Holy Trinity

[upciguy26]

All of your references show that God is emphasizing that He and only He is God. He is not revealing His essence as Trinity and your quotes above do not undermine that essence. While only God saves, He does not change His mind in the New Testament when He sends us Jesus as our savior. Yes, there is even now no God beside Himself who is eternally triune. God could NEVER ever (since God is not in time) speak of Himself in any way that would allow Himself to change His eternal essence as Trinity. So while your quotes above may have been interpreted as God being alone, we know through God’s fullest revelation in Christ that He is one God in three distinct Persons. This has been revealed through Christ and has been taught by the Church for almost 2000 years.

All of those scripture verses are still as pertinent today as they were then. Jesus did not come to change who God is. Quite the contrary. He came to show us who God is and He Himself claims divinity…teachccd

No it has not been taught completely for 2000 years. The ones who haven’t taught trinity are considered heretics or their church’s are not churches. However despite the opinion of the mainstream, the scriptures do not declare a multiple person God. The scriptures declare a God that is alone and that is revealed through the person of his Son who was and is God’s Word.

God and his Word and his Spirit have existed eternally. However his Word and his Spirit are part of HIM.

God does not change, he is a ME… therefore any triunity God has can be spoken as an I and a HIM… therefore making God one personal being, distinctly shown in three different ways. One God, triune in manifestation, single in essence.

Jesus came to show us the Father and his Word. He did that because he was his Word who is the same as God and manifested the Father to us. Everything Jesus did was of the Father. His words, his works, his deity… all belong to yahweh/jehovah. Our God shares glory with no one. Jesus is the power and authority of God… he is the Lord almighty incarnate. Revelation 1:8.

The revelation is not that God is triune… but that God is one and that one is only seen in the face of his Son Jesus… who is God himself in human flesh… Emmanuel.

 

[Prodigal_Son1]

No it has not been taught completely for 2000 years. The ones who haven’t taught trinity are considered heretics or their church’s are not churches. However despite the opinion of the mainstream, the scriptures do not declare a multiple person God. The scriptures declare a God that is alone and that is revealed through the person of his Son who was and is God’s Word.

God and his Word and his Spirit have existed eternally. However his Word and his Spirit are part of HIM.

God does not change, he is a ME… therefore any triunity God has can be spoken as an I and a HIM… therefore making God one personal being, distinctly shown in three different ways. One God, triune in manifestation, single in essence.

Jesus came to show us the Father and his Word. He did that because he was his Word who is the same as God and manifested the Father to us. Everything Jesus did was of the Father. His words, his works, his deity… all belong to yahweh/jehovah. Our God shares glory with no one. Jesus is the power and authority of God… he is the Lord almighty incarnate. Revelation 1:8.

The revelation is not that God is triune… but that God is one and that one is only seen in the face of his Son Jesus… who is God himself in human flesh… Emmanuel.

Please, see some verses I am providing below, and I declare, the very first one is Jesus saying the Father will send the Holy Ghost!

Joh 14:26 But the Paraclete, the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he will teach you all things and bring all things to your mind, whatsoever I shall have said to you.

Act 13:2 And as they were ministering to the Lord and fasting, the Holy Ghost said to them: Separate me Saul and Barnabas, for the work whereunto I have taken them.

1Co 2:11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, but the spirit of a man that is in him? So the things also that are of God, no man knoweth, but the Spirit of God.

1Jn 5:7 And there are Three who give testimony in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost. And these three are one.

Mat 28:19 Going therefore, teach ye all nations: baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Ghost.

What version of the Bible are you using?

May the peace of the Lord be with you,
Prodigal Son1

 

[Chris_Patterson]

One of my favorite glimpses into the Trinity is:

Isaiah 9:6
For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders. And he will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

In it, the Christ is described as –

Wonderful Counselor (a name for the Holy Spirit)
Mighty God (name for God)
Everlasting Father (name for Father God)
Prince of Peace (name for the Son)

In Matthew 4:10 Jesus quotes Deuteronomy 6 saying that we may only worship God. God is the only proper recipient of our worship. Yet the Wisemen from the East came to worship Jesus (Matthew 2:2). And Jesus allowed Himself to be worshiped (Matthew 14:33 and 28:17). He is clearly worshiped in Revelation.

It is good to think and analyze, but we get into trouble when we try to get our finite logic around the concept of the Trinity. It is not a copout to call some things a mystery!

 

[Huiou_Theou]

Is the Holy Trinity mentioned in the Old Testament? Do all Christian religions believe in the Holy Trinity as Catholics do?

The arguments have revolved around the angelic and “divine word” – and I find many of the arguments shallow, though thought provoking. I will attempt to mix two thoughts at once, and hope their complimetarity (not confusion) is of use.

Most of the old testament examples appear to have allready been mentioned – but there is one conspicuous example which is overlooked:

When Moses saw God in the burning bush (which occasion, wither the first or a little known second time, being beyond my point):.

The new testament scriptures make the point clear that what was actually seen was an angel. Acts 7:30-32 – "Forty years later … an angel appeared to him in the flames of a bush that was on fire. … As he went nearer to look at it, the voice of the lord was heard.

Think about it – if one is seeing an messenger speak – the messenger has the actual voice being heard and “body” being seen. Yet the scriptures do not attribute the voice to the angel itself but to God who sent the angel. The messenger is not abouve the sender, for his presence is the power of the one sending.

I don’t think the “Clinton” library was actually built by Mr. Clinton! But it bears his name as the power which enacted the existance of the library. Just so, when Angels do what God bids – there is nothing unusual about ignoring the one who actually physically makes an event happen in preference for the director of that event.

Just so, Angels embody the word of God – in as much as they speak God’s word. An angel is the very mouth of God through whom the father spoke of old.

Notice for example the Angels at the tomb after Jesus’ resurrection:
John 20:12 “and saw two angels in white sitting where Jesus had been … they said ‘woman why are you weeping?’ … she turned around and saw Jesus standing there, though she did not recognize him. Jesus said, ‘woman, Why are you weeping.’” – the messenger and the message are identical in origin and carry the same meaning.

Now, this burning bush – which was an angel – is certainly a creation. Something made the flames which consumed nothing yet was a light to catch man’s eye!

Psalm 104:
“Yahweh my God, how great you are! Clothed in majesty and glory, wrapped in a robe of light … [4] you use the winds as messengers and firey flames as servants.” An angel is literally a “messenger”. Some translations speak the same psalm emphasizing the originator of the message even more: " Who maketh his angels spirits; his ministers a flaming fire" But the point is that the messenger bears the image of one sending the message.

In the passage of Genesis – “Let US make man in OUR image” – only a common image could be copied, and thus (really) only the image of the one giving the command. So, I find distinguishing whether “angels” are included in that image irrelevant – they are merely images of the creator themselves. Man too is an image of that same God – even the Pagans recognized this! Note, for example, St. Paul uses this common understanding as an apologetic:

Acts 17:28 For in him we live, and move, and have our being; as certain also of your own poets have said, For we are also his offspring

So, then, back to the burning bush – what is it that the Lord actually says there, and that Moses actually asks with angels creating the flames of the vision? The angels are clearly creators of SOMETHING though not its originator, but to be concise I will omit more argument on that point for now.

In deference to one earlier post, which points out Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob which met God in his messengers – the passage about Moses meeting God says that this “God” is the God of these patriarchs. Yet even that is not enough; Moses seeks power over God by knowing his name so that he may call upon him when in need:

Exodus 3:13;
Behold, when I come unto the children of Israel, and shall say unto them, The God of your fathers hath sent me unto you; and they shall say to me, What is his name?

And it is to this SINGULAR request for a SINGLE name (not names) that God replies – THREE times.

Exodu 3:14 And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you.
Exodu 3:15 And God said moreover unto Moses, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, The LORD God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, hath sent me unto you: this is my name for ever, and this is my memorial unto all generations.

The name is relational – cause, being, and a personal name of God to those related to him in some way. The nation “Israel” – his first born son.

This, I find to be a difficult passage to dismiss when speaking of God as three in one – a trinity. Not “modalities” but realtionships, persons. What I have seen so far in the thread makes me wonder what the word “person” means to upciguy26. I am not sure it means what he thinks it means!

 

[rcjones]

What I have seen so far in the thread makes me wonder what the word “person” means to upciguy26. I am not sure it means what he thinks it means!

Sometimes I wish we has another word. However, it is evident that the will of Jesus was not identical to that of the Father, or he would not have asked for the cup to be removed.

He submitted his will to that of the Father. This is an important point for a discussion of “persons”. over “modes”.

 

[Grace_Angel]

Is the Holy Trinity mentioned in the Old Testament? Do all Christian religions believe in the Holy Trinity as Catholics do?

Hello Holland,
I believe that the most obvious place to see the Trinity in Old Testament without naming “Trinity” is Genesis 18. 1-5) "Yahweh appeared to him at the Oak of Mamre while he was sitting by the entrance of the tent during the hottest part of the day. He looked up and there he saw three men standing near him etc…)
We are told that Yahweh appeared to him (Abraham) but he (Abraham) saw three men standing near him.
Anyway I have always seen this as a visible imagery of the Trinity in the Old Testament.
Key words for me were “Yahweh appeared” (1 person) and three men. Hence Trinity being Yahweh.
I hope I have explained myself OK.
Blessings
GraceAngel.

 

[JenMM]

As one of the bloggers pointed out, Jesus had not been revealed, so the full revelation would not be explicit in the Old Testament.
However, there are prefigurations there - if the Old Testament types prefigured Jesus, then obviously there would be some ‘hints’.
Start at Genesis. In the beginning God - spoke His Word, and the Spirit hovered.
The three mysterious guests that Abraham enetertained unawares.
In Isaiah 6, the threfold Holy,Holy, Holy. Saint John (John 12:41) says that this was a vision of Jesus in glory.
There is a fascinating DVD 'The Jewish Roots of the Eucharist by Dr Brant Pitre (St Joseph Communications) in which he says that in the Temple the Jews would have seen visual representations of the Trinity - the Ark of the Covenant, which for the Jews held the what they presence of God, (although in the New Testament it is Mary who is seen as the new Ark of the Covenant bearing Jesus), the golden lampstands denoting the Spirit of God, and the Bread of the Presence, (also translated as the Bread of the Face, and less acurately, Shewbread)which of course prefigured Jesus in the Eucharist.
We do not have to seek in the text of the Old Testament only for ‘proof texts’, but also think about what what they are showing and what they told the Hebrew people to do.

 

[susanj19]

Actually, JWs don’t believe that Jesus ever claimed to be God. The verses in John’s gospel that have Jesus saying “I AM” they understand to simply mean that he existed long before Abraham. They believe that the Father first created the Son and that the two of them existed together before any other creations. I am Catholic and have been talking to a JW couple in their 60s, who were raised JW, and they think that the word theos in the last part of John 1:1 can also be translated as divine ( or like a god), which to them doesn’t mean almighty God. They take the verse in Isaiah that prophesies about the Messiah being a Mighty God and again translate that as meaning the Son has mighty powers given to him by the almighty and that he is a divine being (god). If you try telling them that there are no real lower case “gods”, they will say that Jesus is the only “god”, the only one between the almighty and the angels. And according to this couple, who are very sincere in what they believe, they THINK that Jesus MIGHT BE the archangel Michael. The verses that they use to say that even Jesus, after his resurrection, says that he has a God are Rev. 2:3 and 2:12 when Jesus says “my God” and the “city of my God” etc. And when I mention the verse in Isaiah that has God saying “I created everything by MYSELF” they will say that the almighty God is the masterplanner who had the Son be the craftsman.(whatever that means). Like I told them, God just has to speak a word and whatever he wants to be created IS created. He doesn’t need a workman. Then they refer me to Proverbs ch.8 I believe that speaks about the Son as a craftman. Oh well, I keep trying.

 

[jcrichton]

All of these can fit either. However if God said he was a ME… then thats what he is.

Jesus is being baptized (The Son) and the Father’s voice is speaking from heaven… and the Holy Ghost is appearing in the form of a Dove. All at one time. You would think that this proves 3 separate person. However God is a Spirit (John 4:24) and a HIM/ME (Isaiah 43:11)…

So to fit into what God is, God speaks from heaven, God’s deity is within his Son (John 14:6) and God’s Spirit is his Spirit (The HOly Ghost)

All three different manifestations of God… one a voice from heaven, one deity within the Son standing in the water… and one in the form of a dove as the Holy Ghost…

No scripture disproves God to be the same being/person that displays in three distinct ways at the same time.

Therefore that does not mean God, his Son, and His Spirit are three different persons. SInce God said… beside ME there is no Saviour (Is. 43:11)… the Father, Word, and Spirit is a ME…

Since the Father, Word, and Spirit are all the same God… a ME… a SPIRIT (John 4:24)

The person of the SON therefore comes from his humanity which coupled with Jesus’ deity as the WORD… inseparable

Your logic and reason is very skewed and outside of praying for your enlightenment I cannot see how offering more Biblical passages can gain us anything more…

I will pray that the Holy Spirit may enlighten you to understand Yahweh God’s way and stop rejecting His revelations.

Maran atha!

Angel

 

[jcrichton]

Actually, JWs don’t believe that Jesus ever claimed to be God. The verses in John’s gospel that have Jesus saying “I AM” they understand to simply mean that he existed long before Abraham. They believe that the Father first created the Son and that the two of them existed together before any other creations. I am Catholic and have been talking to a JW couple in their 60s, who were raised JW, and they think that the word theos in the last part of John 1:1 can also be translated as divine ( or like a god), which to them doesn’t mean almighty God. They take the verse in Isaiah that prophesies about the Messiah being a Mighty God and again translate that as meaning the Son has mighty powers given to him by the almighty and that he is a divine being (god). If you try telling them that there are no real lower case “gods”, they will say that Jesus is the only “god”, the only one between the almighty and the angels. And according to this couple, who are very sincere in what they believe, they THINK that Jesus MIGHT BE the archangel Michael. The verses that they use to say that even Jesus, after his resurrection, says that he has a God are Rev. 2:3 and 2:12 when Jesus says “my God” and the “city of my God” etc. And when I mention the verse in Isaiah that has God saying “I created everything by MYSELF” they will say that the almighty God is the masterplanner who had the Son be the craftsman.(whatever that means). Like I told them, God just has to speak a word and whatever he wants to be created IS created. He doesn’t need a workman. Then they refer me to Proverbs ch.8 I believe that speaks about the Son as a craftman. Oh well, I keep trying.

Hi, Susan!

The best you can do is pray for them… as I understand it they have an initial three-year-indoctrination period where all of the twisted interpretations of the Holy Scriptures are embedded into their minds–citing Scriptures doesn’t help; reason doesn’t help… listening to them only encourages their resolved that they are the true believers… they claim that they are the visible church of God while denying all Scripture that contradict their theology.

They have a false sense of security as they claim Jehovah as their God; yet, Yahweh God is the One who tells us to Listen to Jesus, His Only Begotten Son! (Coincidentally, that’s the only Name given by which all are to be saved!)

Maran atha!

Angel

 

[susanj19]

Chris,
The word worship when used in ancient times is not identical to the word’s meaning today. Some people used to say that Catholics worshipped Mary! The shock of this is misunderstood. Worship today only means praise offered to God whereas in past times it also had another meaning- to venerate or show respect. I even heard a priest talking about this on a CD. He used the old definition of “worship” in reference to Mary and then after the congregation gasped, he realized that he should never use the old definition because people today only know the modern definition. There is a verse when the angels “worshipped” Jesus (I think after his temptations by the devil.) This could mean “paid homage to God” or it could mean that the angels came and “waited on him out of reverence for him”.
Also, another thing most people don’t know: the word, UNTIL, also in past times did not have the same meaning as it does today. Today it implies that an action did eventually happen. In the verse: “Joseph and Mary had no relations until (or 'til) the birth of Jesus”.The past definition meant only “up until that point”. It does not imply that the Virgin Mary and Joseph EVER had sex. There are many examples in the Bible that prove this point.:: “Michal the daughter of Saul had no children UNTIL the day of her death” (2 Sam6:23). Noah’s bird “went forth and did not return until the waters were dried up upon the earth”(Gen8:7). We know the raven never returned at all. Then regarding the location of Moses’ grave, it was said that no man knows “until this present day”(Deut.34:6)—but we know that no one has known since that day either. Or how about this: “And they went up to mount Sion with joy and gladness, and offered holocausts, because not one of them was slain till they had returned in peace”(1 Macc5:54). Does this mean the soldiers were slain after they returned from battle? Nowadays, recent translations give a better sense of Mt 1:25: “He had no relations with her at any time before she bore a son”(New American Bible) and “he had not known her when she bore a son” (Knox translation). This information is taken from one of Karl Keating’s books, Catholicism and Fundamentalism. Fantastic reading if you haven’t already read it! Until later!

 

[susanj19]

Thanks, jcrichton,
Maybe it is time to stop talking to the JWs. I was so hoping to get through to them since the man has spent his whole life, almost 70 yrs., trying to spread the JW faith. He is highly ranked as a JW and I thought, “If only…” then he could get through to the other JWs. Prayer must be the answer, perhaps, for this couple. I still believe, though, in Paul’s words: “You must always be ready to give an answer to the hope you have in Christ Jesus.” or something to that effect.

 

[jcrichton]

Thanks, jcrichton,
Maybe it is time to stop talking to the JWs. I was so hoping to get through to them since the man has spent his whole life, almost 70 yrs., trying to spread the JW faith. He is highly ranked as a JW and I thought, “If only…” then he could get through to the other JWs. Prayer must be the answer, perhaps, for this couple. I still believe, though, in Paul’s words: “You must always be ready to give an answer to the hope you have in Christ Jesus.” or something to that effect.

Hi, Susan J!

I did not mean to say that you should stop… rather, I meant to convey that you should not set your hopes too high… I’ve had had many encounters with them and at the end it is the same: they are very friendly at the beginning, allowing you to express your concerns, then their tone changes as they want to convince you that you are not knowledgeable of the Word since the Catholic Church is wrong and basically hell-bound… regarless of the Biblical passage that you would like to share they constantly dismiss it as “the wrong interpretation” or simply ignore it and continue with their “correct” teaching of Scriptures… all the while they introduce their understanding of the Catholic Church and her shortcomings…

…yet, they are deserving of Christ’s Love just as much as anyone esle… so if you have the patience and tolerance to continue the exchange… the Holy Spirit is always ready to assist!

Maran atha!

Angel

 

[Emeng]

Hi Guys,

May I know how will we reply to this point of the INC’s. They are using 1 Cor 8:6 to prove that the Father is the only God.

Can you share how to answer this… I read some article from the catholic.com. I just want someone to be able explain it tome further.

Thanks…

 

[susanj19]

jcrichton,
Thanks. This particular JW couple is very sweet and they even apologize if they accidentally raise their voice in response to me. They understand that all discussion of scriptures must be done with love and gentleness. But yes, they are very stubborn and several times they have reminded me that they were the ones who came to my door for bible study! I have some people telling me to give up and just pray and others who tell me to hang in there and “You tell them!” (especially one lady in my bible study who lost a son to their faith). I have to thank God for them, though, because they have made me determined to learn scripture well enough to refute them!

 

[susanj19]

Emeng,
All you have to know are the verses, such as 1 Chronicles 17:20, which say,“O Lord, there is none like You, nor is there any God besides You”. Therefore, all scripture must be understood with this in mind. So in John1:1, “In the beginning was God, and the Word was with God and the Word was God,” we must accept that there is more than one person in God. There is no way that the latter part can be interpreted as “the Word was a god” because we already know that Yahweh Himself has said there are no other gods, even though man has “so-called gods”; He even said that there is nobody like Him. So Jesus cannot be another god and He can’t have all the qualities of God just because He existed with God “at his side”. The Bible says that we have one Lord and one Savior. This doesn’t mean two different gods, but rather One God who alone is our God and Savior. Remember the verse, “Jesus, though he was in the form of God, did not regard equality with God something to be grasped”. Even in a human body he is still God and because He humbled himself, “for awhile made lower than the angels”, he prayed to the Father as his God. When the Father glorified Jesus at the resurrection, Jesus was restored to his previous glory as one of the persons of the only God. There is no other logical way to combine these scripture verses that clearly say Jesus is God. He can’t be some different type of divine being because in John 1:1 the same word is used of the Father and the Son. That word is God, or theos. And in Greek, the predicate nominative does not require an article, such as “a” or “the” in the latter part of John 1:1. Also, as a subject, ho Theos (the God) is used of Jesus in other scriptures. Christ is called “ho theos” meaning “the God” elsewhere in Scripture:
(See Titus 2:13) where the definite article “tou (the genitive singular form of ho) precedes the phrase “Great God and Savior”.

 

[Emeng]

Thanks susanj19.

I fully understand your point and that was raised also and have been discussed. However, the people I am talking to keep on raising that verse 1Cor 8:6 which says

Yet to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we unto him: and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him

They use this to say there is Only one God which is the Father.

Just wanted to know how we catholics interpret these verse.

Thanks again…

 

[jcrichton]

Hi Guys,

May I know how will we reply to this point of the INC’s. They are using 1 Cor 8:6 to prove that the Father is the only God.

Can you share how to answer this… I read some article from the catholic.com. I just want someone to be able explain it tome further.

Thanks…

Hi, Emeng!

…the problem with many who use single-passage Scriptures to prove their theology is that they tend to blind themselves to all reason…

That same passage which you cited has determined that there is only One God, the Father–Jesus expressed as much. But He also said that He and the Father are One and that He is in the Father and the Father is in Him. So if we are to believe St. Paul’s statement because the Truth has been revealed to him, why can’t we believe Jesus who just so happens to be the Truth?

Further, note that Paul also states that there is only one Lord, Jesus–how do they reconcile that statement with the Old Testament Scriptures that have declared that there is only one Lord, Yahweh God (and don’t fall for that ole LORD vs. Lord trick)?

Ask them also to explain Jesus’ statements when He notes that only those who are sent by the Father can come to Him while in another passage He declares that no one knows the Son but the Father and that no one knows the Father but the Son and those to whom He reveals Him… is Jesus saying that He is above the Father since only He has Authority to let man know God?

Also ask them why does the Old Testament state that there is no Savior outside of Yahweh God when clearly there is only One Name given by which all are Saved: Jesus?

And if there is only One God, Jesus not being that God, why is Jesus the God of the Amen?.. the Immanuel?.. the Lord of lords and King of kings?.. the One who Created all that exists–by whom all things are and for whom all things are?

Maran atha!

Angel

 

[jcrichton]

jcrichton,
Thanks. This particular JW couple is very sweet and they even apologize if they accidentally raise their voice in response to me. They understand that all discussion of scriptures must be done with love and gentleness. But yes, they are very stubborn and several times they have reminded me that they were the ones who came to my door for bible study! I have some people telling me to give up and just pray and others who tell me to hang in there and “You tell them!” (especially one lady in my bible study who lost a son to their faith). I have to thank God for them, though, because they have made me determined to learn scripture well enough to refute them!

Hi, Susan!

…your very last sentence is what many of us forget… how do we know that Yahweh God is not sending people to us so that we may gain a fuller understanding of Scriptures or so that we may deepen our Faith? Every single time that I have to use the Holy Scritpures I am studying God’s Word and I am both an instructor and a student as the Holy Spirit guides me into deeper understanding of His Will!

I commend you in your determination to hold on fast to Him who is Lord of lords!

Maran atha!

Angel

 

[ericman211]

tHERE was no mentioned trinity either in the old or in the new testament. As a matter of fact Malachi and other prophets attest that there is only one god, the Father. Jesus Christ in John 17:1,3 did not introduce himself as God but as a messenger sent by God. and He said that eternal life lays on the faith that there is only one God, the Father.

in Genesis when God said: “let us make man according to our image?” was he actually speaking to the rest of the trinity especially Christ? No. We all know that in the beginning there was no Christ as a person. There was only Christ as a Word or Plan or Concept. And this word was made flesh in the person of Jesus when He was born (first chapter of John). in John 1:1 , a passage states that the word is God. God there in that passage is not used as noun but as an adjective, amplifying the chracteristic of the word. Meaning that the word was powerful just like God; it will be fulfilled in time (by hook or by crook-just to emphasize).and the fulfillment was Jesus Christ, the pre destined Saviour.

ANd so in Genesis who was God talking to? He was actually talking to the angels/ querubin (book of Isaiah).Does that mean that these angels are co-creators? No. In the Old testament David and others attested that it was only God who made everything, all that we see, everything, ONLY GOD.

Stating that “let us make man in our own image” is just an expression that tries to show us that God was not alone then. He has already created the angels before man.

The Holy Spirit is no God. It is not equal to God. In fact God and Jesus sent the Holy Spirit to their servants/ disciples. God is not a messenger. He is the one who sends someone/messenger to do a specific task, not the other way around.