Hispanics in Church

[Padrecito]

Nothing has enriched my ministry more than learning Spanish and their culture. In the last 10 years, I’ve started Spanish Masses in 3 different parishes, all of which are now booming and outnumbering the Anglos. In my current parish, we have three English Masses and one Spanish. The Spanish is always full, with Hispanic members from pretty much every country in Latin America.

At my Spanish masses nowadays, I preach two sermons: one in Spanish, the other in English. The children of the immigrants are in the public schools and are perfectly bilingual. I even had a 3-year old the other day telling me in English a flaw in my Spanish! They like the Spanish Mass (the translation is so much more beautiful than the English), and the also like the sermons.

Like I often tell people, I’m not scared of the booming Hispanic population. I welcome it.

• Padrecito (the nickname they gave me when I lived in Mexico)

 

[hazmatdude]

Nothing has enriched my ministry more than learning Spanish and their culture. In the last 10 years, I’ve started Spanish Masses in 3 different parishes, all of which are now booming and outnumbering the Anglos. In my current parish, we have three English Masses and one Spanish. The Spanish is always full, with Hispanic members from pretty much every country in Latin America.

At my Spanish masses nowadays, I preach two sermons: one in Spanish, the other in English. The children of the immigrants are in the public schools and are perfectly bilingual. I even had a 3-year old the other day telling me in English a flaw in my Spanish! They like the Spanish Mass (the translation is so much more beautiful than the English), and the also like the sermons.

Like I often tell people, I’m not scared of the booming Hispanic population. I welcome it.

• Padrecito (the nickname they gave me when I lived in Mexico)

Yes father I think everyone can see just how much you prefer your latino parishioners and the spanish liturgy to their “Anglo” counterparts. In my area just like yours, whites are leaving the church in droves because of similar negative sentiments espoused towards them by our holy priests.

If you didn’t already know this Father, “Anglo” is a very disparaging term in many latino circles. You would be well advised to refrain from using this pejorative no matter how innocently you meant it. Caucasian or white are the traditional and acceptable terms to use in this country!

God bless you, I will say a prayer for you!

 

[Padrecito]

Yes father I think everyone can see just how much you prefer your latino parishioners and the spanish liturgy to their “Anglo” counterparts. In my area just like yours, whites are leaving the church in droves because of similar negative sentiments espoused towards them by our holy priests.

No, I don’t think my area is like yours. In the 5 years I’ve been here, the entire community has grown, English and Spanish. All four Masses are beautiful in their own way. We’ll be building another church soon, since we anticipate 10,000 new families in our county within 10 years, a third of which will be Catholic. 20,000+ within 20 years. It’s like that all over our diocese. Perhaps they’re leaving yours and coming to ours?

Since this was a discussion of Hispanics in Church, I emphasized that. On Guadalupe, the church is full at 4am and all day with English and Spanish members. It’s beautiful. I’m not going to apologize for enjoying my Spanish ministry.

I can’t help that you interpreted my comments negatively. Perhaps you ought to be praying for prudence instead.

• Padrecito

 

[hazmatdude]

No, I don’t think my area is like yours. In the 5 years I’ve been here, the entire community has grown, English and Spanish. All four Masses are beautiful in their own way. We’ll be building another church soon, since we anticipate 10,000 new families in our county within 10 years, a third of which will be Catholic. 20,000+ within 20 years. It’s like that all over our diocese. Perhaps they’re leaving yours and coming to ours?

Since this was a discussion of Hispanics in Church, I emphasized that. On Guadalupe, the church is full at 4am and all day with English and Spanish members. It’s beautiful. I’m not going to apologize for enjoying my Spanish ministry.

I can’t help that you interpreted my comments negatively. Perhaps you ought to be praying for prudence instead.

• Padrecito

You to Father! Take a look at my Oct. 30th post. I’m sorry to say that’s what goes on in my area.

 

[Padrecito]

You to Father! Take a look at my Oct. 30th post. I’m sorry to say that’s what goes on in my area.

Oh now I understand. I can see that, for you, Hispanics in the Church is an Immigration issue, and you’ve adopted the typical “hell in a handbasket” attitude. Your concern is all about the USA, where politics trumps religion. Never mind that a 1/3rd of the country has a Hispanic heritage and the first “Thanksgiving Mass” in what is now the USA was celebrated in Spanish 150 years before the Pilgrims did their turkey thing.

Let’s make a deal: you keep politics out of it, and so will I.

• Padrecito

 

[Wisdom]

Yes father I think everyone can see just how much you prefer your latino parishioners and the spanish liturgy to their “Anglo” counterparts. In my area just like yours, whites are leaving the church in droves because of similar negative sentiments espoused towards them by our holy priests.

If you didn’t already know this Father, “Anglo” is a very disparaging term in many latino circles. You would be well advised to refrain from using this pejorative no matter how innocently you meant it. Caucasian or white are the traditional and acceptable terms to use in this country!

God bless you, I will say a prayer for you!

Anglos is not a disparaging term in latino circles they are those and this word is not that. In Mexico, Central American and South America it is perplexing to ask them to call people from the United States Americans since they too are Americans. The holy faither himself John Paul 2 pointed out that America is one from Alaska to southern tip of South America we are all americans in that sense. Thus other slangs were made up as during the Mexican and American War most americans were of some sort of Anglo decent it was the common slang. But perjorative it is not their is a word for that of course. Just as they are many perjoratives caucasions use to desribe people of latin american decent. It seems you seek to divide the Catholic Church here rather than unite it. THe church is catholic in universal whether mass is said in english or spanish or any other language. It caters to the faitfhful in the area and if the faithful are spansih speakers that it makes sense to do so we saw the same thing with first generation Italians, Polish, and Vietenmeneese as thier childern assimilate into the cutlure and language the numbers will even out over time just as it has in other ethnic immigration movement.

 

[hazmatdude]

Oh now I understand. I can see that, for you, Hispanics in the Church is an Immigration issue, and you’ve adopted the typical “hell in a handbasket” attitude. Your concern is all about the USA, where politics trumps religion. Never mind that a 1/3rd of the country has a Hispanic heritage and the first “Thanksgiving Mass” in what is now the USA was celebrated in Spanish 150 years before the Pilgrims did their turkey thing.

Let’s make a deal: you keep politics out of it, and so will I.

• Padrecito

Actually Father the Catholic hierarchy did a long time ago. The facts are on the record they blur the distinction between legal and illegal immigration, demonstrate in the streets for an amnesty, some promote civil disobedience and many lobby for liberal immigration legislation and amnesty. I’m just wondering why its O.K. for my Pastor to cancel English language mass to celebrate a devotion in entirely spanish that I’m not really welcome at., etc., etc.

Your accusation is without merit. I agree with legal immigration. I disagree with illegal immigration and amnesty.

I don’t think its a third of the population. The 2000 Census says it was 13%. In April, Juan Tornoe in “Hispanic Trends” thought it was about 14% of the population. Does it matter? No.

O.K. and before the Spanish the Aztec’s celebrated their god by ripping the beating hearts out of people. Now Americans reverently celebrate Thanksgiving which came after both of the other’s.

This has been fun Father, I kept my promise this morning at Mass.

 

[hazmatdude]

Anglos is not a disparaging term in latino circles they are those and this word is not that. In Mexico, Central American and South America it is perplexing to ask them to call people from the United States Americans since they too are Americans. The holy faither himself John Paul 2 pointed out that America is one from Alaska to southern tip of South America we are all americans in that sense. Thus other slangs were made up as during the Mexican and American War most americans were of some sort of Anglo decent it was the common slang. But perjorative it is not their is a word for that of course. Just as they are many perjoratives caucasions use to desribe people of latin american decent. It seems you seek to divide the Catholic Church here rather than unite it. THe church is catholic in universal whether mass is said in english or spanish or any other language. It caters to the faitfhful in the area and if the faithful are spansih speakers that it makes sense to do so we saw the same thing with first generation Italians, Polish, and Vietenmeneese as thier childern assimilate into the cutlure and language the numbers will even out over time just as it has in other ethnic immigration movement.

The fact is when Anglo used as a prefix such as Anglo-Saxon, Anglo-European that’s fine. Used any other way in contemporary America is inappropriate because as you know it IS a slur in some circles. Therefore should not be used at all.

I think you made that up that citizens of other countries in the Western Hemisphere are perplexed over calling citizens of the United States of America, Americans. Everybody I know or who have met through work always identify themselves by their nation of origin be that Canadian, Mexican or Salvadoran.

Finally, you accuse me of divisiveness because you disagree with me when I question the appropriateness of unequal treatment by the Church against English speakers of all races. You can’t defend what happened in my examples and dismiss them.

 

[Walt_Oliver]

It’s time to get back to discussing the topic of the thread and not each other. Thank you for your cooperation.

Recent inappropriate remarks have been edited.

 

[Wisdom]

The fact is when Anglo used as a prefix such as Anglo-Saxon, Anglo-European that’s fine. Used any other way in contemporary America is inappropriate because as you know it IS a slur in some circles. Therefore should not be used at all.

I think you made that up that citizens of other countries in the Western Hemisphere are perplexed over calling citizens of the United States of America, Americans. Everybody I know or who have met through work always identify themselves by their nation of origin be that Canadian, Mexican or Salvadoran.

Finally, you accuse me of divisiveness because you disagree with me when I question the appropriateness of unequal treatment by the Church against English speakers of all races. You can’t defend what happened in my examples and dismiss them.

What I said is that people from Mexico, Central America and South America very rarely will call people from the United States simply Americans because they too are Americans as they too come from the Americas. The United States does not have an exclusive claim to that name and moniker despite its peculiar way of only identifying themselves as Americans and not the rest of the Americas.

It is a fact Caucasian Americans are leaving the church and they are being replaced by not only Latin Americans but Asians since they are the ones actually showing up to church it figures their concerns are being met at the pastoral level. That is not to say any one ethnic group is greater than the other which you imply they are all equal it is just the church will concern itself with the customers who actually show up. If caucasians will come back to the church their will be more English masses and so forth. When the Spanish and Vietnamese and Filipino masses are overloaded and the english masses are held before a half empty congregation guess which one will be cut and which one increased? Its a numbers game it has nothing to do with being unequal.

 

[rosebudsal]

One of the beauties of the Catholic Church is that it allows the integration of culture and tradition into the Mass, providing they do not compromise its sacredness. In my experience, as a Latino, the incorporation of the various cultures and traditions within my own community has only enhanced the celebration. The union of our various cultures has not been an easy one, however it has been rewarding. If anything, we have gained from each other.

The United States Conference of Catholic Bishops (USCCB) recently met here in my Archdiocese. The cardinals and bishops of the United States were exposed to a variety of cultures in my state and received these traditions with zeal. I am surprised that the Church in the USA would be unwelcoming to the “stranger” or “immigrant” or “new-comer” because they do not speak the same language. Nonetheless, the cardinals and bishops of the US embraced the primarily Latino culture of my Archdiocese.

The USCCB conference was private, however, I was fortunate to receive an invitation to the vesper service celebrated in the Cathedral Basilica of the Archdiocese on the final evening of their gathering. Participation was by invitation only. Please note that the celebration I am about to describe was approved by the USCCB.

The service began with the procession of the cardinals and bishops to traditional organ music. Following the procession, a Native American dance was offered as a prayer giving thanks to our Creator. Throughout the service the music was bilingual (English and Spanish). The readings were proclaimed in both languages. The psalms were also prayed in Spanish and English. The gospel, too, was proclaimed in two languages–English and Tewa, a Native American tongue. The homilist was Cardinal Marc Ouellet of Quebec, Canada. After the homily, a representation of a men’s society dating back hundreds of years to Spain offered a traditional prayer of praise and thanksgiving in song, sung in Spanish, of course. The service was extraordinary! The integration of the various cultures drew everyone deeper into the prayer experience.

[SIGN]“Spread love everywhere you go: first of all in your own house. Give love to your children, to your wife or husband, to a next-door neighbor… Let no one ever come to you without leaving better and happier. Be the living expression of God’s kindness; kindness in your face, kindness in your eyes, kindness in your smile, kindness in your warm greeting.”

Blessed Mother Teresa of Calcutta[/SIGN]
So, let us celebrate our diversity rather than lament the differences. We should follow the example set forth by the cardinals, archbishops and bishops of our great country and welcome one another with open arms rather than closing the door. Thank you, to those that have expressed their support of ministering to me and my brethren of different ethnicities.

Imagine where we’d be had the innkeeper not welcomed the “new-comers” and closed the door on Joseph and Mary?

¡Que Dios les bendiga!

Just found this thread now and I’m jumping in here. The Monday after that Mass, I went to the final day of the Novena in honor of La Conquistadora at the Cathedral. (Talk about 9 days of spending time with Hispanics in church, It was enriching, fulling and spiritual and wouldn’t change it for the world.)

Anyway, Archbishop Sheehan talked about the that particular service during his Homily (it may have been the Sunday evening Mass) and how honored he was to host all the bishops at our Cathedral Basilica and our Archdiocese. He was honored to share our rich, cultural heritage. From what I understand they all found it quite lovely and enriching. .

Part of what I love about being Catholic (and from NM) is the long history and cultural ties to Spanish Catholicism. Sometimes I don’t think people in this country realize that there is a 400-year-old history of Catholicism in this country and that was brought here by Hispanics. (I read back through the thread and saw that it was mentioned.)

One thing about the culture and the Catholicism here is that is all-embracing and very strong.

Mia