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grandfather
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Logic is not a strong suit of Protestanism on one hand, but not all Catholics are logicak either.
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catheflower
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Hitler did have Jewish lineage. I think it was his maternal grandmother.
Hitler was an occultist.
Hitler was an occultist.
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paarsurrey
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Hi
The AtheistAgnostics are clever enough, they own no government in the past, the communist rule failed and it was ruthless and cruel AtheistAgnostic rule.
Thanks
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ralphinal
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This is so very true!!!
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grandfather
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The past century was the bloddiest most violent century in history. There was more blood spilled than in all previous centuries combined. WWII saw tens of millions of deaths, the majority of which was civilian death. It was initiated by an atheist ideology. Stalin murdered 20 million of his own people, starved 7 million Ukranians and sent off another 7 million to die in the gulags. Mao murdered 150 million Chinese. Pol Pot murdered 40 percent of his people in his infamous killing fields. All of it under the auspices of atheist ideology. Americans have murdered tens of millions of their unborn and the world wide total is many multiples higher. This is under the auspices of governemt by the people which insists there is no place in it for the voice of religion.
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inthecloud
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That is news to me, In my opinion is a hoax from certain atheists in order to counter the atheism=comunist attacks.
I’m a WWII buff and a collector (including original weapons and equipment) and modeller. I have whole bookshelves of the subject and several books on Hitler.
He renounced Christianity early except for public purposes like many “cultural” prochoice “Catholics” do now.
He was a neo pagan, mixing pagan beliefs with Nietzchean philosophy. He saw like Nietzche that Christianity had a weakning effect on culture. He wanted to create a new man that will not have the infused weakness of Christianity. Thats was the whole idea behind the SS and Himmler the boss of the SS was a avid neopagan too.
Hitler was a neopagan. Period.
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KatyElizabeth
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From a paper written by atheist activist (despiser of Catholicism) Anne Nicol Gaylor who claims Hitler to be Roman Catholic in good standing.
ffrf.org/fttoday/back/hitler.html
…You will find it in Mein Kampf: “Therefore, I am convinced that I am acting as the agent of our Creator. By fighting off the Jews, I am doing the Lord’s Work.”
{snip}
In a Reichstag speech in 1938, Hitler again echoed the religious origins of his crusade. “I believe today that I am acting in the sense of the Almighty Creator. By warding off the Jews, I am fighting for the Lord’s work.”…
I suppose these quotes could be verified.
Hitler’s religion is irrelevant, IMO.
ffrf.org/fttoday/back/hitler.html
…You will find it in Mein Kampf: “Therefore, I am convinced that I am acting as the agent of our Creator. By fighting off the Jews, I am doing the Lord’s Work.”
{snip}
In a Reichstag speech in 1938, Hitler again echoed the religious origins of his crusade. “I believe today that I am acting in the sense of the Almighty Creator. By warding off the Jews, I am fighting for the Lord’s work.”…
I suppose these quotes could be verified.
Hitler’s religion is irrelevant, IMO.
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Valke2
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there’s really zero proof that Hitler’s grandfather was Jewish. (it is certain that his maternal grandmother wasn’t. ) The remote possibility of his grandfather being Jewish is based on the fact that his fahter, Alois, was registered as an illegitimate child with no father. Alois’ mother worked in the home of a wealthy Jew and there is some chance a son in that household got the woman (i.e., Hitler’s grandmother) pregnant. So, it is feasibly possible that Hitler’s grandmother (a non-jew) had his father out of wedlock with a man who was Jewish.
John Toland, Adolf Hitler, NY: Anchor Books, 1992
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Swan
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Thank you for metioning Toland’s work on Hitler. I have found it to be the best and recommend it for anyone interested in learing more about the man. Much of what has been written about Hitler is nonsense (no, I do not have the time or inclination to get into this a I would have to pull out a bunch of books, find references, etc. - just do some googling on your own if interested). Incorrect things were written and then used by later writers. Toland is as accurate as it gets, as is Speer in my opinion.
Hitler used to play preist as a kid but he outgrew it. I’ve never read anything about him even pretending to be a practicing Catholic, or even a practicing Christian, as an adult. He did appear to believe in destiny, for lack of a better word, as he believed it was his destiny to lead Germany to world domination. His doctor was a quack (Dr. Morel) and he gave Hitler more and more of who knows what as time when on and I firmly believe that led to both his mental and physical deterioration which was evident by the early 1940s. He was less and less rational so whatever he might have believed during that period may not relate to his beliefs from say WWI forward. Having said that, from what I’ve read his belief system really didn’t lead to catagorization. Agnostic deist? An oxymoron but considering how complex he was, perhaps fitting in a way.
Personally, I find Hitler to be one of the most fascinating people who ever lived and judging from the number of books about him, I’m not alone.
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Mirdath
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paarsurrey, that’s beneath you and you know it. Stalin and Mao, among others, were totalitarians who happened to be atheists; Franco, Pinochet, Mussolini, and Ferdinand Marcos, among others, were totalitarians who happened to be Catholics; Pol Pot and Park Chung-Hee were totalitarians who happened to be Buddhists; we can keep going with Suharto, Idi Amin, Charles Taylor, Khomeini, and all the rest of that happy bunch if you like. But you’ve already said ‘what’s the point?’ – so what is?
The thing each of these people had in common was obviously not religion: it was their style of government, which did not allow for anyone to report to a higher power – even a possibly imaginary one – than the dictator. Anything that even looked bigger than they were was a threat, unless they figured they had a divine mandate from it. And they had the means and the will to attempt to get rid of such influences. That is what went wrong with each and every one of those, atheist, Catholic, Baptist, Buddhist, and Muslim alike.
Well, a particular cherry-picked and ‘edited’ version of Nietzsche’s philosophy he got from Friedrich’s sister Elizabeth after the man himself died. Nietzsche despised jingoism, didn’t think any better of anti-Semitism, and his übermench did not have blond hair and blue eyes. But being thoroughly dead, there wasn’t much he could do about it.
I’m starting to think I should put that in my sig. It’s gotta be at least the fifth time I’ve posted a defense of Nietzsche in response to someone who, WWII buff or no, obviously knows next to nothing about the bad boys of 19th century philosophy.
‘I am now as before a Catholic and will always remain so’, A. H. in a conversation with Gerhard Engel, 1941.
But you know what, you’ve probably made up your mind and I doubt there’s anything to be done for that. I’ve said my piece. If you’re interested in further reading, Uncle Cecil has, as always, an informative and entertaining article.
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paarsurrey
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Hi
I agree with you. The rulers are politicians; irrespective of the religion they hold or not hold.
Thanks
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inthecloud
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Any deist, pantheist, neopagan and open theist could have said that.
No proof of Catholicsm at all.
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Timothysis
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Hitler said that Pope Pius XII was his greatest enemy and even concocted a plan to kidnap him.
Hitler allowed the free practice of the Church in Germany as long as it stuck to religion and stayed away from politics. The reason that he didn’t try to depose the Church (or invade Vatican City) was because many conscripted Germans in the army were Catholics and would have not accepted such an action. The plan was, much like Napolean, to get rid of the church once the war was over.
I agree with the above poster who said that Hitler was most likely a neo-pagan.
Hitler allowed the free practice of the Church in Germany as long as it stuck to religion and stayed away from politics. The reason that he didn’t try to depose the Church (or invade Vatican City) was because many conscripted Germans in the army were Catholics and would have not accepted such an action. The plan was, much like Napolean, to get rid of the church once the war was over.
I agree with the above poster who said that Hitler was most likely a neo-pagan.
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SIA
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Sublime_Prince
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If you look closely at all the Nazi symbols they point to the ancient egyptian religon about Horus and Sirus. If he really believed this I don’t know though, maybe he liked what the symbols symbolized but really didn’t believe it. I tend to think hitler was probably an athiest and against any religion.
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Kaninchen
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Threads about Hitler’s religion or (particularly) Pius XII are wonderfully irrelevant I always think. After lots of posts proving ‘conclusively’ not only that, under no circumstances whatsoever was any of it the fault of any Catholic but of atheists, protestants or pagans but also that every rabbi ever to bump into Pius immediately converted to Catholicism, everybody can sit around waiting for the next opportunity to convince themselves that the Reich’s main purpose was to persecute Catholics.
A-historic, it certainly is – let nobody speak of the part played by Catholicism (no, not just Orthodoxy, Protestantism and the odd pagan) in creating the anti-Semitic environment, the anti-Semitic paradigm in Europe over the centuries (anybody wishing to see one way in which it worked, consult any of the ‘Muslim ate my hamster’ threads on CAF). Let’s remember the good bits, the odd Catholic who helped Jews, for example, but don’t, for heaven’s sake, mention things like the disproportionate number of Catholic Austrians involved in the running of the ‘Final Solution’.
None of it was uniquely the fault of Catholics, Protestants or, for that matter, Pagans – a large percentage of members of all those groups played their part in the Reich – none of it could have happened otherwise - members of all those groups also suffered because of it.
A-historic, it certainly is – let nobody speak of the part played by Catholicism (no, not just Orthodoxy, Protestantism and the odd pagan) in creating the anti-Semitic environment, the anti-Semitic paradigm in Europe over the centuries (anybody wishing to see one way in which it worked, consult any of the ‘Muslim ate my hamster’ threads on CAF). Let’s remember the good bits, the odd Catholic who helped Jews, for example, but don’t, for heaven’s sake, mention things like the disproportionate number of Catholic Austrians involved in the running of the ‘Final Solution’.
None of it was uniquely the fault of Catholics, Protestants or, for that matter, Pagans – a large percentage of members of all those groups played their part in the Reich – none of it could have happened otherwise - members of all those groups also suffered because of it.
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ralphinal
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Granted, it is correct and fair to say that Catholics were involved, some in a very large way. CAn it be said that the Catholic Church, through its teachings and doctrines, caused people to join along? Was Hitler evil because he was exposed to Catholic teaching, as some claim?
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hawkeye
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He believed in whatever fueled his twisted desire for a one world government, he was an occultist, and an Antichrist, I know lots of people who were born Catholic and don’t practice it, like I know lots of non-catholics that do the same.
They just don’t get the media coverage that Hitler did.
They just don’t get the media coverage that Hitler did.
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Michael_Neal
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I think Maximilain Kolbe and all of the Polish Catholic Martyrs would disagree that Hitler was pro-Catholic
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Claude_Kenneson
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I’m sure one can find pictures of American flags in U.S. Catholic churches; American bishops and priests saluting the American flag; American bishops and priests (and even the Pope) shaking Bush’s hand or being in his presence; U.S.politicians and military men in front of Catholic Churches; U.S. politicans and militarymen attending Catholic services or being married in Catholic churches, etc. I dare say that is probably true of any country. Why would it be different in Germany?
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