Homophobic? Yes or no

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90Domer said:
For I turn in, I think I just discovered something. It is comments like BEL’s that cause me to feel that I am homophobic when I choose to relay and enforce Church doctrine, especially as it applies to how I raise my child. And then some say I’m intolerant. Gosh, take a good look in the mirror.
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I never said you were homophobic. In fact I only pointed out two things that I thought you were in the wrong in, and you did start this thread looking for opinions…

I know exactly what would happen if I was gay and my sister in law told my mom not to refer to me and my partner as married in front of her autistic daughter. Yes, I have an autistic niece. I know exactly what would happen if I had a gay son and my daughter in law told me not to call them married.

It would probably be something along the lines of “X is married as far as he, I, and the rest of the family are concerned (depending on the state I may throw in legally as well) and if that fact isn’t appropriate for your son then maybe you should wait until he’s old enough to understand what you want to teach him about homosexuality to come around”. Yes, it would be hard not being around my grandchild. But being asked to hide something that everyone else sees as a good thing about my son, and the fact that his partner is family to me would bring out the mama bear in me.
 
90Domer said:
I may be banned for this, but I have to politely say that I did not know the definition of “sit and rotate” until just now. Sadly, and yes I do mean sadly, this phrase may best be used on my BIL in the literal sense as opposed to me in the figurative sense.

And the fact is, I love my son, who is on the autism spectrum. So much so that I am willing to go to great lengths to protect him and also need to be extra diligent when teaching him. Personally, MIL shows extreme favoritism when she poo-poos our feelings in favor of her SSA son. Why? Sorry, but this makes absolutely no sense to me…and she can’t get us on lacking compassion, because she has no sense of raising an autistic child. The persecution these kids take, I argue, is a heck of a lot more than any SSA person.
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That subtle jab makes you sound like a homophobe. Probably not a rabid, foaming at the mouth homophobe, just a “good ol’ days”, “put 'em in their place” homophobe.

Edit: To clarify something, I am not calling you a homophobe. However, since you specifically asked about it, my honest opinion is that statements like that make you sound like one. I’m not going to sit here and argue autism vs. SSA: who has it worse? But, since you are trying to diminish the pain and suffering that these people go through, I can only speculate that you are doing so to carry out an agenda against them. That is what would make you a homophobe.

We can be reasonably assured that your words on here are couched to come off as proper as can be. So it is entirely possible that this little hint right here belies a more venomous attitude in real life than you are portraying in cyberspace.
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90Domer:
For I turn in, I think I just discovered something. It is comments like BEL’s that cause me to feel that I am homophobic when I choose to relay and enforce Church doctrine, especially as it applies to how I raise my child. And then some say I’m intolerant. Gosh, take a good look in the mirror.
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There’s a difference between adhering to Church teachings and being a homophobe. Yes?

Curious, you mentioned that you refuse to talk to your BIL. Why?
 
Kensho said:
This is completely off base.

This woman is entitled to raise her children according to her Catholic principles and her mother-in-law needs to respect those, even if it means having to curb her speech in regard to her son. How dare you use the vulgar phrase “sit and rotate” in this regard? You are way out of line here. This is a Catholic forum and this woman is teaching Catholic beliefs to her own children. Your secular beliefs about good manners are irrelevant here, as well as wrong from a more worldly perspective. Look, you need to realize that “rude” does not equal “whatever I personally disagree with and/or find offensive”.
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When trying to get along with people outside of a conservative group of Catholics, secular manners and not being rude are important.

And dictating how a woman refers to her son and his partner does cross the line when it comes to asking in-laws to cater to you. The OP is trying to protect and stand by her son, but so is the OP’s MIL.

If they can’t come to an agreement then the best thing to do would be to find the son a sitter when it comes time to see the in-laws.
 
No it does not, but they will accuse you of it. Remember,“blessed are they who are persecuted and slandered for the sake of my name” (paraphrase lol)
 
BlueEyedLady said:
When trying to get along with people outside of a conservative group of Catholics, secular manners and not being rude are important.

And dictating how a woman refers to her son and his partner does cross the line when it comes to asking in-laws to cater to you. The OP is trying to protect and stand by her son, but so is the OP’s MIL.

If they can’t come to an agreement then the best thing to do would be to find the son a sitter when it comes time to see the in-laws.
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You have a false idea of secular manners. Having manners has never meant that you are rude for disagreeing with someone or for having your own rules about how your child is to be raised.

But the fact that you come onto a Catholic site and use extremely vulgar terminology to a Catholic wife and mother indicates that you are either very young and inexperienced or very rude.
 
Kensho said:
You have a false idea of secular manners. Having manners has never meant that you are rude for disagreeing with someone or for having your own rules about how your child is to be raised.

But the fact that you come onto a Catholic site and use extremely vulgar terminology to a Catholic wife and mother indicates that you are either very young and inexperienced or very rude.
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I may be missing something, but what does “sit and rotate” mean?
 
VeritasLuxMea said:
That subtle jab makes you sound like a homophobe. Probably not a rabid, foaming at the mouth homophobe, just a “good ol’ days”, “put 'em in their place” homophobe.

There’s a difference between adhering to Church teachings and being a homophobe. Yes?

Curious, you mentioned that you refuse to talk to your BIL. Why?
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Really, it is the other way around. BIL refuses to take to me and my family. Why? Because he has a 19 year grudge because hubby and I would not invite his partner to our wedding.
 
Kensho said:
You have a false idea of secular manners. Having manners has never meant that you are rude for disagreeing with someone or for having your own rules about how your child is to be raised.

But the fact that you come onto a Catholic site and use extremely vulgar terminology to a Catholic wife and mother indicates that you are either very young and inexperienced or very rude.
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Um, telling a woman to hide the relationship that her son has with his partner when she herself is supportive and loving of that relationship is rude.

You can disagree, and you can have your own rules. But when that spills into trying to dictate that kind of personal aspect of someone else’s life, it’s time to realize that you can’t change the world and focus on what you can do.
 
90Domer said:
Really, it is the other way around. BIL refuses to take to me and my family. Why? Because he has a 19 year grudge because hubby and I would not invite his partner to our wedding.
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Then that’s the issue with your BIL, and that’s something that you need to take up with him, and that’s a completely different issue entirely. But the issue that you posted about is the fact that your MIL lets them share a bed and calls him and his partner married. And that’s the issue I’m speaking about.

Frankly, I wouldn’t want you in my life either if you snubbed me, my partner, and the family we are like that. But once again, that’s between you and BIL. Sometimes differences are just too great.
 
Stillness said:
I may be missing something, but what does “sit and rotate” mean?
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I don’t know why everyone seems to think it’s vulgar, but maybe I’m missing something. I know that it was a really common phrase that old church ladies would use when they were mad at each other in the rural area I lived in.

My dear grandmother, who wouldn’t even say “heck” would get so mad and frustrated and say “and if she doesn’t like it she can sit and rotate!” I always thought it meant deal with it, but whatever. I do apologize if it offended anyone. It may have taken on new meaning from when the old ladies used it.
 
You go girl…No you are not homophobic.

Can I ask a question that isn’t about this topic?

I’m new to Catholic Answers and I can’t figure out where to go with my questions. I did hit a site and ask questions but I can’t remember what the name was. When I read instructions I get confused … so can someone please explain it in plain english? Also, when people used just the first letters like CCC I don’t know what they mean, so where can I go to find out? Thank you and sorry for the interuptuon. Oh I’m janlyn just in case.
 
BlueEyedLady said:
Um, telling a woman to hide the relationship that her son has with his partner when she herself is supportive and loving of that relationship is rude.

You can disagree, and you can have your own rules. But when that spills into trying to dictate that kind of personal aspect of someone else’s life, it’s time to realize that you can’t change the world and focus on what you can do.
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You have a false understanding of what it means to be rude. But this is a Catholic forum, and you come here calling yourself an atheist – and you want to talk about manners? There is more at stake here than manners. You are having a conversation that isn’t appropriate either to the subject or the forum. If you wanted to talk about how the OP could show empathy to her in-laws, maybe you would have some valuable information to impart. But if you just want to keep on calling people “rude” because they don’t fit some definition of good breeding that is entirely your own – the nicest thing I can say is that this is inappropriate and doomed to failure.
 
BlueEyedLady said:
I never said you were homophobic. In fact I only pointed out two things that I thought you were in the wrong in, and you did start this thread looking for opinions…

I know exactly what would happen if I was gay and my sister in law told my mom not to refer to me and my partner as married in front of her autistic daughter. Yes, I have an autistic niece. I know exactly what would happen if I had a gay son and my daughter in law told me not to call them married.

It would probably be something along the lines of “X is married as far as he, I, and the rest of the family are concerned (depending on the state I may throw in legally as well) and if that fact isn’t appropriate for your son then maybe you should wait until he’s old enough to understand what you want to teach him about homosexuality to come around”. Yes, it would be hard not being around my grandchild. But being asked to hide something that everyone else sees as a good thing about my son, and the fact that his partner is family to me would bring out the mama bear in me.
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Sadly, no everyone sees BIL and partner as a good thing. The other sibling and his wife see MIL (and previously FIL) as affirming his sin. Also, their Catholic friends and fellow parishioners also do not think affirming this relationship is a good thing. Truthfully, many parishioners called them out and spoke to the pastor as to why they were allowed to by EM’s when they so openly supported SSA. That certainly tells you that many people do not think this is a good thing. Goodness, how can any faithful Catholic think it is good to affirm a grave sin? We honestly think our father/FIL is quite possibly in Hell for these beliefs. How can anyone justify that BIL acting on his SSA is a good thing?

And yes, we do keep son away from MIL because she won’t respect boundaries. I honestly do not think we are asking too much by asking her to refrain around my son. There is never a reason to bring up BIL because he has chosen to hold a grudge.
 
Kensho said:
You have a false understanding of what it means to be rude. But this is a Catholic forum, and you come here calling yourself an atheist – and you want to talk about manners? There is more at stake here than manners. You are having a conversation that isn’t appropriate either to the subject or the forum. If you wanted to talk about how the OP could show empathy to her in-laws, maybe you would have some valuable information to impart. But if you just want to keep on calling people “rude” because they don’t fit some definition of good breeding that is entirely your own – the nicest thing I can say is that this is inappropriate and doomed to failure.
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Um, no I think that it is pretty unreasonable to expect everyone to speak of her BIL in a certain way because of her beliefs. She’s brought up the issue, her MIL is not receptive, so it’s time to decide what, if any, relationship she can have with these people. But yes, it is rude to tell a mother how to speak of her son and his partner. Being Catholic does not give you a trump card to dictate things like how mothers talk about their sons.
 
90Domer said:
Really, it is the other way around. BIL refuses to take to me and my family. Why? Because he has a 19 year grudge because hubby and I would not invite his partner to our wedding.
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Yikes, that is cold blooded. I can’t say I blame him. If you think the faith required you to do so then good job on your part, but it’s entirely predictable that he wouldn’t want anything to do with you.
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Kensho:
You have a false understanding of what it means to be rude.
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When you dig up the Catechism entry on rudeness, let us know. 😛
 
BlueEyedLady said:
I don’t know why everyone seems to think it’s vulgar, but maybe I’m missing something. I know that it was a really common phrase that old church ladies would use when they were mad at each other in the rural area I lived in.

My dear grandmother, who wouldn’t even say “heck” would get so mad and frustrated and say “and if she doesn’t like it she can sit and rotate!” I always thought it meant deal with it, but whatever. I do apologize if it offended anyone. It may have taken on new meaning from when the old ladies used it.
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You don’t know what that means? Ah, well, then, I soften my tone, which was based on the understanding that you did indeed know what it means and chose to say it anyway.

Stick your thumb out in a fist, look at it, and repeat the above saying whilst thinking about what it could possibly mean. I suspect you’ll get the picture without my saying anything more.

It is an incredibly rude thing to say that I, personally, have not heard since high school and would be highly offended if an adult said to me today.
 
I had never heard “sit and rotate” before today, but I can only guess what it means…
 
BlueEyedLady said:
Um, no I think that it is pretty unreasonable to expect everyone to speak of her BIL in a certain way because of her beliefs. She’s brought up the issue, her MIL is not receptive, so it’s time to decide what, if any, relationship she can have with these people. But yes, it is rude to tell a mother how to speak of her son and his partner. Being Catholic does not give you a trump card to dictate things like how mothers talk about their sons.
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Please stop using the word “rude”. It is not relevant to this discussion. And the OP has just as much right to want to protect her son from this kind of talk as the MIl has to believe certain things about her own son.
 
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