Have your arm relaxing on pew inside the church?

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I was wondering why some people like to rest the long arms on top of the pew and never think that it is just not right.
 
not sure why you assume it is not right, or what posture you are referring to, if it assists some people to kneel to rely on the pew in front for support, how does that bother anyone else?
 
From another thread by another poster, but some consider that extremely rude. Reading the explanation offered in the post, I think I would now agree.
anniemart said:
just got through reading all these posts.

My belief is that the only intimacy one should have at mass must be with God. Gestures of kindness in helping those with physical problems are not to be included. Besides, I’ve always understood intimacy to equal some degree of privacy.

Now here’s a genuine thought to ponder (* I ask is that you have respect for the source) *Our priest told my husband this past Christmas that it irriates him when he looks out and sees people “relaxing” on another’s body. Barring the young child, he stated that he sees it as a sign of disrespect. It also makes him think that no one is really paying attention. *Please don’t blur through the rest of this post…*He then added that what really gets his goose is when he sees men resting their arm(s) over the pew as if at home watching television.

Would you like to know how this topic came up? He called my husband out for doing just that. (resting his arm across the pew; not on my shoulder, back, etc.) My husband was taken aback but apologized. Did we get mad? Did we accuse him of judging our behaviour? did we think “what about everyone else?” NO.

Sometimes it’s the harder thing to do to take a little criticism and not make it less important that your reaction to it. Hence, keep your reaction from becoming the message.

By the way, our priest said he wasn’t angry but that he knows he isn’t alone in this thought and that many of his fellow brothers of the cloth wish they could see a lot more reverance at mass in posture and behavior…did this experience change my viewpoint, posture, behavior? You bet it did. And I’m glad too. 🙂

maybe you can take an informal poll this weekend with your parish priest and come back and post the replies? I’d be willing to read them? 😉
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I like to sit on the end of pew so I can drape my arm over the end. I don’t think it really matter though.
 
My shoulders often hurt. They always have, even when I was young, thin, and strong. I hate riding in planes, buses, train seats, and small cars for that reason, and I really hate sitting in small theater seats–keeping my arms in front of me and my hands in my lap for more than a few minutes really HURTS me.

So I often sit with my arm draped across the back of a seat. I will switch arms.

Until I saw that post, I never dreamed that anyone would find it offensive in the Mass. I still can’t believe it. I’m just floored.

Do you all actually think this “posture” is somehow disrespectful to the Lord? Why? What is the correct “reverent” position for Mass? And please post your documentation for stating that this “reverent position” is the only correct position?

I am a human being with a human body. No apologies. God made me this way.

Through His Church, the Catholic Church, He asks me to mortify my flesh only a few times a year by fasting and abstaining (mainly during Lent). Other than that, I was not aware that God requires me to mortify my flesh by deliberately making myself physically uncomfortable or causing myself pain during Mass.

Some of you are distracted by such things as a husband and wife cuddling, teenagers in revealing clothing, men in walking shorts, women in sandals, people clapping, people holding hands during the Our Father, people raising their hands during a hymn, people receiving Holy Communion on the hand instead of the tongue, etc., etc., etc., etc., etc., etc., etc.

Would it be OK for me to say that I am distracted by the various aches and pains and noises and quirks in my own frail body?

Often my foot hurts, although it’s better since the surgery. I often have stomach pains, since I don’t tolerate veges well. As I said above, my shoulders hurt if they are cramped up in the same position for a long time. And even though I’m on meds for it, sometimes I have a very over-active bladder that makes it almost impossible for me to concentrate on the Mass. Often I’m hot–I’m always hot, even in the winter.

If I am truly in great pain or ill, I stay home from Mass (which is allowed).

Otherwise, I try not to let my body distract me too much from Mass, and I usually ask the Lord to please help me to concentrate on Him rather than my body. Maybe this prayer method would help some of you who are easily distracted during Mass.
 
Cat said:
Until I saw that post, I never dreamed that anyone would find it offensive in the Mass. I still can’t believe it. I’m just floored.
.

.
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I wouldn’t worry about it. Some people are offended just by just about anything. In fact when you read CAF you wonder sometimes if people are so busy looking around the church to see what people are doing wrong that they forget why they’re there!
 
estesbob said:
I wouldn’t worry about it. Some people are offended just by just about anything. In fact when you read CAF you wonder sometimes if people are so busy looking around the church to see what people are doing wrong that they forget why they’re there!
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My thoughts exactly! I’m sorry but some of these posts lately sound like a bunch nitpicking ninnies. I honestly am starting to believe some people go to Mass looking for something to be offended by. If the Holy Mass is supposed to get our full and reverent attention how is that so many “reverent” Mass goers are able to take notice of every little thing around them?
Jesus Christ is fully present at Mass, focus on our Lord and stop looking around.:mad:
 
Cat said:
My shoulders often hurt. They always have, even when I was young, thin, and strong. I hate riding in planes, buses, train seats, and small cars for that reason, and I really hate sitting in small theater seats–**keeping my arms in front of me **and my hands in my lap for more than a few minutes really HURTS me.

So I often sit with my arm draped across the back of a seat. I will switch arms.

Until I saw that post, I never dreamed that anyone would find it offensive in the Mass. I still can’t believe it. I’m just floored.

Do you all actually think this “posture” is somehow disrespectful to the Lord? Why? What is the correct “reverent” position for Mass? And please post your documentation for stating that this “reverent position” is the only correct position?

I am a human being with a human body. No apologies. God made me this way.

Through His Church, the Catholic Church, He asks me to mortify my flesh only a few times a year by fasting and abstaining (mainly during Lent). Other than that, I was not aware that God requires me to mortify my flesh by deliberately making myself physically uncomfortable or causing myself pain during Mass.

Some of you are distracted by such things as a husband and wife cuddling, teenagers in revealing clothing, men in walking shorts, women in sandals, people clapping, people holding hands during the Our Father, people raising their hands during a hymn, people receiving Holy Communion on the hand instead of the tongue, etc., etc., etc., etc., etc., etc., etc.

Would it be OK for me to say that I am distracted by the various aches and pains and noises and quirks in my own frail body?

Often my foot hurts, although it’s better since the surgery. I often have stomach pains, since I don’t tolerate veges well. As I said above, my shoulders hurt if they are cramped up in the same position for a long time. And even though I’m on meds for it, sometimes I have a very over-active bladder that makes it almost impossible for me to concentrate on the Mass. Often I’m hot–I’m always hot, even in the winter.

If I am truly in great pain or ill, I stay home from Mass (which is allowed).

Otherwise, I try not to let my body distract me too much from Mass, and I usually ask the Lord to please help me to concentrate on Him rather than my body. Maybe this prayer method would help some of you who are easily distracted during Mass.
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Apparently all that pain does not keep you from playing the piano during Mass. To play—you do have your arms and hands in front of you for more than a few minutes. If you can accomplish playing-- how is it that now you have to have your arms draped across the back of the seat.
 
Walking_Home said:
Apparently all that pain does not keep you from playing the piano during Mass. To play—you do have your arms and hands in front of you for more than a few minutes. If you can accomplish playing-- how is it that now you have to have your arms draped across the back of the seat.
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Why would it matter to you where he puts his arms?
 
Thank you, estesbod and rayne89. You both seem like voices of reason and balance.

I have met so many wonderful Catholic Christians over the years. One of the main reasons why I was willing to even study the Catholic Church is the because of the Christian love that I saw in these Catholics.

And since 2001, when I first started attending Mass and studying the Catholic Church, I have met hundreds of wonderful, friendly Catholics who have literally loved me into the Church.

There is an elderly couple in our parish who I give the credit to for my “final decision” to become Catholic. These dear people “chat” before and after Mass (except when she is acting as an extraordinary Eucharistic minister and delivering Holy Communion to the sick). They even laugh out loud before Mass. They are physically affectionate, but not excessively so (they’re in their 70s at least!).

And several times before I made the decision to become Catholic, they acted kindly towards me and my husband and greeted us like old friends and treated us like pals.

I was so overwhelmed by their lovingkindness–a stark contrast to the “ousting” that we had received at our Protestant church–that I started sobbing one day during Mass. (I suppose that was distracting to someone, or irreverent?)

Like I said, I was literally “loved” into the Church by so many loving people.

So when I come here, I am a little taken aback by what I see as a “lack of love.” Sometimes, people present the argument that “it IS loving to correct people.” Well, I agree, if wrong is truly being perpetrated. But putting an arm across the back of a pew?!

I have heard often that our diocese is one of the most conservative, orthodox, and well-run dioceses in the U.S. We actually have a surplus of vocations, so our Bishop is definitely doing something right!

I feel that I have been well-catechized by knowledgeable Catholics and priests. I have not been led astray by “liberals.” If something needed to be taught (e.g., not putting my arm across the back of the pew), I think my teachers and priests would have mentioned it, right?

Anyway, thanks again for kind, sensible Catholic words.

As for others, well, I’m trying very hard to appreciate your rather rigid point of view. But I have to agree with those who have said that if you are truly focusing completely on Jesus during the Holy Mass, you will never even notice what others around you are doing or not doing. I am just a new Catholic, and I can honestly say that often I will leave Mass with no memory of anyone other than Jesus Christ in the most Holy Sacrament of the Altar.

I have read several bios of saints who prayed in the most horrible circumstances. They saw Jesus in the midst of the circumstances. I want to be like them, undistracted by my surroundings. But in order for me to learn how to not be distracted, I have to be in a place where there are distractions so that the Lord can teach me how to concentrate solely on Him. A silent place will not help me to get stronger. **Has it ever occurred to you that maybe all the distractions in your Mass are the “teaching tools” that our Lord is providing to help you learn to concentrate solely on Him? ** Thank You, Lord, for all the distractions in my parish’s Mass! Teach me to draw close to You in the midst of all the human distractions that occur in Mass and in my daily life.
 
Cat said:
Thank you, estesbod and rayne89. You both seem like voices of reason and balance.

I have met so many wonderful Catholic Christians over the years. One of the main reasons why I was willing to even study the Catholic Church is the because of the Christian love that I saw in these Catholics.

And since 2001, when I first started attending Mass and studying the Catholic Church, I have met hundreds of wonderful, friendly Catholics who have literally loved me into the Church.

There is an elderly couple in our parish who I give the credit to for my “final decision” to become Catholic. These dear people “chat” before and after Mass (except when she is acting as an extraordinary Eucharistic minister and delivering Holy Communion to the sick). They even laugh out loud before Mass. They are physically affectionate, but not excessively so (they’re in their 70s at least!).

And several times before I made the decision to become Catholic, they acted kindly towards me and my husband and greeted us like old friends and treated us like pals.

I was so overwhelmed by their lovingkindness–a stark contrast to the “ousting” that we had received at our Protestant church–that I started sobbing one day during Mass. (I suppose that was distracting to someone, or irreverent?)

Like I said, I was literally “loved” into the Church by so many loving people.

So when I come here, I am a little taken aback by what I see as a “lack of love.” Sometimes, people present the argument that “it IS loving to correct people.” Well, I agree, if wrong is truly being perpetrated. But putting an arm across the back of a pew?!

I have heard often that our diocese is one of the most conservative, orthodox, and well-run dioceses in the U.S. We actually have a surplus of vocations, so our Bishop is definitely doing something right!

I feel that I have been well-catechized by knowledgeable Catholics and priests. I have not been led astray by “liberals.” If something needed to be taught (e.g., not putting my arm across the back of the pew), I think my teachers and priests would have mentioned it, right?

Anyway, thanks again for kind, sensible Catholic words.

As for others, well, I’m trying very hard to appreciate your rather rigid point of view. But I have to agree with those who have said that if you are truly focusing completely on Jesus during the Holy Mass, you will never even notice what others around you are doing or not doing. I am just a new Catholic, and I can honestly say that often I will leave Mass with no memory of anyone other than Jesus Christ in the most Holy Sacrament of the Altar.

I have read several bios of saints who prayed in the most horrible circumstances. They saw Jesus in the midst of the circumstances. I want to be like them, undistracted by my surroundings. But in order for me to learn how to not be distracted, I have to be in a place where there are distractions so that the Lord can teach me how to concentrate solely on Him. A silent place will not help me to get stronger. Has it ever occurred to you that maybe all the distractions in your Mass are the “teaching tools” that our Lord is providing to help you learn to concentrate solely on Him? Thank You, Lord, for all the distractions in my parish’s Mass! Teach me to draw close to You in the midst of all the human distractions that occur in Mass and in my daily life.
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You mean undermining His own Mass—No God does not work that way. Nice try though.
 
estesbob said:
I wouldn’t worry about it. Some people are offended just by just about anything. In fact when you read CAF you wonder sometimes if people are so busy looking around the church to see what people are doing wrong that they forget why they’re there!
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I agree, this is not something to worry about. And don’t anybody get the idea that this is a widespread thing (people taking offense at this). I’m a cradle Catholic (with time off to be a non-believer), and this is the first time I’ve ever heard it mentioned. I’ve certainly never seen anybody scolded for it. I’d be more worried about getting trampled at Mass by guinea pigs.
 
absolutely nothing wrong with sitting like that.

I cracked my tailbone some time ago and could not sit back for several months. I could only sit very upright and very gingerly. I am sure some of the nitpicking ninnies here thought I must have been irreverent, as I’m sure I looked like I was about to bolt and run, based on my posture. I could not kneel, either.

Sit how one is comfortable.

All these nitpickers are thinking about how we sit, how affectionate we are with our family members, how I am wearing that sleeveless blouse, how I am wearing (gasp) capri pants, how I am wearing flip flop sandles that match my capris, how my boys are wearing clean jeans, how my boys are wearing flip flops, etc etc etc…
Then THEY are the ones not paying attention, and it is THEY who should examine their conscience.

Good grief, people! Stop making issues where there are none. You just like to stir the pot.
 
VociMike said:
I agree, this is not something to worry about. And don’t anybody get the idea that this is a widespread thing (people taking offense at this). I’m a cradle Catholic (with time off to be a non-believer), and this is the first time I’ve ever heard it mentioned. I’ve certainly never seen anybody scolded for it. I’d be more worried about getting trampled at Mass by guinea pigs.
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Too funny!! My guinea pig just got done literally walking all over me as I was hand feeding him orange slices! They are so dang cute, I wouldn’t mind getting trampled by them!😃
 
VociMike said:
I agree, this is not something to worry about. And don’t anybody get the idea that this is a widespread thing (people taking offense at this). I’m a cradle Catholic (with time off to be a non-believer), and this is the first time I’ve ever heard it mentioned. I’ve certainly never seen anybody scolded for it. I’d be more worried about getting trampled at Mass by guinea pigs.
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hmmm…maybe you should read my post from another thread that is also here. If you find afterwards that you still don’t agree (with a priest) then so be it. 🙂
 
water said:
I was wondering why some people like to rest the long arms on top of the pew and never think that it is just not right.
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This has got to be the pettiest issue I’ve ever seen discussed here.
May I suggest that you and others who find yourselves critiquing such minor details… Please find a way to apply your passion for liturgy in a more constructive manner… How is a duscussion like this uplifting to the body of Christ?
If there’re standing room only in the church, and you are packed in like sardines, then yes it would be rude to take up that much space. I cannot think of any other reason for anyone to complain about this.

There are bigger fish to fry, folks…
 
water said:
yah, thanks. That’s what I was referring too.
yes, it is rude.
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I disagree. This picture is clearly not during mass. It is a time of private prayer in the sanctuary. That positions appears where this person is finding his spiritual connection. There is nothing wrong with it, it is the way it is. No different than praying the rosary, as there is no official position to do it in.
 
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