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LittleFlower
Guest
Because it’s sometimes not about the feel good stuff.
Does anyone have a book recommendation for a intellectually challenging book, that doesn’t deal with violence, sexual content, or similar?
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Does anyone have a book recommendation for a intellectually challenging book, that doesn’t deal with violence, sexual content, or similar?
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ChunkMonk
Guest
Why does it have to be pornographic to discuss sex?
Tis_Bearself
Patron
The discussion of reading the Old Testament brought back another memory, when I was 13 and we had all just been given brand new paperback student Bibles to use for our religion classes. I decided to read mine cover to cover as I always wanted to know what was in the Bible apart from the Mass readings. I got up to the parts involving Noah getting drunk and laying around naked with his sons laughing at him and being 13 I was like WHAT is this doing in a Bible? I did get through the whole Bible, but the OT at that age was really something else.
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LittleFlower
Guest
I just had the best morning chuckle.Tis_Bearself
Patron
Actually a lot of old books such as “Rebecca of Sunnybrook Farm” and “Little Women” are intellectually challenging. I’m not kidding, they are. They aren’t cutesy stories like the movies show them as. And they don’t have sex or violence in them. But those kinds of books are not trendy.
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StJoseph8
Guest
This, Engineering specifically for me.
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LittleFlower
Guest
@Teek, perhaps suggests these?
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StJoseph8
Guest
To the OP, I would say that if you have the time, walk through with her the passages that are particularly scandalous and explain why its wrong. That way, she can read the books understanding why those actions are wrong.
Tis_Bearself
Patron
Me too. I AP’ed out of the one required English course for Engr’s. I minored in Econ and took some dance electives. It was such a relief not to have to be dealing with teachers’ subjective viewpoints.
I went to one literature class in college once, a friend took me to his class on James Joyce’s “Ulysses”. It was awful. It basically was dissecting Joyce. I was pretty widely read at the time because I was a big bookworm and nerd who spent all my spare time at the library, and it seemed to me that all the analysis was just ruining any enjoyment one might get out of reading a James Joyce book.
I went to one literature class in college once, a friend took me to his class on James Joyce’s “Ulysses”. It was awful. It basically was dissecting Joyce. I was pretty widely read at the time because I was a big bookworm and nerd who spent all my spare time at the library, and it seemed to me that all the analysis was just ruining any enjoyment one might get out of reading a James Joyce book.
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Xanthippe_Voorhees
Guest
Because the teacher CLEARLY wants her to read some work of modern, extremely dark, quazi-fiction.
This is concerning. The fact that she accepts the entierly discreted “million pieces” book speaks to an agenda.
Honestly, I’d see what resources you had in getting around this class based on the PSTD diagnosis.
Tis_Bearself
Patron
The teacher might laugh at her 
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StJoseph8
Guest
Yeah. It’s sad but at this point if I had kids now I would say go to college for a math/science topic and study English, Philosophy, History, etc. on your own.
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Teek
Guest
Yes. She will maintain that right—to reject content she finds morally reprehensible—throughout her entire life, of liberty holds up that long time. Even at university. It will be up to her to excercise that right as she discerns. And only her.
There are also experiences that some people think everyone should experience. And there are people who find some of those things to be morally reprehensible. They, also, maintain the right to reject those experiences. If they did not, some of those forced experiences would be a violation.
In the same vein, forced encounters with unwelcome sexually explicit material constitute an intellectual violation. So: yes. She should not be forced to read things like that. Ever. She also maintains the freedom to enjoy it. It should work both ways.
I never said school is about feel good books. I would like a book that does not contain sexually explicit material for my daughter who is a minor. So many great books are challenging and face all of these issues without the sexually explicit content.
Neuroscience and psychology would disagree that any adolescent child would benefit from sexually explicit material, especially the deviant themes. I suppose eventually the educators will catch up to science. Decreased age of first sexual encounter, increased number of sexual partners, dramatically increased incidence of sexual addictions. We have to protect children. When they are old enough, they can process these encounters in the appropriate areas of their brains. Not yet.
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JimG
Guest
It sure sounds like it. I was a voracious reader both as an adolescent and adult, and an English Lit major in college. I don’t recall reading anything nearly so sexually explicit and callously violent as the books that are routinely given to 14 year olds in high school today. If it’s not dark, violent, sexually explicit, and perverse, it seems not to make the reading list. Does truth, beauty, and goodness have a place in education?
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LittleFlower
Guest
Intellectual rape isn’t a thing. I can’t find any literature or sources right now that debate these exact same words. Also rape is a physical violent action.
It is severely concerning that you are using these words about reading a book. Others have asked the same question, as to, why you don’t try to sit with her and work through it?
She will not get far at university by claiming that uncomfortable topics and literature are raping her intellectually.
Science also says that open conversations about sex, consent, violence, and boundaries—discussed age appropriately—help children and youth understand their own boundaries in those topics. Reading material that makes her uncomfortable, and dealing with it, as maturely as possible would be the best outcome.
Instead, it feels like you are trying to advocate shielding her from anything that she finds morally reprehensible.
We are to live in this world, and not in a cocoon, shielded from the world.
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ChunkMonk
Guest
Wait
Wait
Wait
When were we commanded to be “of this world?”
Wait
Wait
When were we commanded to be “of this world?”
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Xanthippe_Voorhees
Guest
You have a right to be concerned but I think you’re way off base here.
The teacher is in the wrong. Period.
Your first post, you were on the side of right. However, rejecting content is not a responsible life plan. “intellectual rape” is a disgusting term that makes light of actual, serious, physical crime.
You will be better off simply saying that you have a child with PSTD who should not be reading material about neglect/abuse/sexual miscreants. Using the terms in your last post are only going to create enimies.
The teacher is in the wrong. Period.
Your first post, you were on the side of right. However, rejecting content is not a responsible life plan. “intellectual rape” is a disgusting term that makes light of actual, serious, physical crime.
You will be better off simply saying that you have a child with PSTD who should not be reading material about neglect/abuse/sexual miscreants. Using the terms in your last post are only going to create enimies.
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Crusaderbear
Guest
You are doing the right things here, go through the principle, but if there is no satisfaction or you feel you’ve been ignored, go to the school board. They must address this issue. I have sat on the schoolboard side when a parent challenged our earth science book. The system is in place to handle your request. It doesn’t mean the school board will side with you, but you will have had your say! Good luck.
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Roseeurekacross
Guest
on this , I totally agree with you.
noone hasthe right to force their views and what they feel appropriate on us.
noone hasthe right to force their views and what they feel appropriate on us.
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Teek
Guest
EXACTLY. And thank you!!
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