Holding hands during the Our Father.

[vsedriver]

I’ve never seen our altar servers hold hands but some in the congregation do. I hold hands with my family. If someone reaches for my hand I will hold hands with them. I don’t see it as a huge error or dangerous liturgical wrong.

I often hear that people feel isolated and unwelcome at Mass. Making a little physical contact can be very welcoming. But I don’t initiate it because I don’t want to make those who don’t like it uncomfortable. Likewise I won’t embarrass someone by refusing to hold their hand.

I shake the hands of strangers so why not hold the hand of a fellow parishioner?

 

[Havard]

I’ve never seen our altar servers hold hands but some in the congregation do. I hold hands with my family. If someone reaches for my hand I will hold hands with them. I don’t see it as a huge error or dangerous liturgical wrong.

I often hear that people feel isolated and unwelcome at Mass. Making a little physical contact can be very welcoming. But I don’t initiate it because I don’t want to make those who don’t like it uncomfortable. Likewise I won’t embarrass someone by refusing to hold their hand.

I shake the hands of strangers so why not hold the hand of a fellow parishioner?

Well for starters, shaking hands during the sign of peace conforms to Sacrosanctum Concilium and the Code of Canon Law, while holding hands during the Pater Noster does not. It’s not up to us to decide what may be added to the liturgy.

 

[Cristiano]

I know it is not required. A lot of the altar servers do it and it is getting on my nerves. I hate holding hands. How do I tell them to stop.

It is not only not required but at least in one diocese the Bishop forbade it but people kept doing it. I try to avoid holding hands but I had people grabbing my hand and at that point I just offer it to God.

 

[wild_thing]

When I first reverted back to the Church, I went to mass at my parish and saw people holding hands during the Our Father, and I thought, “When in the heck did we start doing this?” So for the next couple of years, I held hands with members of my own family only, because that is what the congregation was doing. However, now that we have a more traditional archbishop, I have noticed the hand-holding in our parish has dwindled down to people who are either die-hard hand holders or else don’t go to church regularly. I no longer hold hands with my family members because one of our associate pastors said it was a practice carried over from the Lutherans and he did’t really like to see the congregation doing it. I don’t have a major hang up over it, but I don’t care for it either, truthfully. It doesn’t seem very- I don’t know- ‘Catholic’ to do so…is that too snotty of a statement? I don’t say it to be exclusive or mean, just that it doesn’t seem like a traditional gesture.

 

[happymommy]

Well for starters, shaking hands during the sign of peace conforms to Sacrosanctum Concilium and the Code of Canon Law, while holding hands during the Pater Noster does not. It’s not up to us to decide what may be added to the liturgy.

I don’t see how holding my husband’s hand can been seen as me trying to add to the liturgy I’ve been known to hold his hand during Mass at other times too, bad Catholic that I am…sometimes during the homily he will even put his arm around my shoulder

 

[JM3]

Well for starters, shaking hands during the sign of peace conforms to Sacrosanctum Concilium and the Code of Canon Law, while holding hands during the Pater Noster does not. It’s not up to us to decide what may be added to the liturgy.

Citations, please. I do not see where in Sacrosanctum Concilium or the Code of Canon Law where ‘shaking hands during the sign of peace’ is required.

 

[Havard]

I don’t see how holding my husband’s hand can been seen as me trying to add to the liturgy I’ve been known to hold his hand during Mass at other times too, bad Catholic that I am…sometimes during the homily he will even put his arm around my shoulder

But this isn’t about what we individually understand or what we individually think is okay, it’s about what the rubrics instruct us to do.

To quote Jimmy Akin, who’s written a lot on the sacred liturgy “Standing means standing without doing anything fancy with your arms. It is distinct, for example, from the orans posture, which the priest uses when he stands and prays with arms outstretched. It is also distinct from the hand-holding posture.”

If you think this interpretation of the rubrics is flawed, by all means offer evidence to prove the bishops and theologians who disagree with you wrong. But if you simply don’t like the rubrics, that’s obviously not an adequate justification to ignore them.

 

[thomas_jd]

I know it is not required. A lot of the altar servers do it and it is getting on my nerves. I hate holding hands. How do I tell them to stop.

The pastor is responsible for the proper training of servers.You may copy and bring some directives from altar servers manuals to show your objections to the servers hand holding but I believe the pastor normally is aware of this practise .
You can offer your services to train the servers. Short of that you are probally stuck with what you have.

 

[JM3]

It’s not required, but **it’s not liturgically incorrect **either. There’s nothing wrong with it, but I understand how it can be distracting.

This is correct.

The plain truth is: The church has said not to add or remove things to the liturgy. That means people, especially the servers should not be doing things like this.

It is not adding or removing anything from the litugy. That which is not in the GIRM is left to the Bishop and to local custom.

in one diocese the Bishop forbade it

The Bishop has the authority to do this. The Bishop also has the authority to not forbid it.

I don’t see how holding my husband’s hand can been seen as me trying to add to the liturgy I’ve been known to hold his hand during Mass at other times too, bad Catholic that I am…sometimes during the homily he will even put his arm around my shoulder

Some people are more concerned with the letter of the law then with it’s intent.

 

[Havard]

Some people are more concerned with the letter of the law then with it’s intent.

You can ask me, or other posters why we think the way we think. Or you could talk about “some people” and generalize in an uncharitable way, wherein you don’t have to prove anything, because “some people” could be anyone you’ve ever met or talked to… who may well be completely unrepresentative of those of us who are against hand-holding. Personally, I think the former would be a lot more Christian.

 

[happymommy]

But this isn’t about what we individually understand or what we individually think is okay, it’s about what the rubrics instruct us to do.

To quote Jimmy Akin, who’s written a lot on the sacred liturgy “Standing means standing without doing anything fancy with your arms. It is distinct, for example, from the orans posture, which the priest uses when he stands and prays with arms outstretched. It is also distinct from the hand-holding posture.”

If you think this interpretation of the rubrics is flawed, by all means offer evidence to prove the bishops and theologians who disagree with you wrong. But if you simply don’t like the rubrics, that’s obviously not an adequate justification to ignore them.

I wouldn’t say flawed, just really not a big deal. I think in the grand scheme of things it’s not worth the fuss some people make of it.
Should have read the rubrics a little better I guess. They should tell you these things in RCIA, I didn’t realize to become Catholic meant you go to Mass, don’t look at anyone, don’t talk to anyone or make any contact at all with other people in the church…then you go home. I once thought being Catholic was great but the more I study it, the more I learn, the more I move away from it. I personally get nothing out of mass. Of course from being on this forum I’ve learned it’s not about feelings, it’s about putting that one hour a week in and make sure you do it right or it doesn’t count; so I guess I shouldn’t worry about feeling nothing while I’m there as long as my hands are at my sides while standing.

 

[Havard]

I wouldn’t say flawed, just really not a big deal. I think in the grand scheme of things it’s not worth the fuss some people make of it.
Should have read the rubrics a little better I guess. They should tell you these things in RCIA, I didn’t realize to become Catholic meant you go to Mass, don’t look at anyone, don’t talk to anyone or make any contact at all with other people in the church…then you go home. I once thought being Catholic was great but the more I study it, the more I learn, the more I move away from it. I personally get nothing out of mass. Of course from being on this forum I’ve learned it’s not about feelings, it’s about putting that one hour a week in and make sure you do it right or it doesn’t count; so I guess I shouldn’t worry about feeling nothing while I’m there as long as my hands are at my sides while standing.

Do you really feel this way? If so, I’m very sorry. The Mass should be so much more for you.

Regarding what I’ve said about posture, perhaps this publication will put things in context: usccb.org/romanmissal/resources-bulletins3.shtml

It’s not supposed to be ‘going through motions’, there is a very deep and loving meaning to it all!

 

[ESMDHokie77]

happymommy,

I truly hope that you become more endeared to our Lord in the Eucharist. We get the Eucharist out of Mass!

Peace,
Phil

 

[vsedriver]

I don’t see how holding my husband’s hand can been seen as me trying to add to the liturgy I’ve been known to hold his hand during Mass at other times too, bad Catholic that I am…sometimes during the homily he will even put his arm around my shoulder

exactly. I do not see the liturgy as so strict that it dictates every body position. If I want to pray holding a loved one’s hand then I see nothing illicit in that action. I’m not jumping in the aisles calling attention to myself. I am holding a loved one’s hand.

Personally I consider all my fellow Catholics as loved ones.

 

[happymommy]

Do you really feel this way? If so, I’m very sorry. The Mass should be so much more for you.

Regarding what I’ve said about posture, perhaps this publication will put things in context: usccb.org/romanmissal/resources-bulletins3.shtml

It’s not supposed to be ‘going through motions’, there is a very deep and loving meaning to it all!

Yes, it’s really how I feel. It’s a deep struggle and I am just going through the motions with it. For right now, it’s as good as it gets for me.

 

[Havard]

Yes, it’s really how I feel. It’s a deep struggle and I am just going through the motions with it. For right now, it’s as good as it gets for me.

Please do read that link I posted then. I have a feeling it may be of interest. Also, do you mind if I pray for you with regard to this struggle?

 

[happymommy]

Please do read that link I posted then. I have a feeling it may be of interest. Also, do you mind if I pray for you with regard to this struggle?

Please do, I could use all the help I can get. Thank you!

 

[Havard]

exactly. I do not see the liturgy as so strict that it dictates every body position. If I want to pray holding a loved one’s hand then I see nothing illicit in that action. I’m not jumping in the aisles calling attention to myself. I am holding a loved one’s hand.

Personally I consider all my fellow Catholics as loved ones.

Hey, I hope we all do! Sorry if I sound like a broken record, but check out that link, I think it may help clarify why the postures are “strict” as you say.

 

[JM3]

You can ask me, or other posters why we think the way we think. Or you could talk about “some people” and generalize in an uncharitable way, wherein you don’t have to prove anything, because “some people” could be anyone you’ve ever met or talked to… who may well be completely unrepresentative of those of us who are against hand-holding. Personally, I think the former would be a lot more Christian.

I do not need to ask you why you think the way you do. FYI, I voted ‘NO, Never’. I don’t believe it adds anything to the Our Father to hold hands, nor does it take anything away. I do not like the ‘raising of the hands’ at the doxology, as I think it seperates them from the priest. But that is just my opinion.

I did notice that your link does not have a directive about holding hands at the Our Father.

If you have a directive from Rome about this subject, then, please, post it.

 

[Havard]

I do not need to ask you why you think the way you do. FYI, I voted ‘NO, Never’. I don’t believe it adds anything to the Our Father to hold hands, nor does it take anything away. I do not like the ‘raising of the hands’ at the doxology, as I think it seperates them from the priest. But that is just my opinion.

I did notice that your link does not have a directive about holding hands at the Our Father.

If you have a directive from Rome about this subject, then, please, post it.

It appears you misread/misunderstood my posts. I linked an article that I thought would be helpful to happymommy and vsedriver in response to their comments about the strictness of postures in general. I never offered it up for the purposes of proving that the Church forbids handholding.

That said, it does greatly reinforce my belief (and the Church’s tradition) that posture is extremely important. So although I didn’t intend to offer it as some kind of evidence against hand-holding, I certainly believe that it gives credence to the interpretation found by many theologians that hand-holding rises to the level of ‘adding’ to the Mass.