Having a rough time with this election

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Do you mean the same Hillary Clinton who has taken millions of dollars for “speeches” to corporate entities? Whose “charity” is in the midst of scandal because of so much money coming in and so little of it going out to charity?

How about this little nugget, when asked why she took $300,000 for a speech to Goldman Sachs; “well, that’s what they paid me.” Good grief. :rolleyes:
In case you didn’t know it, that’s how MANY politicians earn their income, by giving speeches. The worker is worthy of their hire. And she hasn’t done any of those since she began campaigning.

You’ve mistaken Trump for Clinton – All of the Clinton Foundation’s tax returns are available to the public as required by law. Clinton (and family) have released 37 years of tax returns. Those documents have shown that Clinton gives much of the income from her speeches TO the Foundation. Money flows FROM the Clintons TO their charity, not the other way around (like Trump’s)

Trump’s used money from his charity to buy a six foot potrait of himself. He’s used other money from his charity to pay off legal fees and to buy sports memorabilia.

Clinton is not getting any funds from her charity…
 
I live in a blue state, myself. I expect my state will go to the blue candidate, but I’m still voting for the red candidate because that will make more of a difference in this most important election than wasting my vote on a 3rd party candidate.
How is your voting for a red candidate in a definite blue state any different from my voting for a 3rd party candidate?

Unless your state splits it’s electoral votes (mine does not), then the winner of the popular vote is going to get every electoral vote no matter how the remaining popular vote is split. So no - my vote is no more wasted than yours (as it will not effect the outcome in any way) but it does have a direct impact in moving the discussion and possible money in future elections.
 
Zabdi Premjit: The word viable isn’t the issue. It’s your definition turning it from “practical,” a definition found in the dictionary to that of “must” or “will,” neither of which is a definition for viable in the dictionary.
I don’t understand. I didn’t say it meant “must” or “will,” I said it had to do with having a reasonable chance of them winning. Are you saying that viability has nothing to do with having a reasonable chance of winning?
Full Definition of viable
1
: capable of living; especially : having attained such form and development as to be normally capable of surviving outside the mother’s womb
2
: capable of growing or developing
3
a : capable of working, functioning, or developing adequately
b : capable of existence and development as an independent unit
c (1) : ** having a reasonable chance of succeeding **(2) : financially sustainable

viability \ˌvī-ə-ˈbi-lə-tē\ noun
merriam-webster.com/dictionary/viable
The only time I said something, must/will happen is in cases in which a person is voting for viable candidates only, and there is only one candidate with a reasonable chance of winning (i.e. viable).

In other words:

If Person A only votes for candidates who are viable,
and only Candidate B has a reasonable chance of success,
then Person A will vote for Candidate B.

Also:
If the viable candidate closest to the Faith is the best candidate,
and only Candidate B has a reasonable chance of success (viable),
then Candidate B is the best candidate.

What is your objection to my reasoning?
 
I’ve given up voting until there is a candidate worth voting for. 👍 With the looks of things in this country, it may be a while…
 
I’ve given up voting until there is a candidate worth voting for. 👍 With the looks of things in this country, it may be a while…
Well, there are usually a lot of other races and important questions on every general election ballot.
 
How is your voting for a red candidate in a definite blue state any different from my voting for a 3rd party candidate?

Unless your state splits it’s electoral votes (mine does not), then the winner of the popular vote is going to get every electoral vote no matter how the remaining popular vote is split. So no - my vote is no more wasted than yours (as it will not effect the outcome in any way) but it does have a direct impact in moving the discussion and possible money in future elections.
Because I could be wrong–and please God I am wrong. I won’t take the chance that a few votes one way or the other would have made the difference. That’s why. 🙂
 
Well, there are usually a lot of other races and important questions on every general election ballot.
Yes!

Please don’t stay home!

Know who your town councilpeople are and what issues are in your community. Know your state reps, county officials, etc.
 
HI everyone,
As you know in couple of months (ish) we are having the presidential election. I have been praying on it lately because I am so confused who to vote for, and I want to vote, because I know someone will get in the office regardless if I don’t vote. Now before I was A Trump supporter because, well he was a better choice than Hillary. (Whom I would never in a million years vote for). But after praying in reflecting and asking God to send me signs if my choice in trump would be correct, I feel like He is subtly telling me it isnt. I have seen him in action being very unkind and lying. He says some very uncharitable things and although I do agree with him on some things like more border control, his "round up the foreigners " approach is pretty scary. Now I was looking into third party candidates and mostly all of them are pro abortion pro homosexual marriage so that brings me back to trump who is techemically the most prolife of the group. Ugh. I am turning to you for advice because I feel at this point God has kind of left the ball in my court. I know who NOT to vote for but who can I vote for and have a clean conscience afterwards? 😦
I believe most conscientious Christian believers, who place ideals, personal responsibility, and principles ahead of cult of personality and political party rhetoric, are going through a little mini-crisis. The plain fact of the matter, is that after about 50 years of voting for the “lesser of two evils”, we ended up with, finally with an unacceptable binary choice.

I also have prayed a great deal, and have finally come to peace with my conscience which is where the Holy Spirit speaks to us. I have decided to to vote, as I believe is a civic duty. However, I am just voting the down ticket. We have a Senatorial race, a Congress person race, our judges, and some important state and local ballot measures to consider. I will vote for the future in all of these down ballot races. I have decided that based on all of the information available to me on all four of the Presidential candidates, I am going to withold my vote for the Office of President. This is my decision and it has given me some relief, and some different insight and perspective.

I respect whatever decision anyone makes in this strange time, and I hold no one any ill will with the agonizing decision. I think what is helpful though is to make the decision based on prayer and study. Make the decision, and then don’t second guess yourself. If you are able to make your decision and then put the whole thing to bed, then the sooner you get back into the swing of your own life. If your have Christian causes that you work for as ministry, just pour yourself into them. Whoever becomes President is not going to have a mandate from the American people, so hopefully neither will get much done and will be hamstrung, but even if not, it’s our of our control.

Hopefully we will learn over this next four years that we must stop the idea of voting for the “least of two evils”, and because of that, demand better candidates from our Partys. Another great things is to ALWAYS vote at the grass roots level. If we elect aldermen, State and local officials, congress people, and Senators who are good and decent people, then in a couple of election cycles, the choices will be quite good on the National level, and even at President if we stop settling, and get more interested in our local stuff than the National Stage. Under the Catholic doctrine of subsidiarity the smallest level of Government, (beginning with the family, and then working outwards), that can handle aa problem, the better. So it seems to me that we have all this backwards anyway. We’re way too concerned about the Federal President, and way too underconcerned about our Mayor and City Councilman. So…two takeaways I’ve gotten from this election cycle that I’m going to take to heart are summed up in these statements:

Without good seeds, you won’t have a yield of good fruit.

As for me, and my household, we will serve the Lord.
 
This year’s election is one of the easiest choices for Catholics in a very long time.

If you are Catholic what is the most important issue according to our Church Teaching?

Which candidate has the best chance to reduce the likelihood of that occurring, not just for the next 4 years but in the future?

Will any other single issue, if no change happens in the status of the most important issue, impact more people? (If one candidate can’t do what they intend and what they intend is to reduce the occurrence of the most important issue - will that issue still impact more than any other single issue?)

Does the candidate I have chosen have a reasonable path to being elected?
(remember, we are trying to lessen the REAL impact of the most important issue. Voting for someone with the perfect position on the number one issue who is on the ballot in only one state, does nothing to impact the most important issue and the voter knows that. If stopping or at least reducing the occurrence of the most important issue is the goal for a Catholic (it is), is choosing to vote for someone who has the perfect position but does not have a reasonable chance to be elected, help or hurt the chances of the occurrence of the most important issue staying the same or decreasing?)

Concerning voting and the importance of the number one issue, is your personal opinion more important to you than the teaching of the Catholic Church, who guided by the Holy Spirit believes it is protected from teaching error?

(Catholic? That answer is no, obedience to the Church always overrules personal opinion. An informed conscience is defined by the Catechism as:
II. THE FORMATION OF CONSCIENCE
1783 Conscience must be informed and moral judgment enlightened. A well-formed conscience is upright and truthful. It formulates its judgments according to reason, in conformity with the true good willed by the wisdom of the Creator. The education of conscience is indispensable for human beings who are subjected to negative influences and tempted by sin to prefer their own judgment and to reject authoritative teachings.)

The Catechism could not be more clear … if you are Catholic. You either are Catholic or you are not Catholic. Either all of its teaching is protected by the Holy Spirit or none of its teaching is protected from error (not the Pope’s latest interview on his personal opinion, actual confirmed Church Teaching). To believe the Church is “wrong” on an issue is to say God is wrong or at least God is allowing the Church to deceive us/lie to us and YOU have determined the correct position the Church should have taken by you own personal discernment.

So what is the most important issue, always, according to the Catholic Church.

The right to life. The one issue, that if not protected, costs that person their ability to exercise or enjoy any other God given right. To jump to the other issues involving the rights impacting the living is to discriminate against each aborted baby, saying their rights are not as important as someone else’s rights.

The next president will appoint at least 1 Supreme Court Justice and if Hillary is elected Justice Ginsberg has hinted strongly that she will retire, knowing a democrat will select her replacement. Appointments to the Supreme Court have been getting younger and serving longer. They also have become partisan positions, with selection based on support for a parties key positions as a litmus test for qualification. Any law that restricts abortion passed in the next 30 years will likely be ruled unconstitutional by a democratic/liberal majority of the court, if Hillary wins.

So it comes down to one simple question… are you really Catholic?

It is OK to not understand a position when it goes against a personal opinion but to be Catholic one must defer to the wisdom of the Church, rather than personal opinion when they conflict.

If you are Catholic the choice is clear.

Congress can stop any legislation and prevent stupid changes for 4 years. Congress and future Presidents can’t change the Supreme Court and can’t stop it from ruling laws unconstitutional. Supreme Court appointments make this election critical for the next two generations and beyond.

Hillary would be helped by that 3rd party vote, not Trump. Hillary wants to provide free abortions to the poor, and to forced Catholic Hospitals do abortions and sterilizations if they accept federal funding. (they will close (or just close their OB/GYN dept) just like Catholic adoption centers are forced to close when faced with allowing same sex couples to adopt…and closing/taking over Catholic Hospitals was a key part of Hillary’s plan for health care when Bill was in office)

Abortions OK? Can you tell me when God imparts a soul on the person He tells us He knitted in the womb? What exact second would that be? Without that answer, a Catholic can’t even consider making abortions easier… unless they are smarter than God.

And the Church Fathers say:
“Didache” “You shall not procure abortion. You shall not destroy the newborn child.” Athenagoras (177)“A Plea on Behalf of Christians” Christians consider as murderers those women who take medicines to procure an abortion; he condemns the killer of children, including those still living in their mother’s womb, “where they are already the object of the care of divine providence.” Tertullian, (197)“Apologeticum” “To prevent birth is anticipated murder; it makes little difference whether one destroys a life already born or does away with it in its nascent stage. The one who will be man is already one.”
St. Basil in a letter to Bishop Amphilochius (374) “A woman who has deliberately destroyed a fetus must pay the penalty for murder” and “Those also who give drugs causing abortions are murderers themselves, as well as those who receive the poison which kills the fetus.”
 
Because I could be wrong–and please God I am wrong. I won’t take the chance that a few votes one way or the other would have made the difference. That’s why. 🙂
You’re right that it is not right to let polls influence your vote. The only one that counts is the one whose result won’t be known until after all the ballots have been cast. The rest are only partial pictures of a moment in time other than the one that will count.
 
I’ve given up voting until there is a candidate worth voting for. 👍 With the looks of things in this country, it may be a while…
I know someone in state office who is praiseworthy in every respect. He does not represent my district, so I can’t vote for him for the state legislature. Since my reservations concerning all the candidates who made the ballot are so serious, I’ll probably write his name in for president.
 
I believe I must vote for Trump for a plain and simple reason. To wit: More people will be harmed if Hillary gets elected than if Trump does. I have particularly in mind, the suffering victims of the militant Islamists and the millions of preborn persons who will be sacrificed on the altars of the modern manifestations of Moloch.
 
I think, and I’ve been wrong Before, that trump wins this by a rather large margin. For years we have heard about this mythical " silent majority". Which basically assumes that most people think like you do on an issue but they are too busy “living life” to be vocal. I don’t believe in a silent majority, I used to but ss"m" and a few other issues changed my mind.

But I think trump will be elected by my newly coined term the “lying majority” (copyright)

It’s simple. No one liked the spice girls publicly but yet they sold millions of albums. Somebody bought all those albums. Trump is the same way. Social media and the like are full of people saying awful things about trump, he is a Bigot, mysogenist, evil man. It’s the popular thing where people are peer pressured to be on the “right” side of the issue. But here is the thing, when that booth is in front of them, trump is everything people who decry the system have wanted.

A candidate that speaks his mind. Check.
That isn’t controlled by special interest. Check
that isn’t stuffy. Check
That isn’t part of the system. Check
That is different than any other choice. Check.

I honestly think the lying majority . Those who join in on the idea that voting for him is uncouth. Will indeed vote to “blow the system up”. And I think they will lie about it later too.

"No, I always hated the spice girls… "Yet you know they had a cd.

Or for those who don’t have as rosy of a picture for trump as I do…
Let me try another analogy. Nobody admits to watching pornography, but yet, it is a. Billion dollar industry…

The lying majority… Mark my words.
 
I think there is a very different way on how some people view the act of voting itself.

Some people view it as an ultimate expression of conscience, others may see it as a way to have an impact on the future by making reasonable/mathematical calculations. Depending on your view you may or may not act a certain way

Our country WILL have either Trump or Clinton as president, period. I believe it is by the immoral nature of how we have lived as a nation that we have brought upon ourselves such poor choices. Of course we do not have people of high moral character that even stand a chance to win, how could we? This has been coming for a long time and we deserve this as a nation as I see it. I have to look in the mirror too, I am part of this problem I did not do enough as a Catholic or a person this whole situation is sad. I pray for our future though and pray that God guides our country.
I think we have also set up unreasonable standards under which anyone who has ever said something regrettable or done something they’re not proud of, they’re afraid to run. Not just the candidates get this scrutiny, but their families and associates, too. If a candidate doesn’t bow to people with money and power, they can be ruined, too.

The other thing that complicates voting is the disconnect between official platforms and what the candidates actually do when they are in office. It isn’t enough to look at what a candidate says he or she believes. So what if they vote for amendments that they and everyone else voting knew were not going to pass when the amendments were proposed? You have to guess at what they are actually going to do when they have an opportunity to accomplish something. You have to consider what kinds of laws the courts will allow legislators to enact. It is no wonder that voters are getting cynical.
 
Watch the documentary “Wolf in sheep’s clothing” (www.alinskyfilm.com) and then watch “Woman in gold”. History may not repeat but it definitely rhymes.
 
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