Hooray for our Bishops!

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**Calling sin by a new name doesn’t change its substance **

**Magazine article on cohabitating couples ‘bafflingly naïve’ **

One of my vivid memories as a young priest was watching the United States exit Vietnam after claiming to win at the bargaining table. Less than two years later, Saigon collapsed, and the war ended.
I knew plenty of serious Catholics who opposed the war. I knew many others who supported it. But no one on either side believed that we left because we had “won.” Americans have a genius for marketing, and one of the things we’ve learned from experience is that we can often make bad news look better by giving it a different name. The problem stays the same, but at least we feel happier about it — for awhile.
I remembered this as I read a recent article in U.S. Catholic magazine. Since the 1960s, premarital sexual activity has greatly increased. So has the number of couples living together outside marriage. In some dioceses today, as many as 90 percent of the couples who present themselves for marriage preparation already live together and have sexual relations.
But “A betrothal proposal,” written by two marriage researchers, argues that a big difference exists between sexually active couples who casually cohabit, and “nuptial cohabiters” who intend marriage. The former couples are, say the authors, far more likely to split up than the latter, should they marry.
This makes sense. The intent to marry and the intent to enjoy sex as a kind of recreation are very different motives. Nor is pre-nuptial sex “news” to any confessor. Love and human nature being as they are, engaged couples have always had a difficult time refraining from sexual intimacy. This doesn’t make sexual relations between engaged persons morally right. It merely explains the behavior. It also highlights the need for Catholic couples to have strong support and guidance in waiting until they marry.
The U.S. Catholic article goes beyond identifying a problem, though. The authors argue that “current pastoral responses to cohabiting couples [are] both uninformed and outdated” and that “Our experience with young [cohabiting] adults leads us to doubt the claim that they are living in sin. It would appear closer to the truth that they are growing, perhaps slowly but nonetheless surely, into grace.” The authors also examine the history of Catholic thought about marriage and suggest “a return to the marital sequence of betrothal (with appropriate ritual to ensure community involvement), sexual intercourse, possible fertility, then ritual wedding to acknowledge and mark the consummation of both valid marriage and sacrament.”
I believe in the intelligence and good will of the authors. I also believe that their argument is bafflingly naïve. If the Church, in her reflection on the Gospel, has always taught that sex outside marriage is morally wrong, then for the Church to now bless “nuptial cohabiters” amounts to colluding in sin. Ritualizing a sinful behavior, or calling it a nicer name, does not change its substance. The very last thing we need in a society already awash in confused sexuality is a strategy for accommodating it.
The greatest irony of the U.S. Catholic article comes in a comment by the authors that many young adults “cite confusion about Church teaching because Church leaders send mixed messages about sex, contraception, and divorce/annulment.” I very much agree. And one of the sources of that confusion might be Catholic publications, theologians and researchers who help feed it.
We need more support for marriage in society and the Church, not alternative arrangements. Cohabiting couples deserve the understanding and patience of the Catholic community, but above all they need to hear the Christian truth, persuasively offered, about the nature of marriage, the meaning of their sexuality and the importance of the family. We waste words and time when we focus on anything else.
 
The above article was by Bishop Chaput.
Are there more articles out there that are current …that help define our faith like this one…all I can say is WOW!
Go Bishop go!
 
The article was from U.S. Catholic? Well, there’s your problem…
That was the only magazine that was so messed up that I actually cancelled a year-long subscription after two or three months and requested a refund!

Bishop Chaput is great… I first heard about him because he had hired Christopher West as the diocesan Director of Family Life and had allowed him to travel extensively to talk about the Theology of the Body. Automatic good marks IMHO!

It seems the article is more anecdotal than actually statistical. The statistics I’ve seen said that the divorce rate for couples who had previously cohabited is 75% (as opposed to the overall divorce rate for new marriages of 50%). Now, if “maybe as much as 90%” of marrying couples have cohabited, then that would mean that the divorce rate for NON cohabiting couples is almost 0%. Not such a good idea, after all…
 
link to “BETROTHAL PROPOSAL”, in case anyone wants it.
Please keep in mind this is a proposal for discussion, not a formal presentation to Rome.

Bishop:
I believe in the intelligence and good will of the authors. I also believe that their argument is bafflingly naïve. If the Church, in her reflection on the Gospel, has always taught that sex outside marriage is morally wrong, then for the Church to now bless “nuptial cohabiters” amounts to colluding in sin.
Sex outside of marriage is morally wrong, but the argument for formal betrothal is not “sex outside marraige”, because the process to Matrimony has already begun. Pre-ceremonial, yes, but not absolutely pre-marital. I was disappointed that the bishop did not elaborate on the pre-Tridentine practice, and if anyone has any hard data to support or refute the following claim, please bring it forth.
Since these couples will have already initiated their marriage through betrothal, their intercourse would not be premarital but marital, as it was in the pre-Tridentine Catholic Church.
Correct me if I am wrong, but I think a certain amount of actual grace is granted to a penitent on their way to the confessional before receiving sanctifying grace of absolution.
And I think it would be silly to ordain priests so they can qualify to enter the seminary.
I believe that “yes” followed by “I do” is of similar substance.
I think the Church should bring back The Rite of Betrothal, and continue to discourage pre-ceremonial sex, and if couples have their moments of indescretion they should submit to the wisdom of the Church to measure the moral dangers in the light of consequence. The divorce rates for them is not the same, the consequences are not the same, the morality is…
…up for discussion. .
 
The authors also examine the history of Catholic thought about marriage and suggest “a return to the marital sequence of betrothal (with appropriate ritual to ensure community involvement), sexual intercourse, possible fertility, then ritual wedding to acknowledge and mark the consummation of both valid marriage and sacrament.”
Did… he just claim that sex itself effects a sacramental marriage, and that the marriage ceremony itself is nothing but a nice symbol?
Sex outside of marriage is morally wrong, but the argument for formal betrothal is not “sex outside marraige”, because the process to Matrimony has already begun. Pre-ceremonial, yes, but not absolutely pre-marital. I was disappointed that the bishop did not elaborate on the pre-Tridentine practice, and if anyone has any hard data to support or refute the following claim, please bring it forth.
Every piece of apologetics-oriented, Theology of the Body based literature I have ever read says specifically that right when the sacrament of marriage is effected, the two people are fundamentally changed. Before the sacrament, they are not, in any sense, married. Afterward, they have irreversibly become one flesh.

When does the author claim that the two become one flesh? At betrothal? Then all he’s done is move the formal ceremony to long after the two people were actually married. When they have sex? Is there any basis for that position? Does he claim that this spectacular, irreversible transformation is a long process spanning all the stages he mentioned? Is he arguing for sex when the two are “sorta-kinda” married and still “sorta-kinda” not?

His position is incredibly ambiguous and plays into the desires of our culture suspiciously well.
 
People really need to give clear citations as to who said what.

I’d like to comment on this, but the thread is a mess.
 
An interesting article on LifeStieNEws.com noted that a study published by the journal Demography has shown that cohabitation ends in separation 90% of the time.

The lead researcher was Daniel Lichter at Cornell.

The study showed that 50% of all cohabiting unions ended within a year and 90% within 5 years.

It would seem that the authors of the article in U.S. Catholic are not only naive, but lousy researchers. Sadly, I don’t think the article has been put up for peer review.
 
It would seem that the authors of the article in U.S. Catholic are not only naive, but lousy researchers. Sadly, I don’t think the article has been put up for peer review.
Do you have any data to back up this statement?
 
See the rest of my post; the research is there.
An interesting article on LifeStieNEws.com noted that a study published by the journal Demography has shown that cohabitation ends in separation 90% of the time.
The lead researcher was Daniel Lichter at Cornell.
The study showed that 50% of all cohabiting unions ended within a year and 90% within 5 years.
Is this what you mean by the rest of your post? There doesn’t seem to be any support that the research was lousy:confused:
 
An interesting article on LifeStieNEws.com noted that a study published by the journal Demography has shown that cohabitation ends in separation 90% of the time.

The lead researcher was Daniel Lichter at Cornell.

The study showed that 50% of all cohabiting unions ended within a year and 90% within 5 years.

It would seem that the authors of the article in U.S. Catholic are not only naive, but lousy researchers. Sadly, I don’t think the article has been put up for peer review.
“Betrothal Proposal”: <<click here
Although only non-nuptial cohabitation is linked to an increased likelihood of divorce after marriage, the fact that many Catholics believe otherwise leaves current pastoral responses to cohabiting couples both uninformed and outdated. It also raises questions about church documents based on old research and the pastoral approaches they recommend. Church documents continue to lump all cohabiters together, focus narrowly on the sexual dimension of relationships, and ignore the variety and complexity of the intentions, situations, and meanings couples give to cohabitation and its morality.
Given the current research that demonstrates that not all cohabiters are alike, we propose the re-introduction of an ancient ritual of betrothal for nuptial cohabiters, followed by intensive marriage preparation in the Catholic pastoral tradition.
It might have worked in a culture after the 3rd century and before the Council of Trent, but I don’t think it would work in a culture of death. I still think that engaged couples would benefit from this ancient rite by providing further opportunity for education, spiritual formation and discernment, not a license for sex. The rite is not done in the United States, but is in other countries, so it’s nothing new.

Betrothal - Catholic Encyclopedia<<click here
 
Rather easy coming from a celibate Bishop, imo.
I’m not sure what you’re suggesting. Are you suggesting that if the celibate Bishop were an engaged lay Catholic instead, he wouldn’t oppose this proposal? Are you suggesting that chastity is “too much to ask” of an engaged couple? Are you suggesting that a bishop doesn’t deserve a voice in the matter for lack of personal experience? Do you think John Paul II’s commentary on human sexuality is “rather easy coming from a celibate bishop”?

The most serious problem with this article isn’t the proposal itself. Let’s assume, for just a second, that the proposal is totally legit; let’s assume that the writer’s history is perfectly accurate and that in the pre-Tridentine church, betrothal and consummation together made up the process of the sacrament of marriage, and that the wedding ceremony was a sign further integrating the couple into the community. Let’s even assume that the re-introduction of that process today is a good idea and what our culture needs.

The real problem is that the author makes it clear that he knows that this format of betrothal, consummation, and symbolic ceremony is not currently in place (why else would he be proposing it?), and yet he still defends engaged couples who are having sex today:
Recent focus groups of young Catholic adults on “problematic aspects of church teaching” found that they disagreed with church teaching on premarital sex and cohabitation and do not see a fundamental difference in a loving relationship before and after a wedding. Our experience with young adults leads us to doubt the claim that they are living in sin. It would appear closer to the truth that they are growing, perhaps slowly but nonetheless surely, into grace.
The problem isn’t his proposal, as much as the proposal itself is probably the exact opposite of what we need in our culture today. The problem is that he clearly and unequivocally defends mortal sin.
 
Darn it! The above post is by me; I used my brother’s account again.
 
Is this what you mean by the rest of your post? There doesn’t seem to be any support that the research was lousy:confused:
Sorry; I wasn’t clear.
The lousy research I was referring to was the alleged “research” by the writers in US Catholic. They obviously did not do adequate research about kids shacking up, or they would have come across the research by Cornell.

Nor is an article in US Catholic subject to peer review; that occurs in theological and sociological journals, not mass publications.

Sorry, didn’t mean to be so cryptic!
 
Sorry; I wasn’t clear.
The lousy research I was referring to was the alleged “research” by the writers in US Catholic. They obviously did not do adequate research about kids shacking up, or they would have come across the research by Cornell.

Nor is an article in US Catholic subject to peer review; that occurs in theological and sociological journals, not mass publications.

Sorry, didn’t mean to be so cryptic!
Thank you for clearing up my confusion or at least trying.😃
 
I’d just like to point out that I appreciate the bishop’s response…he is quite informed about the issue and states his case clearly and without resorting to the type of vitrol that posters on this board did when this subject was first brought up a couple of months ago.

He refutes the argument without finding it necessary to repudiate the intelligence or intentions of the authors.
 
Rather easy coming from a celibate Bishop, imo.
I don’t think Exalt is making any objections to celibacy. I think the focus should be on the difficulties and temptations of engaged couples who ascend to the teachings of the Church, but are unable to live them. I’m glad the bishop acknowledged there difficulties. Engaged couples, if the Claretians are accurate, do not believe they are using each other as objects (the primary factor of premarital sex without commitment)

There are many more who are not cohabitating, and take it all to the confessional when they fall. This humility is admirable but it still doesn’t solve the problem of 90% of couples having pre-ceremonial consumation.

Squeezing in a confession after the last ‘time’ and before the ceremony is also a sin of presumption, not to mention legalism, so there is a problem that catechesis, encyclicals and Engagement Encounters has not solved. Diligent application with much self-disciple, and plenty of chaperones around is all they need! (is this sand deep enough?)
 
“…growing, perhaps slowly but nonetheless surely, into grace.”

Well, let’s see…there’s sin and then there’s grace. What on earth are they trying to say here? If they haven’t reached grace, wouldn’t that be, ummm, sin? No wonder there’s confusion-especially if the researchers are confused!

No sin, no evil, no Satan. Looks like the evil one is still burning the midnight oil… and patiently waiting.

Christ’s peace to all.
 
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