Homeopathy = Placebo

[Cracker_Mom]

Why do so many otherwise skeptical & intelligent Catholic parents get sucked into this quackery that’s been grandfathered into medicine?
Chemically speaking there’s nothing leftover of the herbs homeopathic remedies claim to contain.The only traceable ingredients are lactose & fillers, depending on the product.Yet folks will swear up & down these sugar pills work.
The same parents who might eschew yoga & martial arts for New Age/Eastern religion connections buy right into this foolishness.What’s up?

 

[pentecostbaby]

What do you mean by homeopathy? I’ve used herbs to treat some stuff and it’s worked …

 

[Cracker_Mom]

What do you mean by homeopathy? I’ve used herbs to treat some stuff and it’s worked …

Herbs can work because they have legitimate pharmaceutical uses.Homeopathic remedies have no chemically detectable amount of the active ingredients they claim to contain(except lactose) so are not legit.They fall more under a belief system than science:“If you believe it will work, it does, etc.”

 

[ack]

Do you work in the sciences? I am a PhD student in the sciences and have found the enthusiasm towards homeopathy on this site to be a little mystifying. (If so, I know of one other scientist on this forum, so we’re not alone…)

Also, the above comment is correct. Herbs and homeopathy are NOT the same thing. Many herbs have proven to be effective, and the theories of herbal remedies fall within mainstream science. In contrast, the proposed mechanisms of action for homeopathic remedies (such as the ones proposing new configurations of atoms in water molecules) conflict with decades worth of empirically verified scientific research.

 

[Cracker_Mom]

Do you work in the sciences? I am a PhD student in the sciences and have found the enthusiasm towards homeopathy on this site to be a little mystifying. (If so, I know of one other scientist on this forum, so we’re not alone…)

Nope, just have taken some science courses & one that addressed the subject of homeopathy during the course work.
I sympathize with folks who are frustrated with the medical options they are offered by physicians, but we have to have legitimate alternatives-not quackery.Homeopathy is pretty much like the Emperor with no clothes in the old fairy tale.

 

[whatevergirl]

My dh could have posted this thread. LOL! He doesn’t believe in it either…but I do!

Can you give details of what you are talking about…supplements, etc…what do you mean exactly?

 

[ack]

We are referring to homeopathic remedies. Supplements are NOT homeopathy; they are legitimate science (in some respects). Herbs are also legitimate.

If the bottle doesn’t have the words “homeopathy” or “homeopathic” on it, then we are talking about different things.

“Rescue Remedy” is a brand of homeopathy that I’ve seen in many stores. This is one example of what we are talking about.

My dh could have posted this thread. LOL! He doesn’t believe in it either…but I do!

Can you give details of what you are talking about…supplements, etc…what do you mean exactly?

 

[mommamia]

I have a Phd in molecular and cellular bio, and I agree with you to a point.

But still a little confused as to why you started this thread

It’s not like homeopathy is going to hurt anyone, and the placebo effect is well documented. Plus I have found that when folks want to believe, its hard to convince them not to.

 

[whatevergirl]

Ok, thanks ack. So, would ‘airborne’ fall into that category? If so, don’t be talkin’ bad about airborne, now… :tsktsk: My dh rolls his eyes whenever we purchase that stuff…but I think it works.

However, that company was sued big time – like a class action suit, because I think the main claimant said that the box was misleading

 

[mommamia]

Ok, thanks ack. So, would ‘airborne’ fall into that category? If so, don’t be talkin’ bad about airborne, now… :tsktsk: My dh rolls his eyes whenever we purchase that stuff…but I think it works.

However, that company was sued big time – like a class action suit, because I think the main claimant said that the box was misleading

I have seen the “airborne” before, and believe it does fall into the homeopathy category. It won’t hurt you per se… but I *personally *don’t believe it will help you either.

DH uses homeopathic arnica all the time, I just roll my eyes and grab the bottle of real arnica oil when my muscles ache or I have a nasty bruise.

ETA: No airborne is a vitamin and nutritional supplement, not a homeopathic, Sorry It does look like it could help support immune function

 

[Cracker_Mom]

My dh could have posted this thread. LOL! He doesn’t believe in it either…but I do!

Can you give details of what you are talking about…supplements, etc…what do you mean exactly?

I’d be glad to, but if we have some real scientists reading these posts I bet they could do a better job explaining.
Basically homeopathic remedies contain none of the herbal/botanical substances they claim to contain & the whole theory behind it is medically bogus.
If you take herbal supplements, they may or may not be useful in treating depression, earache,or whatever-but they can be shown to chemically contain the herb they claim to be processed from, say: St. John’s Wort.
A homeopathic remedy is so diluted that chemically speaking, no trace of the original botanical substance is still present.
So, while your herbal supplements may or may not work for the ailment they are intended to treat they at least contain herbs. Homeopathic remedies do not.

 

[ack]

Looking at the ingredients, I don’t think “Airborne” is homeopathic. Homeopathic remedies can be identified because they have no measurable quantities of any active ingredients. While I’m don’t know if Airborne has been proven to be effective, it does have ingredients that your body needs to stay healthy. I probably wouldn’t buy it, because the box says “This product is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure or prevent any disease.” So what’s the point?

I know a woman with a depression and anxiety disorder who only takes homeopathic remedies. She swears that they work, but her problems never get any better, and she’s losing the ability to function normally in her daily life. She still refuses to see a doctor – she only goes to her homeopathic consultant, who keeps giving her the same remedies.

Ok, thanks ack. So, would ‘airborne’ fall into that category? If so, don’t be talkin’ bad about airborne, now… :tsktsk: My dh rolls his eyes whenever we purchase that stuff…but I think it works.

However, that company was sued big time – like a class action suit, because I think the main claimant said that the box was misleading

 

[Cracker_Mom]

I have a Phd in molecular and cellular bio, and I agree with you to a point.

But still a little confused as to why you started this thread

It’s not like homeopathy is going to hurt anyone, and the placebo effect is well documented. Plus I have found that when folks want to believe, its hard to convince them not to.

It hurts our wallets & Catholics deserve better.
It’s something I run into as a Catholic parent talking to other parents & it’s frustrating.

 

[mommamia]

It hurts our wallets & Catholics deserve better.
It’s something I run into as a Catholic parent talking to other parents & it’s frustrating.

Yes, I can see that. On the other hand, again the placebo effect is well and widely documented. Plus I am well aware that we don’t know everything. Homeopathic medicine has been used for quite a long time. People strongly believe in it for whatever reason, and it works for them (or so they think).

Honestly I see more problem with the over use of pharmacueticals than homeopathics. Half the time that antibiotics are prescribed for an ear infection, the child would have been better off if the Dr. had just given a homeopathic placebo.

 

[whatevergirl]

I’d be glad to, but if we have some real scientists reading these posts I bet they could do a better job explaining.
Basically homeopathic remedies contain none of the herbal/botanical substances they claim to contain & the whole theory behind it is medically bogus.
If you take herbal supplements, they may or may not be useful in treating depression, earache,or whatever-but they can be shown to chemically contain the herb they claim to be processed from, say: St. John’s Wort.
A homeopathic remedy is so diluted that chemically speaking, no trace of the original botanical substance is still present.
So, while your herbal supplements may or may not work for the ailment they are intended to treat they at least contain herbs. Homeopathic remedies do not.

ok, I see. I never used St John’s Wort, but know what you’re talking about…interesting.

I take a strong supplement, its base is blue green algae, and I used to have a very weak immune system, and will say that upon taking that for a while now, I don’t seem to catch all the nasties going around the office, or from my kids at school. I also try to eat well, and exercise, both can help considerably too.

I have a feeling airborne would fall into this, and estroven? Ever hear of the product? It’s a soy based product to help women with hot flashes…how about primrose oil? I don’t take these, but have friends who do.

 

[shannin]

Not placebos. I’ve had good experiences in treating with herbs for minor ailments. The herb Mullein is wonderful for sinus problems. Red Clover is very cleansing.

 

[mommamia]

Herbology and homeopathy are very different practices.

Mullen is awesome for upper respitory problems, arnica is great for strained muscles and bruising, airborne is a nutritional supplement.

Homeopathy is a “science” that says that “like cures like” all homeopathic preparations have been diluted to the point of basically not containing even trace amounts of the substances they claim to be based on.

I use herbology all the time. In fact I am back in school working on a degree in ethnobotany. Pure chammomile oil will cut the congestion of a sinus infection in no time, homeopathic chammomile has NO ACTUAL chammomile in it.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homeopathy

 

[ack]

Plus I am well aware that we don’t know everything. Homeopathic medicine has been used for quite a long time. People strongly believe in it for whatever reason, and it works for them (or so they think).

It is worth pointing out that there’s a lot about the human body that we don’t know. For example, recent studies have concluded that dextromethorphan (the active ingredient in most cold medicines) is not effective for controlling coughs! It would have been nice to know this 40 years ago.

The problem with homeopathy, though, is that although we don’t know everything, there are some things that we DO know, and homeopathic theory contradicts them. If the “vibration effect” that homeopathic theoreticians propose was real, then our fundamental understanding of basic chemistry is completely wrong, and decades worth of developments in macromolecular science, physics, semiconductors, particle physics, nanotechnology, molecular biology, and chemical engineering would have been sabotaged by this mysterious effect.

I’ll take the fact that our computers, cars, and chemical plants do what they’re supposed to do as evidence that the human race does have a basic understanding of chemistry, a science that homeopathic theory claims to contradict.

 

[mommamia]

Ok, most homeopathic remedies are diluted by a factor of 10 to the 60th power. Thats a whoooooollllllllleeeee lot of zeros.

Something that has been diluted 10 to the 24th has only a 60% chance of containing ONE MOLECULE of the original substance, if one mole was used.

There is basically nothing left. The belief being that by diluting and shaking vigorously you somehow release the “vital energy” of a substance. Sounds pretty new agey to me.

 

[ack]

After reading some of these threads on Homeopathy, I’m starting to think that the people who claim to believe in Homeopathy are actually using herbal remedies, and they don’t realize that homeopathic remedies are not the same thing.

I think this is an important misconception to clear up, because now that the public has equated homeopathy with herbal medicine, it will be easy for people to inadvertently choose useless homeopathic remedies over remedies that might do real good.

Cracker Mom: You might try to clear this up. Maybe your fellow Catholics don’t actually believe in homeopathy after all.