Homosexuality and the Axis of Evil....

[PastorBonus]

tell me without appealing to the American Psychiatric Association as an appeal to authority that is not authority.

The American Psychiatric Association is a medical community. They are trained professionals my friend, and you are not.

 

[CopticChristian]

If you respond to PastorBonus’s question with an answer rather than an insinuation, perhaps this debate will move forward?

Dex,

There is nothing to debate. Where do you see a debate.

The LBGT have a history.
The LBGT have a timeline.
The LBGT are behind the cases filed in California, New Jersey and now the United Nations.

Someone filed a counter suit to allow them to promote reparative therapy having been through reparative therapy.

Those that say that there has been “science” to discredit reparative therapy have not read the legal briefs from California. No science has discredited reparative therapy or found it dangerous. This is a lie.

According to the Legislature, the Task Force “conducted a systematic review of peer-reviewed journal literature on sexual orientation change efforts, and . . . concluded that sexual orientation change efforts can pose critical health risks to lesbian, gay, and bisexual people, …” (ER 00482).

In fact, the Task Force Report does not support the Legislature’s conclusion that SOCE is harmful to minors and therefore constitutes unprofessional conduct. (ER 00215-00352). Instead, throughout the report, the Task Force states that there is insufficient evidence to conclude that SOCE is either harmful or beneficial for adults, and no evidence regarding the efficacy of SOCE for children and youth. (ER 00215-00352). “Research on SOCE (psychotherapy, mutual self-help groups, religious techniques) has not answered basic questions of whether it is safe or effective and for whom.

What is there to debate?

 

[meltzerboy]

I thank God that this wretched ‘therapy’ is falling out of favor and that. Those who delight in hatred and bullying of people with SSA are losing this battle.

It’s pretty much over already!

Those people held out for a long time, but like the creationists, everyone is realizing that what is truly driving their agenda is hatred and fear.

Yes, hatred and fear are big motivators. Both are often linked to ignorance and often disguised as having some positive motivation and redeeming moral value.

 

[PastorBonus]

Bonus,

Do you see yourself as part of this gay history, gay timeline, those trying to stop freedom of speech in California, New Jersey and the United Nations?

I am not sure what do you mean by a gay history or gay timeline. Historically homosexuals have always existed because it is a condition. Maybe genetic, neurological, or a combination of both, but nobody wake up one day becoming gay just as nobody wake up one day and find herself straight.

Freedom of speech? From what you showed me the medical community is trying to stop a therapeutic practice that poses a threat to MANY people’s psychological being. Many people who have worked in the ex-gay profession have confessed that the methods don’t work while a lot of ex-gay therapists are gays themselves. While I hope for a cure of this condition, I don’t want any of my brethrens to suffer unnecessary pains. If this is a violation of free speech, then maybe we should reinstate practices previously banned like lobotomy or blood letting.

 

[DexUK]

Dex,

There is nothing to debate. Where do you see a debate.

The LBGT have a history.
The LBGT have a timeline.
The LBGT are behind the cases filed in California, New Jersey and now the United Nations.

Some LGBT people have an agenda, but they are not a uniform political entity, indistinct from each other, and you would do well to note that.

Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual and Transgender people are all unique, their only common factors being their sexual orientation. Some are highly political, others are quiet and private and do not seek the limelight. Most of them would just like to be left in peace.

 

[VeritasLuxMea]

Dex,

There is nothing to debate. Where do you see a debate.

The LBGT have a history.

Most of that ‘history’ involves either living in shame (which this therapy helps promote), being harassed, being murdered, etc.

How concerned are any of you people about that?

What is there to debate?

That’s what I’m wondering, frankly. The scientific community has a consensus on this matter.

 

[CopticChristian]

I am not sure what do you mean by a gay history or gay timeline. Historically homosexuals have always existed because it is a condition. Maybe genetic, neurological, or a combination of both, but nobody wake up one day becoming gay just as nobody wake up one day and find herself straight.

Freedom of speech? From what you showed me the medical community is trying to stop a therapeutic practice that poses a threat to MANY people’s psychological being. Many people who have worked in the ex-gay profession have confessed that the methods don’t work while a lot of ex-gay therapists are gays themselves. While I hope for a cure of this condition, I don’t want any of my brethrens to suffer unnecessary pains. If this is a violation of free speech, then maybe we should reinstate practices previously banned like lobotomy or blood letting.

Bonus,

but nobody wake up one day becoming gay just as nobody wake up one day and find herself straight.

We still don’t know. The American Psychiatric Association that fostered opinions adopted by the AMA and the British Societies that Homosexuality is fixed, at birth and cannot change is conjecture and unproven.

While I hope for a cure of this condition, I don’t want any of my brethrens to suffer unnecessary pains.

I would ask you to rethink this. To hope for a cure infers it is a disease. I don’t think it is. I just think it is maladaptive behavior. You don’t have to like that. Ok…it is behavior. Behavior is always subjec to change when sufficient motivation is available. What is needed is continuing work with those that want to change to find ways to help them change and what works is yet to be found. Reparative therapy, talking, seems to help some.

 

[CopticChristian]

The American Psychiatric Association is a medical community. They are trained professionals my friend, and you are not.

Bonus,

I am a trained professional that looks with disdain on societies that do not represent the totality of the trained professionals and that people believe speak for all trained professionals. They do not.

Trained professionals do not formulate their opinions based on what any society says. This is a fallacy of public belief. They speak for the society. Not all trained professionals are members of or adhere to that society.

 

[meltzerboy]

Slavonic,

I know. I often see Monikers that say Byzantine Catholic and then see postings that promote homosexuality…sometimes I wonder how it is my view of the world is so skewed?

I disagree with your position, CopticChristian, but I must say you handled this rather uncharitable comment with relative good humor.

 

[DexUK]

Most of that ‘history’ involves either living in shame (which this therapy helps promote), being harassed, being murdered, etc.

How concerned are any of you people about that?

Personally: very concerned. That is why I fight prejudice, misinformation, bigotry or wrong-thinking on the matter when I see it. In particular, there is an undercurrent in the Catholic community that believes homosexual orientation to actually be a behaviour (since they propose that any non-heterosexual orientation must be a chosen one). For any LGBT person who listens to these people, they would be led to the conclusion that, because the Church teaches that homosexual acts are sinful, that means (if they believe that somehow they have made a choice, or that they can choose to change their sexuality) that the very existence of the orientation in them renders them in a permanent state of sin. That leads to hopelessness, self-loathing and despair, and people in such condition HAVE taken their lives in such circumstances. I will therefore not stand by and let the promulgation of that evil idea go unchallenged.

 

[CopticChristian]

Yes, hatred and fear are big motivators. Both are often linked to ignorance and often disguised as having some positive motivation and redeeming moral value.

Meltz,

Let us stop the hate and fear right now. Let us not hate or fear Nicolosi.

 

[CopticChristian]

Personally: very concerned. That is why I fight prejudice, misinformation, bigotry or wrong-thinking on the matter when I see it. In particular, there is an undercurrent in the Catholic community that believes homosexual orientation to actually be a behaviour (since they propose that any non-heterosexual orientation must be a chosen one). For any LGBT person who listens to these people, they would be led to the conclusion that, because the Church teaches that homosexual acts are sinful, that means (if they believe that somehow they have made a choice, or that they can choose to change their sexuality) that the very existence of the orientation in them renders them in a permanent state of sin. That leads to hopelessness, self-loathing and despair, and people in such condition HAVE taken their lives in such circumstances. I will therefore not stand by and let the promulgation of that evil idea go unchallenged.

Dex,

You are a regular Don Quixote with only the opinions of the American Psychiatric Association that were adopted by the British Society as your “science” and authority that are no authority as their position was not based on science, just votes…but ride away and fight those windmills…

 

[edwest2]

to “conquer the world” merely means to dominate, psychologically. If you dominate psychologically, you also do so politically, even if “you”/“your group” is a numerical minority, because it is omnipresent influence that you seek.

The domination is sought to give a minority lifestyle majority privileges and stature, to stifle opposition, and to transform perception universally (through psychological pressure), so that immorality will be viewed, permanently, as moral.

Correct, the Return on Investment is greater when gay groups seek to influence major political figures and organizations to accept their point of view. Not accepting means you are a this and a that and a bad person and/or group.

1973

Gays in the American Psychiatric Association and radical gay activists like Frank Kameny decided it was time to declare war on the APA. After years of studying homosexual persons, publishing reports and collecting data, the APA classified homosexuality as a disorder. Then one day, what was a disorder yesterday became not a disorder today by vote - not science.

After this ‘victory,’ gay activists could go to judges and overturn sodomy laws and campaign for something they call marriage.

Don’t believe me?

amazon.com/Homosexuality-American-Psychiatry-Politics-Diagnosis/dp/0691028370

That is why gays today want approval for their lifestyle from the most powerful people and groups they can find and convince. It is being done under the code words “human rights.”

The bottom line? Nobody, not now or ever, needs my permission to live how they want. But no, they want full psychological normalization, and at all ages.

amazon.com/King-Linda-Haan/dp/1582460612

amazon.com/Daddy-Papa-Me-Lesl%C3%A9a-Newman/dp/1582462623/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1361749954&sr=1-1&keywords=daddy+poppa+and+me

Little kids in public schools are being required to read this.

A few more hints:

International Lesbian and Gay Association
International Gay and Lesbian Human Rights Commission
Gay, Lesbian and Straight Education Network
Human Rights Campaign
Marriage Equality
Equality Across America
Freedom to Marry
Gay Activists Alliance
Gay and Lesbian Advocates and Defenders
Gay Liberation Front
GenderPAC

Peace,
Ed

 

[CopticChristian]

Some LGBT people have an agenda, but they are not a uniform political entity, indistinct from each other, and you would do well to note that.

Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual and Transgender people are all unique, their only common factors being their sexual orientation. Some are highly political, others are quiet and private and do not seek the limelight. Most of them would just like to be left in peace.

Dex,

The ones filing court cases and going to the UN seem not to want to just sit and be left in peace.

 

[CopticChristian]

Try reading the very articles you posted.

For example, JONAH:

abcnews.go.com/Health/nj-lawsuit-alleges-jonah-gay-conversion-therapy-fraud/story?id=17814302

This is not demeaning to you? This is “scientific” to you? This is worthy mental health care to you?

This is a course of action that Christ would endorse? Strip-teases and verbal abuse?

Veritas,

The reports of what happened are reports. I don’t know what happened. Do you believe the reports. I just posted the news as news not necessarily advocating that the reporting is necessarily true.

Facts are facts…the only fact is that the cases are filed…what happened will be revealed in court.

 

[edwest2]

Ed,

glad you jumped in…I know you know that this is real…and have posted about it…thank you…

You’re welcome.

Ed

 

[CopticChristian]

I am not sure what do you mean by a gay history or gay timeline. Historically homosexuals have always existed because it is a condition. Maybe genetic, neurological, or a combination of both, but nobody wake up one day becoming gay just as nobody wake up one day and find herself straight.

Freedom of speech? From what you showed me the medical community is trying to stop a therapeutic practice that poses a threat to MANY people’s psychological being. Many people who have worked in the ex-gay profession have confessed that the methods don’t work while a lot of ex-gay therapists are gays themselves. While I hope for a cure of this condition, I don’t want any of my brethrens to suffer unnecessary pains. If this is a violation of free speech, then maybe we should reinstate practices previously banned like lobotomy or blood letting.

Bonus,

You say you are SSA Catholic. Do you see yourself as part of this advocacy?

 

[edwest2]

I am not sure what do you mean by a gay history or gay timeline. Historically homosexuals have always existed because it is a condition. Maybe genetic, neurological, or a combination of both, but nobody wake up one day becoming gay just as nobody wake up one day and find herself straight.

Freedom of speech? From what you showed me the medical community is trying to stop a therapeutic practice that poses a threat to MANY people’s psychological being. Many people who have worked in the ex-gay profession have confessed that the methods don’t work while a lot of ex-gay therapists are gays themselves. While I hope for a cure of this condition, I don’t want any of my brethrens to suffer unnecessary pains. If this is a violation of free speech, then maybe we should reinstate practices previously banned like lobotomy or blood letting.

Please, you’re not being reasonable.

pfox.org/default.html

Do you think the people in the link are fakes?

Stop the emotionalism, please. This is not a courtroom. Those lawsuits were filed.

Peace,
Ed

 

[PastorBonus]

Bonus,

We still don’t know. The American Psychiatric Association that fostered opinions adopted by the AMA and the British Societies that Homosexuality is fixed, at birth and cannot change is conjecture and unproven.
After various researches and tests. From personal experience I can say they’re pretty accurate since I have had homosexual tendencies since the age of 5

I would ask you to rethink this. To hope for a cure infers it is a disease. I don’t think it is. I just think it is maladaptive behavior. You don’t have to like that. Ok…it is behavior. Behavior is always subjec to change when sufficient motivation is available. What is needed is continuing work with those that want to change to find ways to help them change and what works is yet to be found. Reparative therapy, talking, seems to help some.
Adaptive behavior? There are many cases where people raised in a “macho”, conservative environment develops homosexual tendencies. Your belief that homosexual is simply a behavior is extremely unsound and unscientific (unless you have sufficient proofs). Since you call this an adaptive behavior, shouldn’t homosexuality a non-existent condition since most gays are born by straight parents and that adaptive behaviors come from imitating the parents?

 

[CopticChristian]

Correct, the Return on Investment is greater when gay groups seek to influence major political figures and organizations to accept their point of view. Not accepting means you are a this and a that and a bad person and/or group.

1973

Gays in the American Psychiatric Association and radical gay activists like Frank Kameny decided it was time to declare war on the APA. After years of studying homosexual persons, publishing reports and collecting data, the APA classified homosexuality as a disorder. Then one day, what was a disorder yesterday became not a disorder today by vote - not science.

After this ‘victory,’ gay activists could go to judges and overturn sodomy laws and campaign for something they call marriage.

Don’t believe me?

amazon.com/Homosexuality-American-Psychiatry-Politics-Diagnosis/dp/0691028370

That is why gays today want approval for their lifestyle from the most powerful people and groups they can find and convince. It is being done under the code words “human rights.”

The bottom line? Nobody, not now or ever, needs my permission to live how they want. But no, they want full psychological normalization, and at all ages.

amazon.com/King-Linda-Haan/dp/1582460612

amazon.com/Daddy-Papa-Me-Lesl%C3%A9a-Newman/dp/1582462623/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1361749954&sr=1-1&keywords=daddy+poppa+and+me

Little kids in public schools are being required to read this.

A few more hints:

International Lesbian and Gay Association
International Gay and Lesbian Human Rights Commission
Gay, Lesbian and Straight Education Network
Human Rights Campaign
Marriage Equality
Equality Across America
Freedom to Marry
Gay Activists Alliance
Gay and Lesbian Advocates and Defenders
Gay Liberation Front
GenderPAC

Peace,
Ed

Ed,

Here is the reality, while they think they can force people to think and believe as they see things they do not understand human nature. Example after example.

Christ died on a Cross. People believe he rose from the dead and were persecuted for believing it. They tried to stop people from thinking and believing this. Look what happened.

Protestants broke away and took up thier own beliefs and in time blossomed with devastating results as there is no leadership so their beliefs fragmented and they continue to have beliefs, without any control over those beliefs and no authority or governing body.

Alcoholics anonymous and the disease model try to lord over the medical industry making big money in rehab, money in therapy, as the medical establishment calls addiction a disease even though it isn’t and those that disagree like St. Gregory, St. Jude, Baldwin Research, etc…cannot be silenced in denying that what the establishment says is a disease is not a disease.

The gay agenda cannot control how you think, how you speak, even though they will try and will fail…they forgot freedom of religion…the Catechism will never change and they forgot freedom of speech…therapists speak and they cannot silence them…

It is a folly of observation for failure on their part and those that believe that there is any science behind any of this baloney that is coming out the American Psychiatric Association will find that when the California case goes to trial all this so called science will be presented, discussed, reviewed and found to be hogwash…

What most people don’t know is that a qualified medical professional can offer two differing points of view with supportive medical literature and not silence the other and that will be the outcome…

Too many sympathizers wrongly believe that medicine is black and white and that is as a result of the unfortunate fiasco of the Psychiatric Association.