Here's what Pope Francis and Justin Trudeau talked about [CNA]

  • Thread starter Thread starter CNA_News
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
C

CNA_News

Guest
http://www.catholicnewsagency.com/images/francis_trudeau_cna_size.jpgVatican City, May 29, 2017 / 10:40 am (CNA/EWTN News).- Pope Francis met with Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau in a private audience which focused on religious freedom as well as reconciliation with native people of Canada.

According to a brief May 29 communique from the Vatican, Pope Francis and Prime Minister Trudeau conversed on the topics of integration and reconciliation with indigenous people, as well as religious liberty and current ethical issues.

In their 36-minute meeting which the Vatican described as “cordial,” they touched on the positive bilateral relations between the Holy See and Canada, “along with the contribution of the Catholic Church to the social life of the country.”

Afterward “in the light of the results of the recent G7 summit, attention turned to various matters of an international nature, with special attention to the Middle East and areas of conflict,” the communique stated.

During the visit, Trudeau extended an invitation to Pope Francis to visit the country of Canada, during which time he could bring the Church’s apology for harm done to indigenous people in Canada in the mid-19th through 20th centuries when 150,000 children from native tribes were forced to undergo “enculturation” to the state through attendance at residential schools.

Some 6,000 children died in the schools and though they were state-owned, a number were managed by Catholics. The Truth and Reconciliation Commission, which ran from 2008-2015, called for action on 94 points, one of which was an apology from the Catholic Church.

In 2009, Benedict XVI did apologize for the Church’s participation in the system during a meeting with the head of the Canadian National Assembly, Phil Fontaine, showing “his pain and anguish caused by the deplorable conduct of some members of the Church,” adding that “acts of abuse can never be tolerated by society.”

The Prime Minister’s spokesman, Cameron Ahmad, said Trudeau’s main agenda for the conversation with Francis was reiterating the open invitation to the Pope to come to Canada and for “reconciliation” with the indigenous communities on this point.

Ahmad also said that other important topics for Trudeau included the climate, religious and ethnic diversity – such as interreligious dialogue – and immigration.

At the end of the meeting, the Pope gave Trudeau a medallion symbolizing forgiveness, joy and mutual acceptance. It also references the scripture passage from Matthew 5:7, “Blessed are the merciful, for they will be shown mercy.”

Francis also gave him a copy of his environmental encyclical Laudato Si, as well as copies of his 2015 Apostolic Exhortation on the family “Amoris Laetitia” and his 2013 exhortation “Evangelii Gaudium.”

Along with the three customary documents, the Pope also gave the prime minister a copy of his message for the 2017 World Day of Peace, which he signed, just like the one he gave to U.S. President Donald Trump during their meeting last week.

For his part, Trudeau gifted Francis a copy of “Relations de Jesuits du Canada,” a rare 6-volume edition that documents the Jesuits’ reports on Canadian territory, and a Jesuit vocabulary in a special edition.

The meeting was not Trudeau’s first visit to the Vatican. A Catholic, he met St. John Paul II in 1980 during the papal meeting of his father, former Canadian Prime Minister Pierre Trudeau with the pope.

Afterward, Trudeau met with Secretary of State Cardinal Pietro Parolin and Secretary for Relations with States Archbishop Paul Richard Gallagher.

Absent from Trudeau’s agenda for the audience were any topics related to life-issues, particularly that of euthanasia. Assisted suicide was legalized by the federal government in Canada on June 17, 2016. It now falls to the local provinces to reform the medical system to be in conformity with the new laws.

Canadian bishops from the provinces of Ontario and Quebec met with Pope Francis recently for their ad limina visits in April and the beginning of May. During the meetings the bishops all expressed concerns regarding the threat to freedom of conscience in relation to euthanasia’s legalization.

feeds.feedburner.com/~ff/catholicnewsagency/dailynews?d=yIl2AUoC8zA
http://feeds.feedburner.com/~r/catholicnewsagency/dailynews/~4/W5V0mqkuZWw

Full article…
 
I am afraid that I don’t like some of what I read.

When people do things on behalf of the Church, that are particularly evil things, then this puts these people into a state of mortal sin, and especially in the case of certain crimes, are surely excommunicated, and so cease to be part of the Sacramental life of the Catholic community.

People in a state of grave error are not acting on behalf of the Church. So, it is surely these individuals that have sinned.

Why does the Church apologise as a whole when individuals do things wrong?

The Church is not just a visibly founded institute, it is the Mystical in origin.

It is the state as a whole, in Canada, that needs to apologise, surely? They are the institute that let things happen.

What the Church could do is apologise on behalf of some of its members. Even then…

Anyone got any thoughts because I don’t understand.
 
And is it really necessary to have that picture of the leader representing Canada so huge - the leader is disgraceful in the things he advocates as a leader of a nation?!
 
And is it really necessary to have that picture of the leader representing Canada so huge - the leader is disgraceful in the things he advocates as a leader of a nation?!
I pray PF sees through the bs this slick salesman brings with him. He is for the wholesale slaughter of innocent children in all nine months of pregnancy. before he was elected he promised that no MP in his party will be allowed to be against abortion.

This guy makes me queasy.:eek:
 
I am afraid that I don’t like some of what I read.

When people do things on behalf of the Church, that are particularly evil things, then this puts these people into a state of mortal sin, and especially in the case of certain crimes, are surely excommunicated, and so cease to be part of the Sacramental life of the Catholic community.

People in a state of grave error are not acting on behalf of the Church. So, it is surely these individuals that have sinned.

Why does the Church apologise as a whole when individuals do things wrong?

The Church is not just a visibly founded institute, it is the Mystical in origin.

It is the state as a whole, in Canada, that needs to apologise, surely? They are the institute that let things happen.

What the Church could do is apologise on behalf of some of its members. Even then…

Anyone got any thoughts because I don’t understand.
Here’s some thoughts: “Communion of Saints,” “Body of Christ,” "bride of Christ, “one, holy and apostalic,” etc. Whenever the “Church” is mentioned in any document, it’s not “OK, this applies to St. xxx Parish over here, but not xxxx.” It’s the entire Church, the Church as a whole.

So yes, if some group (pedophile priests and bishops, exploiters of Indians, Nazi collaborators, etc.) representing “the Church” in an official capacity does something bad, this reflects on “the Church” as a whole. That makes perfect sense to me. Are we all complicit? Absolutely. Just think about the pedophile business: what would have happened if all those happy parishioners who minded their own business had said, “Wait a minute, my son/daughter said xxx,” I think we (the community as a whole) should have a look at this." It’s because no one stepped up to the plate that all this went on and on and on and on.

This does not apply to individual Catholics who do some individual act like murder, rape, robbery, etc. Those acts are not official acts in the name of the Church.

And yes, this principle applies to Muslims as well. You can’t talk about the “umma” (“community”) in one breath and then say, “Nope, Not me. I have no responsibility for what happened in Boston/Austin/San Bernardino/Nice/Paris/Brussels/Manchester, etc.” Yes, you do.
 
…before he was elected he promised that no MP in his party will be allowed to be against abortion.
:
I think you mean “he promised that no MP in his party will be allowed to be against individual freedom of choice.” Big difference. Read St. Augustine.
 
I think you mean “he promised that no MP in his party will be allowed to be against individual freedom of choice.” Big difference. Read St. Augustine.
I’m pretty busy with work and family. Could you just summarize St Augustine’s pro-choice argument for me? Thanks.
 
Here’s some thoughts: “Communion of Saints,” “Body of Christ,” "bride of Christ, “one, holy and apostalic,” etc. Whenever the “Church” is mentioned in any document, it’s not “OK, this applies to St. xxx Parish over here, but not xxxx.” It’s the entire Church, the Church as a whole.

So yes, if some group (pedophile priests and bishops, exploiters of Indians, Nazi collaborators, etc.) representing “the Church” in an official capacity does something bad, this reflects on “the Church” as a whole. That makes perfect sense to me. Are we all complicit? Absolutely. Just think about the pedophile business: what would have happened if all those happy parishioners who minded their own business had said, “Wait a minute, my son/daughter said xxx,” I think we (the community as a whole) should have a look at this." It’s because no one stepped up to the plate that all this went on and on and on and on.

This does not apply to individual Catholics who do some individual act like murder, rape, robbery, etc. Those acts are not official acts in the name of the Church.

And yes, this principle applies to Muslims as well. You can’t talk about the “umma” (“community”) in one breath and then say, “Nope, Not me. I have no responsibility for what happened in Boston/Austin/San Bernardino/Nice/Paris/Brussels/Manchester, etc.” Yes, you do.
Sorry, though I under what you mean, even when priests have sinned in the ways you have put forward - am not sure as to whether this is what happened in Canada - they have gone against the Church and Christ, when they did such a thing. They did not sin with the Church.

When a person sins, the first whom they hurt, is God, and then the neighbour.

The sinner also hurts the faithful and that is how the connection works.

Look up ‘excommunication’. This can happen automatically before the formal discipline.

The Catholic Church is a mystically instituted Church to whom Our Lady and the Saints belong to as part of the Church in heaven. So, are you telling me that the Church as a whole has sinned when individuals have gone against their Church?

The Church can apologise on behalf of individuals but this is surely not the same…?

So I still don’t understand.
 
I pray PF sees through the bs this slick salesman brings with him. He is for the wholesale slaughter of innocent children in all nine months of pregnancy. before he was elected he promised that no MP in his party will be allowed to be against abortion.

This guy makes me queasy.:eek:
Canada is one of the worst countries for pro-‘choice’, as far as I know.

(better word: pro-‘convenience’).
 
I posted an opinion on another thread , but this thread seems to be the more appropriate one . . .hope you guys don’t mind if I post some of it here too.

First off , friardchips and ProdigalSun are right on the money with their posts. They are describing our country and the related bs coming from our government on life issues exactly as it stands.

I was kind of disheartened to read today that CTV News had the gall to say, concerning the meeting of PM Justin Trudeau with Pope Francis, that PM Trudeau is “Catholic”:
Trudeau, who is Catholic, says he gave the Pope a set of rare Jesuit Relations books, as well as a Montagnais-French dictionary penned by a 17th-century French Jesuit.
PM Trudeau, is the same, um “Catholic” who insisted that anyone who had respect for human life from the moment of conception could not apply to run for his Liberal party in the next election:
Justin Trudeau says opponents of abortion need not apply to run for the Liberal Party in the next election because he wants to form a government that is “resolutely pro-choice.
. . . I have made it clear that future candidates need to be completely understanding that they will be expected to vote pro-choice on any bills.”
Trudeau said that any potential Liberal candidates looking to reopen the abortion debate will be weeded out during the vetting process for nomination applications.
There is no adherence to the principle of freedom of conscience in our government anymore. Rather than have a sense of conviction, the politicians simply use the cop out that they ,* “can’t let their personal beliefs interfere with their running of the country.*” . . . that is, when it suits them.

Even medical science is on the side of the unborn now, but in order to protect their salaries and their hinder-located sitting apparatuses , most of our politicians do this when we speak of the sanctity of life:

i182.photobucket.com/albums/x151/rattlesnakeroot/blogger%202/lalala.jpg

Worldwide = Already more than 16.5 million abortions this year . . . already more than 87,000 abortions today . . . already more than 1.4 billion abortions since 1980.

numberofabortions.com/

Yet since the year 1860 , the total amount of casualties due to war is estimated at 160 million .

scaruffi.com/politics/massacre.html

The war in the womb dwarfs all other wars combined.
 
Just a few days ago I thought the idea was a meeting with the Pope was a sign of faithful Catholicism. I’m confused.:confused:
 
I think you mean “he promised that no MP in his party will be allowed to be against individual freedom of choice.” Big difference. Read St. Augustine.
No there’s not. It’s only another war of saying what prodigalson did, a very deceptive way at that.

Maybe if someone wished to kill you, and I said I’m not pro your murder, I just think they should be free to do it if they want and no one in my party is allowed to stop/prevent your murder in any way, in fact we will subsidize the weapons he might want to use in it.
 
And is it really necessary to have that picture of the leader representing Canada so huge - the leader is disgraceful in the things he advocates as a leader of a nation?!
He is probably so large because he is probably just a tall guy. Pope Francis isn’t that physically tall.

God Bless You

Thank you for reading
Josh
 
I pray PF sees through the bs this slick salesman brings with him. He is for the wholesale slaughter of innocent children in all nine months of pregnancy. before he was elected he promised that no MP in his party will be allowed to be against abortion.

This guy makes me queasy.:eek:
I completely agree. I am extremely doubtful of that though, especially by the way it’s reported to have gone and how the conversation was primarily shifted onto the indigenous community of Canada and the Church.

God Bless You

Thank you for reading
Josh
 
Just a few days ago I thought the idea was a meeting with the Pope was a sign of faithful Catholicism. I’m confused.:confused:
No, who said that?

Nevertheless, it’s good for our Holy Father to meet with Trudeau for a chance to talk in the hopes he may repent of such evil practices as abortion, but it looks like this was spun into a whole heap of different issues and his murderous practices of abortion were just largely ignored.

As Catholics we cannot and must not vote for a candidate who supports abortion or euthanasia.

“For the sake of His sorrowful passion, have mercy on us and on the whole world.”

I hope this has helped

God Bless

Thank you for reading
Josh
 
So yes, if some group (pedophile priests and bishops, exploiters of Indians, Nazi collaborators, etc.) representing “the Church” in an official capacity does something bad, this reflects on “the Church” as a whole. That makes perfect sense to me. Are we all complicit? Absolutely. Just think about the pedophile business: what would have happened if all those happy parishioners who minded their own business had said, “Wait a minute, my son/daughter said xxx,” I think we (the community as a whole) should have a look at this." It’s because no one stepped up to the plate that all this went on and on and on and on.
Cruel irony, exact same thing is happening today with abortion, who are the ones stepping up to the plate and saying the murder of innocent children in their mothers wombs is not on? meanwhile people vote these abortion supporters in and it goes on and on and on.

Many years they will try to lay those lives on the head of the Church for people like Pelosi and Trudeau, same with same sex marriage, which will create another stolen generation as children are intentionally deprived of a mother or father and created with IVF and surrogacy practices.

Those of us who lived in these times will know the truth though.

“For the sake of His sorrowful passion, have mercy on us and on the whole world.”
 
Sorry, though I under what you mean, even when priests have sinned in the ways you have put forward - am not sure as to whether this is what happened in Canada - they have gone against the Church and Christ, when they did such a thing. They did not sin with the Church.

When a person sins, the first whom they hurt, is God, and then the neighbour.

The sinner also hurts the faithful and that is how the connection works.

Look up ‘excommunication’. This can happen automatically before the formal discipline.

The Catholic Church is a mystically instituted Church to whom Our Lady and the Saints belong to as part of the Church in heaven. So, are you telling me that the Church as a whole has sinned when individuals have gone against their Church?

The Church can apologise on behalf of individuals but this is surely not the same…?

So I still don’t understand.
I’m not talking about “sin,” I’m talking about responsibility. If someone in any organization does something in an official capacity in the name of that organization, and if the organization does not immediately put a stop to it or denounce it, yes, that organization is responsible. Let’s take Merrill Lynch. If the manager of a Merrill Lynch branch commits fraud, and if Merrill Lynch looks the other way, yes, Merrill Lynch as a whole is responsible. Or let’s take Volkswagen and the emissions fraud scandal–clearly there were a number of people at VW who knew exactly what was going on, even if they weren’t directly involved. By staying quiet, they are complicit, and VW as a whole is responsible–as we’ve seen. VW paid the fine, not individuals.

What I’m saying is that you can’t just sit back and say, “Oh yeah, that pedophilia thing…I didn’t do anything wrong! It has nothing to do with me!” If you haven’t protested, written letters, talked to priests, etc. then it has everything to do with you.
 
As Catholics we cannot and must not vote for a candidate who supports abortion or euthanasia.
Of course you can. Read the statement of the USCCB, “Forming Consciences for Faithful Citizenship,” 2007. Section 35: “There may be times when a Catholic who rejects a candidate’s unacceptable position [on abortion, for example] may decide to vote for that candidate for other morally grave reasons. Voting in this way would be permissible only for truly grave moral reasons, not to advance narrow interests or partisan preferences or to ignore a fundamental moral evil.”

In other words, if candidate A supports freedom of choice on abortion, and you interpret that as favoring abortion, which you oppose, but candidate A also supports eliminating the death penalty and expanding health care for the poor, there’s no reason you can’t vote for candidate A.

If, however, candidate B also supports freedom of choice, but you’re only voting for candidate B because he/she promises to lower your taxes, that would be wrong.

Don’t argue with me, argue with the US Conference of Catholic Bishops.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top