Homosexuality as the cause of the priest abuse scandal

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The facts speak for themselves. The vast majority of the abuser priests – more than 90 percent – involve molesting teen-age boys.
And 90% of males who are raped in this country are raped by heterosexual men. Im sure if you asked the priests involved, the majority of them would say they are straight.

And they all claim to be not guilty. So what; do you think they’re going to admit to being homosexual when accused of committing homosexual acts with a minor?
 
I’ve heard that homosexuality has been considered the cause of the priest abuse scandal. I was curious if there were any secular, non-Catholic sources that prove this link (as a friend argued with me that the scandal and homosexuality are not at all related).

Pax!

[EDIT] I had asked someone to address Cardinal Bertone’s recent statement that the cause of the priest abuse scandal is homosexuality, to which they responded as follows:

How do I even approach this issue? It’s totally wrong but coming right out and attacking it risks hurting this person. How should I proceed?
I don’t think homosexuality caused the sexual abuse scandal. I think that the molestation of children is a separate issue. Most modern psychiatrists feel that molesters choose children by age rather than by gender. Historically, priests have had easier access to boys. (Many of the sex abuse allegations are from incidents occuring 30 or more years ago.)
I also think that abuse of females has been underreported because society used to have a different view of young girls who were molested by older men. (The woman would sometimes be blamed for her own rape 40 years ago. Young teenage girls were shunned if it became known they had premarital sex, regardless of whether it was consensual.)

The priest who molested me when I was a young teenager told me it was my fault. He said I caused him to do what he did to me. I thought that I was the only one. After he died, I heard about other young girls.
 
Clarification of an issue

**Homosexuality: 1. The Disorder Question **
By Dr. Jeff Mirus | April 15,
catholicculture.org/commentary/otc.cfm?id=633

“In Catholic parlance, what determines whether something is naturally disordered is whether or not it is operating according to its proper end, whether it is properly ordered to its natural purpose. If it is not, we call it ‘disordered’.”

**Homosexuality: 2. The Truth Question **
By Dr. Jeff Mirus | April 15
catholicculture.org/commentary/otc.cfm?id=634

“But it is not at all irrational (nor does it indicate a lack of personal integrity) to be trumped by God. In fact, to permit oneself to be trumped by God is the first lesson in the productive use of human reason.”
 
LCMS_No_More
Glad to hear of your progress. All should be happy to know that “for 15 years Dr Satinover has helped over 50% to overcome their homosexual disorder.” All of these good Catholic people, Fr Harvey, Dr Nicolosi, Dr Satinover and many others, do help and the more everyone understands the better for all concerned.

BTW, I have personal experience within my own family of the problem, that’s why I offer the link to the counsel of these dedicated professionals. The fact that there is an anarchic and virulent cultural power-play in societies, should not dissuade anyone from understanding and helping those in need. It is because the Church understands this that Her faithful can and should offer help.
Yes, we should. Chastity is certainly the first step, but in order to make the chastity tolerable (since SSA isn’t about sex), I would love to see an apostolate that seeks to help men and women with SSA heal the issues that led them to be SSA in the first place. An apostolate about mentoring, not psychology (I didn’t have a psychologist for most of this journey and the one I’ve seen is more interested in handouts–some more useful than others–than just listening to me talk). Courage is about Chastity…I would say more is needed and good, solid Catholic straight men and women would be needed to be involved to help mentor their SSA brothers and sisters in healing.
 
I don’t think homosexuality caused the sexual abuse scandal. I think that the molestation of children is a separate issue. **Most modern psychiatrists feel that molesters choose children by age rather than by gender. ** Historically, priests have had easier access to boys. (Many of the sex abuse allegations are from incidents occuring 30 or more years ago.)
I am afraid I disagree. Referring to the text in bold, while I will not dispute this, I am forced to also point put that these same people assert that homosexual attraction is normal and not a mental disorder, which is clearly and patently false. Therefore, those who insist on such assertions are intellectually dishonest (not referring to you but to the so-called experts) and have zero credibility.
I also think that abuse of females has been underreported because society used to have a different view of young girls who were molested by older men. (The woman would sometimes be blamed for her own rape 40 years ago. Young teenage girls were shunned if it became known they had premarital sex, regardless of whether it was consensual.)
The priest who molested me when I was a young teenager told me it was my fault. He said I caused him to do what he did to me. I thought that I was the only one. After he died, I heard about other young girls.
First, I am wish to express my sorrow over the abuse you experienced and I am deeply saddened by your experience.

(For others watching, GND and I are good friends in real life.)

While I agree with you on the important points you make, I will continue to assert that the priest sex abuse scandal is principally a gay sex scandal. I base that solely on empirical evidence; that evidence being more than 75% of American victims of priest sex abuse are underage post-pubescent males. As for the pre-pubescent children, still the majority were male. No one will ever be able to claim with a straight face that a person who has sex with, or in the case of many of these “priests”, rape, someone of their same gender is not motivated, in part, by an attraction to their own gender, age does not matter. Only a liar or a fool would claim this is not a homosexual acting out. I dare those who claim that a man who rapes a boy does not experience homosexual urges. I double dare you, PROVE YOUR (dishonest/foolish) ASSERTIONS!

Remember, people who suffer from mental disorders are more likely to suffer from multiple disorders, especially when those secondary disorders are related to the same urges and activities of the primary disorder. Homosexual urges are a mental disorder.

The sad and tragic abuse of so many child, the vast majority being boys, by priests is unmistakeably, principally a gay sex scandal. The good cardinal is right.
 
I am afraid I disagree. Referring to the text in bold, while I will not dispute this, I am forced to also point put that these same people assert that homosexual attraction is normal and not a mental disorder, which is clearly and patently false. Therefore, those who insist on such assertions are intellectually dishonest (not referring to you but to the so-called experts) and have zero credibility.

First, I am wish to express my sorrow over the abuse you experienced and I am deeply saddened by your experience.

(For others watching, GND and I are good friends in real life.)

While I agree with you on the important points you make, I will continue to assert that the priest sex abuse scandal is principally a gay sex scandal. I base that solely on empirical evidence; that evidence being more than 75% of American victims of priest sex abuse are underage post-pubescent males. As for the pre-pubescent children, still the majority were male. No one will ever be able to claim with a straight face that a person who has sex with, or in the case of many of these “priests”, rape, someone of their same gender is not motivated, in part, by an attraction to their own gender, age does not matter. Only a liar or a fool would claim this is not a homosexual acting out. I dare those who claim that a man who rapes a boy does not experience homosexual urges. I double dare you, PROVE YOUR (dishonest/foolish) ASSERTIONS!

Remember, people who suffer from mental disorders are more likely to suffer from multiple disorders, especially when those secondary disorders are related to the same urges and activities of the primary disorder. Homosexual urges are a mental disorder.

The sad and tragic abuse of so many child, the vast majority being boys, by priests is unmistakeably, principally a gay sex scandal. The good cardinal is right.
As again, the scandle is not about the actual acts, its about the Hiarchy moving offenders around. Try to label it as something else does absolutly nothing about that fact.
 
I dare those who claim that a man who rapes a boy does not experience homosexual urges. I double dare you, PROVE YOUR (dishonest/foolish) ASSERTIONS!
:hmmm: One can’t prove a negative. Especially to people who have already made up their minds.
 
Jemosh
the scandle is not about the actual acts, its about the Hiarchy moving offenders around. Try to label it as something else does absolutly nothing about that fact.
No one is “labeling” anything. The facts are that the abuse is mainly by homosexual priests.

Secondly there ARE two “scandals”: the abuse, plus the laxity of some bishops.
 
No one is “labeling” anything. The facts are that the abuse is mainly by homosexual priests.

Secondly there ARE two “scandals”: the abuse, plus the laxity of some bishops.
From The Survivors Network of those Abused by Priests
“Of the priests we’ve evaluated, more abuse girls than abuse boys,” says Gary Schoener, a Minneapolis psychologist and expert on clergy sexual abuse.
Despite media emphasis over the years on male victims – boys and men with horrific stories of their own – Schoener and other experts believe that troubled priests and other clergy are more likely to abuse females, especially adult women.
Sometimes their stories trickle out; more often, they do not.
Meanwhile, the number of male victims in a single parish can add up quickly, as one pedophile-priest may have unlimited access for a long period to boys on outings or other male-oriented church activities.
From this, big headlines are made.
Summary:
The majority of the abusers are heterosexual.
The majority of the abused are boys, because just one abuser will often have access to male victims over a long period rather than female ones. Clerical paediphiles, who are equal-opportunity rapists, have far more access to male victims.

Note that this is a victims group saying this, not a pro-gay group.

But yes, the other part of the problem is the cover-up.
 
From The Survivors Network of those Abused by Priests

Summary:
The majority of the abusers are heterosexual.
The majority of the abused are boys, because just one abuser will often have access to male victims over a long period rather than female ones. Clerical paediphiles, who are equal-opportunity rapists, have far more access to male victims.

Note that this is a victims group saying this, not a pro-gay group.

But yes, the other part of the problem is the cover-up.
Ah, a ray of reason!
 
No one is “labeling” anything. The facts are that the abuse is mainly by homosexual priests.

Secondly there ARE two “scandals”: the abuse, plus the laxity of some bishops.
No there is only 1 scandle, its that they were moved around, hidden, or treated with kit gloves. That is solely and the only scandle with it.
 
The Vatican has been resolutely tackling the abuses for a long time, led by Popes John Paul II and Benedict XVI. That is why we now have many renewed seminaries and more faithful priests. The abuses nearly all occurred decades ago.

Power and Authority
by Dr. Jeff Mirus, February 1, 2008

Whether we are talking about the false spirit of Vatican II, the chaos in many religious orders, the secularization of seminaries and Catholic universities, or the decline of parish life, what we have found again and again at the center is bishops and priests (usually men of rank and influence) who themselves had lost their understanding of spiritual authority. This created an identity crisis which rendered them incapable of exercising their power effectively.

Instead, they saw power as an unwarranted inequality, and they rushed to define their powers out of existence, flattening all spiritual relationships. They put themselves at the mercy of a revolution of their own making. And just as the resulting upheaval was caused primarily by a crisis of confidence among the clergy, so too will it be resolved only when the clergy once again understand who they are, and who the laity are, and the spiritual relationship between them. In this they will rediscover their authority. The proper exercise of priestly power will follow as surely as running water follows a thaw. Moreover, it is not just the priests who will become happier. So will the laity. Authority derives from relationships. Authority benefits both sides.

catholicleague.org/rer.php?topic=The+Sex+Abuse+Scandal&id=110
Sexual Abuse in Social Context: Clergy and Other Professionals
2/2004

PREFACE
According to a survey by the Washington Post, over the last four decades, less than 1.5 percent of the estimated 60,000 or more men who have served in the Catholic clergy have been accused of child sexual abuse.[iv] According to a survey by the New York Times, 1.8 percent of all priests ordained from 1950 to 2001 have been accused of child sexual abuse.[v] Thomas Kane, author of Priests are People Too, estimates that between 1 and 1.5 percent of priests have had charges made against them.[vi] Of contemporary priests, the Associated Press found that approximately two-thirds of 1 percent of priests have charges pending against them.[vii]

Almost all the priests who abuse children are homosexuals. Dr. Thomas Plante, a psychologist at Santa Clara University, found that “80 to 90% of all priests who in fact abuse minors have sexually engaged with adolescent boys, not prepubescent children. Thus, the teenager is more at risk than the young altar boy or girls of any age.”[viii]

Notes
[iv]Alan Cooperman, “Hundreds of Priests Removed Since ‘60s; Survey Shows Scope Wider Than Disclosed,” Washington Post, June 9, 2002, p. A1.
[v]Laurie Goodstein, “Decades of Damage; Trail of Pain in Church Crisis Leads to Nearly Every Diocese,” New York Times, January 12, 2003, Section 1, p. 1.
[vi] Interviewed by Bill O’Reilly, Transcript of “The O’Reilly Factor,” May 3, 2002.
[vii] Bob von Sternberg, “Insurance Falls Short in Church Abuse Cases; Catholic Dioceses are Forced to Find other Sources to Pay Settlements,” Star Tribune, July 27, 2002, p. 1A.
[viii] Thomas Plante, “A Perspective on Clergy Sexual Abuse,” www.psywww.com/psyrelig/plante.html.
 
From The Survivors Network of those Abused by Priests

Summary:
The majority of the abusers are heterosexual.
The majority of the abused are boys, because just one abuser will often have access to male victims over a long period rather than female ones. Clerical paediphiles, who are equal-opportunity rapists, have far more access to male victims.

Note that this is a victims group saying this, not a pro-gay group.

But yes, the other part of the problem is the cover-up.
My response is just four words.

Drinking tainted Kool-aide.
 
Well, how about this then:
  1. All homosexual persons who are Catholics should be declared anathema maranatha (outside the Church until Christ comes back), cutting them off from salvation forever.
I don’t think that I would go along with that 100% as it appears to be somewhat extreme. On the other hand, considering what his eminence Cardinal Bertone and others have pointed out, I don’t see why homosexual perverts should be allowed in the Catholic priesthood. Scripture clearly and unambiguously condemns this type of activity.
 
My response is just four words.

Drinking tainted Kool-aide.
A lot of nonsense is being tossed around, but what is the solution? Covering up and paying off don’t seem to satisfactorily address the underlying problems here.
 
Well, how about this then:
  1. All homosexual persons who are Catholics should be declared anathema maranatha (outside the Church until Christ comes back), cutting them off from salvation forever.
  2. The pure, holy and saintly members of the Catholic Church can remain, safe and secure from all alarm and look down their noses at those nasty, horrible homosexual sinners who can’t be saved because they’ve been permanently barred from the Church.
Otherwise, I don’t see the point of bringing this up time and time and time and time and time and time and time again!
Well, we all can see why I normally ignore your posts.

You do not separate the sin from the person. Homosexual urges are not sinful. Homosexual action are. You condemn true Catholics not fr what the Catholic Church teaches, but what you falsely claim the Church teaches. Then you mock Catholic based on your erroneous premise. One cannot be authentically Catholic and believe that homosexuals are evil or that homosexual activity is morally permissible.

Love the sinner, hate the sin.

Catholic teaching also states that sexual activity outside of marriage is also sinful.

But even so, your post is off topic.
 
Homosexual urges are not sinful. .
I don’t think that this is true, at least without clarification. It is a mortal sin to look with lust after a woman according to Scripture, since you have already committed adultery in your heart. Now if heterosexual urges are a mortal sin, then your comment would not be true.
 
Perceptive, sidbrown. The temptation is not sinful, but continuing to allow it to foster thoughts of sinful actions would be.
 
Well, we all can see why I normally ignore your posts.

You do not separate the sin from the person. Homosexual urges are not sinful.
Agreed]
Homosexual action are.
Yes, sexual relations between members of the same sex is immoral and sinful.
You condemn true Catholics not fr what the Catholic Church teaches, but what you falsely claim the Church teaches. Then you mock Catholic based on your erroneous premise.
It’s called hyperbole. That “solution” of permanently excommunicating and permanently excluding all homosexual persons from the Church seems to be the motivation for the large number of people blaming “homosexuals” for the scandal, especially when no solution is presented. It makes it seem like all homosexual people are somehow complicit or involved in the abuse that led to the scandals.
One cannot be authentically Catholic and believe that homosexuals are evil or that homosexual activity is morally permissible.
That is very exquisitely worded and exactly correct:

An authentic Catholic must believe both:
Homosexual persons are not evil.
Homosexual sexual activity is not morally permissible.
Love the sinner, hate the sin.
Considering everyone is a sinner…
Catholic teaching also states that sexual activity outside of marriage is also sinful.
Agreed.
But even so, your post is off topic.
Indeed? Says you. I was presenting it as a hyperbolic “solution” to the problem of homosexual persons becoming priests and diddling teenagers. No homosexual persons in the Church, no homosexual priests. Problem solved.

I don’t actually believe that, of course. I understand what it’s like to be same-sex attracted.

What solutions would you like to see to prevent further abuse?
 
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