldn’t follow what they were taight by them, but only that it need not necessarily be so. Indeed, sometimes the things they suggested were clearly a bit overboard. For example, a lot of sisters insisted that you not chew the host as they considered it disrespectful to Jesus. There are people who, as adults, are hounded by the thought of what was communicated to them as such a terrible thing. And yet, there is certainly nothing wrong with chewing the host. It might even be considered the preferable way of communicating.

 

[maryjk]

I’ve never actually seen anyone doing that.

Nor have I. I have seen people put one arm back. Normally it is around another person. I tend to do this with my son while we listen to the homily.

But I have never seen someone put both arms back. Maybe our church is too crowded for that.

 

[chicago]

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Symptoms of low Christology —are usually reflected in this manner.

Again, this is true. But, again, it does not necessarily symptomatically indicate a low Christology.

May I ask what is wrong with an expression of feeling comfortable or at home with the Lord in His house?

Further, one must note that sometimes body language and all can be misread. What one intends (or communicates without realizing it) is not necessarily what another reads and imputes.

 

[po18guy]

yah, thanks. That’s what I was referring too.
yes, it is rude.

Well, it’s better than maintaining the same posture in a bar or strip joint!

Yeah, yeah, I know.

Sit upright, as you did in class. The teacher is teaching, and the Principal’s punishment eternal!

 

[puzzleannie]

oh I hope I don’t see anyone raise their legs up on the front pew.

you must not get out much, the folks who do this are also, for some reason, the same ones who wear flip-flops