Homosexuality and marriage

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I only brought it up because it was stated “God made it natural that a man be with a woman and a woman be with a man”. So why did God make animals do this OR why do they do this despite what God intended?

My actual argument concerning homsexuality is more interesting really. 😃
First God has an ordaining will and a permitting will. Secondly, animal behavior is nothing to base conclusions on.
 
Irrational Animal Behavior Is No Blueprint For Rational Man Some researchers studying animal “homosexual” behavior extrapolate from the realm of science into that of philosophy and morality. These scholars reason from the premise that if animals do it, it is according to their nature and thus is good for them. If it is natural and good for animals, they continue, it is also natural and morally good for man. However, the definition of man’s nature belongs not to the realm of zoology or biology, but philosophy, and the determination of what is morally good for man pertains to ethics.
Dr. Marlene Zuk, professor of biology at the University of California at Riverside, for example, states:
Sexuality is a lot broader term than people want to think. You have this idea that the animal kingdom is strict, old-fashioned Roman Catholic, that they have sex to procreate. … Sexual expression means more than making babies. Why are we surprised? People are animals.[16] Simon LeVay entertains the hope that the understanding of animal “homosexuality” will help change societal mores and religious beliefs about homosexuality. He states: It seems possible that the study of sexual behavior in animals, especially in non-human primates, will contribute to the liberalization of religious attitudes toward homosexual activity and other forms of nonprocreative sex. Specifically, these studies challenge one particular sense of the dogma that homosexual behavior is “against nature”: the notion that it is unique to those creatures who, by tasting the fruit of the tree of knowledge, have alone become morally culpable.[17] Other researchers feel compelled to point out the impropriety of transposing animal behavior to man. Although very favorable to the homosexual interpretation of animal behavior, Paul L. Vasey, of the University of Lethbridge in Canada, nevertheless cautions: For some people, what animals do is a yardstick of what is and isn’t natural. They make a leap from saying if it’s natural, it’s morally and ethically desirable. Infanticide is widespread in the animal kingdom. To jump from that to say it is desirable makes no sense. We shouldn’t be using animals to craft moral and social policies for the kinds of human societies we want to live in. Animals don’t take care of the elderly. I don’t particularly think that should be a platform for closing down nursing homes.[18] The animal kingdom is no place for man to seek a blueprint for human morality. That blueprint, as bioethicist Bruto Maria Bruti notes, must be sought in man himself: It is a frequent error for people to contrast human and animal behaviors, as if the two were homogenous. … The laws ruling human behavior are of a different nature and they should be sought where God inscribed them, namely, in human nature.[19] The fact that man has a body and sensitive life in common with animals does not mean he is strictly an animal. Nor does it mean that he is a half-animal. Man’s rationality pervades the wholeness of his nature so that his sensations, instincts and impulses are not purely animal but have that seal of rationality which characterizes them as human. Thus, man is characterized not by what he has in common with animals, but by what differentiates him from them. This differentiation is fundamental, not accidental. Man is a rational animal. Man’s rationality is what makes human nature unique and fundamentally distinct from animal nature.[20]
To consider man strictly as an animal is to deny his rationality and, therefore, his free will. Likewise, to consider animals as if they were human is to attribute to them a non-existent rationality.
 
You evidently think it’s a big deal or you wouldn’t keep harping on it all the time. Prove to me that Scrappy is thinking, " Lucky is a boy dog and I like boy dogs better than girl dogs". It’s more likely that Scrappy is trying to dominate Lucky so that Scrappy will be the one to breed with females rather than Lucky. Tell me, is domination anything to base a marriage on. OK, lets say Scrappy sees Lucky and thinks, " there is another dog, i want to breed with it." That’s not homosexual that’s animal lust. You see, Scrappy isn’t going after Lucky because Lucky is the same sex. Scrappy just wants sex, be it with Lucky, or Lassie, or a fencepost for that matter. Your “facts” are uncoordinated because you will never know exactly what is going through Scrappy’s brain. I’m sorry, but thats as simple as I can explain it to you.
Nobody has understood the point that I was making so I’ll try to explain in detail.

You’re the one that said, “God made it natural that a man be with a woman and a woman be with a man”. God created us for this purpose which I agree. God also created all animals for the same purpose which I also agree. Yet your statement caused a problem for me because God created animals, like humans, to procreate and yet they also engage in homosexual behavior. You can’t simply say “God made it natural” to discount homosexuality when God’s other creations do likewise. My comment was about your statement.

The context here is about what God has created and what is “natural”. Not about homosexuality itself.
 
Evidently more so than you. He created me. I have a terrible temper. That doesn’t mean He is happy with me when I can’t control it. You want God to bow to your will. I’m smart enough to know that it’s my will that should bend, not God’s. God created people. People created homosexuality and sodomy all by themselves.
So we can act outwith god?

He did not create me.
 
Research shows that homosexual behavior has been observed in about 1500 species, ranging from primates to gut worms. One fundamental premise in social debates has been that homosexuality is unnatural. This premise is wrong. Homosexuality is both common and highly essential in the lives of a number of species.

Time to crawl out from under that rock.
Here is your quote. You state you have been enlightened by “research” please share it so we can see what you are reading.

Because when I put your first sentence in the 'ole google maker machine, I get a wikipedia article here:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexual_behavior_in_animals

Here is another portion of the same paragraph you got your info from…

"According to geneticist Simon Levay in 1996, "Although homosexual behavior is very common in the animal world, it seems to be very uncommon that individual animals have a long-lasting predisposition to engage in such behavior to the exclusion of heterosexual activities. Thus, a homosexual orientation, if one can speak of such thing in animals, seems to be a rarity"

Please publish where you get your stuff…and also make sure you read it to completely.
 
Nobody has understood the point that I was making so I’ll try to explain in detail.

You’re the one that said, “God made it natural that a man be with a woman and a woman be with a man”. God created us for this purpose which I agree. God also created all animals for the same purpose which I also agree. Yet your statement caused a problem for me because God created animals, like humans, to procreate and yet they also engage in homosexual behavior. You can’t simply say “God made it natural” to discount homosexuality when God’s other creations do likewise. My comment was about your statement.

The context here is about what God has created and what is “natural”. Not about homosexuality itself.
But God’s creatures don’t do likewise, at least not for homosexual reasons. Get it.
 
Nobody has understood the point that I was making so I’ll try to explain in detail.

You’re the one that said, “God made it natural that a man be with a woman and a woman be with a man”. God created us for this purpose which I agree. God also created all animals for the same purpose which I also agree. Yet your statement caused a problem for me because God created animals, like humans, to procreate and yet they also engage in homosexual behavior. You can’t simply say “God made it natural” to discount homosexuality when God’s other creations do likewise. My comment was about your statement.

The context here is about what God has created and what is “natural”. Not about homosexuality itself.
Sorry, but this does not make any sense? God ordained male and female. Sin entered the world. We live in a fallen world. God has an ordaining will and a permitting will. That disordered acts and inclinations exist is not proof that is God’s ordaining will. It simply means we are all fallen. Now, what exactly is your point?
 
Are you saying you know the mind of GOD?

If you believe in god you should have no problem in believing he created homosexuals and sodomy too
Well, we do know God created human beings in His own image and likeness, and that he created them male and female.

Sodomy was NOT created—it is a depraved act that some have engaged in. Homosexual acts are behaviors; they are actions. Murder is an action some people take but it is absurd to claim God created murder, or incest, or texting while driving, which is another action some people may undertake though they should not. Would you also argue that God created beating up homosexual persons because some people have done this? Of course not! Wait, how about this: since it has been observed in nature–human beings–it must be good! Or at least natural, right?
 
Animals Do It, So It’s Natural, Right? The reasoning behind the animal homosexuality theory can be summed up as follows:
  • Homosexual behavior is observable in animals.
  • Animal behavior is determined by their instincts.
  • Nature requires animals to follow their instincts.
  • Therefore, homosexuality is in accordance with animal nature.
  • Since man is also animal, homosexuality must also be in accordance with human nature. This line of reasoning is unsustainable. If seemingly “homosexual” acts among animals are in accordance with animal nature, then parental killing of offspring and intra-species devouring are also in accordance with animal nature. Bringing man into the equation complicates things further. Are we to conclude that filicide and cannibalism are according to human nature? In opposition to this line of reasoning, this article sustains that:

  1. *]There is no “homosexual instinct” in animals,
    *]It is poor science to “read” human motivations and sentiments into animal behavior, and
    *]Irrational animal behavior is not a yardstick to determine what is morally acceptable behavior for rational man.

    There Is No “Homosexual Instinct” In Animals Anyone engaged in the most elementary animal observation is forced to conclude that animal “homosexuality,” “filicide” and “cannibalism” are exceptions to normal animal behavior. Consequently, they cannot be called animal instincts. These observable exceptions to normal animal behavior result from factors beyond their instincts.

  1. You missed the point yet again. Oh well.
 
"Homosexual" Animals Do Not Exist Although homosexual behavior is very common in the animal world,.[12]
Well whataya know? Hahahaha. Unbelievable. :rolleyes:

Thank you for proving my statement was a known fact despite how everyone pretended to be oblivious to this knowledge.
 
Well whataya know? Hahahaha. Unbelievable. :rolleyes:

Thank you for proving my statement was a known fact despite how everyone pretended to be oblivious to this knowledge.
You’re a legend in your own mind.:rolleyes: I’ve had enough of this silliness.
 
Well whataya know? Hahahaha. Unbelievable. :rolleyes:

Thank you for proving my statement was a known fact despite how everyone pretended to be oblivious to this knowledge.
This is ridiculous. You referenced research…where the poop is it? We asked for it. We wanted to know where you got that from. I personally think you got it from wikipedia.

But instead you just say “it’s a known fact” or “research suggests” and then defend by saying “well if you want to ignore” or “you guys are pretending to be oblivious”

Well yeah jez, I am oblivious because you haven’t enlightened us yet. You made a statement, and when asked to provide evidence you didn’t. So we are still “oblivious.”

and further homosexual behavior and prolonged homosexual relationships are two different things. That is what the quote you included said. The gay behavior exists, but gay animals don’t.
 
You’re the one that said, “God made it natural that a man be with a woman and a woman be with a man”. God created us for this purpose which I agree. God also created all animals for the same purpose which I also agree. Yet your statement caused a problem for me because God created animals, like humans, to procreate and yet they also engage in homosexual behavior. You can’t simply say “God made it natural” to discount homosexuality when God’s other creations do likewise. My comment was about your statement.

The context here is about what God has created and what is “natural”. Not about homosexuality itself.
You seem to think “natural” means ‘occurs in nature’ (or, ‘other animals do it.’) “Natural” means “according to the nature of…”
One reason for apparently homosexual acts among other species is as a display of dominance, not love, or even sexual desire.(Humans in prisons have been known to engage in such actions too but it is not generally taken to mean they are homosexual persons.)
 
You missed the point yet again. Oh well.
:hmmm: Let’s approach it this way. Every animal is independent from their parent shortly after birth. Humans on the other hand cannot survive without their parents to civilize them and impart morality. And it takes time.
 
If my dog eats his poop, should I do it as well? Female praying Mantis eats their males’ head after copulation. Should we do that to? I mean, it occurs in nature, so it has to be good, right? :rolleyes:

You also understand that while animals are God’s creations and therefore good, humans alone are made in GOD’S image. Huge difference.
 
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