How best to handle liturgical abuse?

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kyrieliberame7

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I attend a Catholic university. At the daily mass the other day, the priest, before beginning the Eucharistic prayer, invited those in attendance to “gather around the altar”. A few did, I and a few others remained sitting. Keep in mind, those who went up the altar were not instituted acolytes or serve any liturgical function. Post-communion, the chalice and paten were left at the lavabo table, and the priest did not purify the vessels after.

The celebrant was a foreign (Indian) Jesuit, not the head of the campus ministry office.

First, is this an abuse?

Second, how should I address it?
 
  1. Yes, these are abuses.
  2. Write a politely-worded letter to his superior.
 
Perhaps it may be easier for a deacon to “just talk to the guy”, yet for us, at least myself, approaching a priest to inquire about correcting a liturgical abuse is a place than is uncomfortable. I can easily see this priest telling me that he is the priest, and to trust that what he is doing is fine, even though I know it isn’t.
 
Perhaps it may be easier for a deacon to “just talk to the guy”, yet for us, at least myself, approaching a priest to inquire about correcting a liturgical abuse is a place than is uncomfortable. I can easily see this priest telling me that he is the priest, and to trust that what he is doing is fine, even though I know it isn’t.
If you find him so unapproachable that you can’t ask him why he is doing that then perhaps you should let the matter drop. If it bothers you then perhaps you could find another Mass. Look, I suspect things aren’t always done by the rules at my parish but I don’t assume. I don’t ask why things are done a certain way because I don’t want to be an altar server. 😊😊😊
 
Really? I honestly expected more from an ordained cleric of the Church. I asked this forum if it was an abuse. The consensus was that it was. Liturgical abuse should be addressed. It is not an easy thing for a lay person to tell a priest they are wrong on liturgy. And your advice is grow up.

Pray for our deacons.
 
  1. Yes, these are abuses.
  2. Write a politely-worded letter to his superior.
Nooooo…Listen to Deacon Jeff…his suggestions are spot on…even a politely worded letter to a superior is rude and unclassy without first addressing it with the priest concerned.

Superiors, be they Pastors or bishops have enough on their plate not to be forced into rolling in the weeds with those with their feathers rubbed the wrong way!:eek:
 
Its a liturgical abuse. Not just ruffled feathers because I didn’t like the homily.
 
Most Jesuits I know march to their own tune. In other words, they do what they want when it comes to the Mass. The last one we had as a substitute priest made up his own Mass as he went along.

If this priest will be around for awhile, I would address the matter to him privately first. If that doesn’t resolve the matter, take it a step higher.
 
[edited]

Pease consider that some priest do not know. Pray for them. I agree that it is not easy to talk to the priest that is why I write a letter. I try to write in non critical way asking why he is doing it the way he is doing it when according to canon law, catechism, etc. it states differently? I agree that abuse should be questioned. I know that our priest was recently challenged on what he was doing. He wasn’t doing it wrong but because it bothered the person he changed it. We have a wonderful pastor. 🙂
 
For what it’s worth…these types of letters (even very polite and well written ones) tend to go in the round filing cabinet.
Our late Archbishop told me he never gave these kinds of letters any of his time. 🤷
I agree, let it go. In the grand scheme of things, it’s not causing the Mass to be invalid.
 
For what it’s worth…these types of letters (even very polite and well written ones) tend to go in the round filing cabinet.
Our late Archbishop told me he never gave these kinds of letters any of his time. 🤷
I agree, let it go. In the grand scheme of things, it’s not causing the Mass to be invalid.
My experience is quite different. I guess it depends on the Bishop. My letter effected a change in the parish. It was not my intent I was disturbed that people didn’t kneel because there was no kneelers that they didn’t bow at the consecration. The pastor had not answered my letter. I asked the Bishop if they should be bowing the next thing I knew kneelers were installed. :eek: The letter from the Bishop thanked me for my (name removed by moderator)ut. Even if they are just thrown away, I feel that at least I tried it is the Bishop who leads and it is up to him but as the Bishop told me he couldn’t be in every parish. BTW parishioners have a right to be heard.
 
Definitely talk to the priest first. If that fails you can speak to his superior. How can you pay attention to the mass if you are looking for abuses? If the matter and the words are correct, any other abuse is minor.
 
[edited]

Sometimes the direct advice is the most effective.
It’s good advice.
The Church needs mature relationships between clergy and lay, not relationships of suspicion, doubt, and “gotcha”. If you can’t talk to a person directly about their faults, drop it. If it’s really important that you address the priest, then find some courage and do it.
 
Really? I honestly expected more from an ordained cleric of the Church. I asked this forum if it was an abuse. The consensus was that it was. Liturgical abuse should be addressed. It is not an easy thing for a lay person to tell a priest they are wrong on liturgy. And your advice is grow up.

Pray for our deacons.
The deacon is trained five years and works closely with priests every day. He knows what he is talking about.

Perhaps the discomfort you feel is pride. Maybe you should ask why he did what he did and have a conversation with the man instead of “telling a priest they are wrong on liturgy”. You might gain a friend and learn something that way.

Ten people on this thread said “talk to the priest” or “forget it” or 'give him the benefit of the doubt." That’s a pretty strong consensus right there.

I’ve been to campus Mass like that. I didn’t go back. Problem solved.

If you really want to stick it to the priest then go back day after day and ask him to hear your confession until he is sick of you. 👍

-Tim-
 
Does any one have any idea how many “charitable” letters a Bishops receives about their priests?
 
  1. Write a politely-worded letter to his superior.
It doesn’t matter how polite it is, it’s rude.

Imagine this scenario. It’s happened to me at work. You do something on a project. You had very good reasons for doing it, but the project manager disagrees (in my case because he wasn’t aware of some technical limitation).

Instead of coming to see you and discussing it, he goes and tattles to your boss instead. You hear nothing of it until your annual review a few months later, when your boss gives you heck for “making a mistake”.

Would you not have preferred discussing it with the project manager first to clear up what could simply be a misunderstanding? I know I would have. I also know my boss was unprofessional himself.

If I had been the boss, I would have asked the PM “did you discuss it with Ora?”, and if the PM said no, I’d say “go back and ask him, perhaps he knows something you don’t which made him do it that way”. It would have been cleared up in two minutes.

Similarly, if I were the bishop, and I received such a letter, I would promptly file it in the round filing cabinet. I probably wouldn’t have the time to call every parishioner who called complaining about this or that liturgical error to ask if the writer had spoken to the priest first.

Do unto others as you would have them do unto you. Going over someone’s head, or behind their back, is something nobody likes, so why do it to a man of God? He’s your shepherd, you’re not his liturgical cop.

Note too I called it a “liturgical error”. The charitable thing to do is assume the priest made a genuine mistake. It happens, they’re human. Calling it an “abuse” presumes ill will on the part of the priest. We shouldn’t presume ill will unless it’s glaringly obvious.
 
I attend a Catholic university. At the daily mass the other day, the priest, before beginning the Eucharistic prayer, invited those in attendance to “gather around the altar”. A few did, I and a few others remained sitting. Keep in mind, those who went up the altar were not instituted acolytes or serve any liturgical function. Post-communion, the chalice and paten were left at the lavabo table, and the priest did not purify the vessels after.

The celebrant was a foreign (Indian) Jesuit, not the head of the campus ministry office.

First, is this an abuse?

Second, how should I address it?
Sounds to me that this was a very small congregation present for this celebration of the Mass. Depending on the situation it may not be considered an abuse to invite those present into the sanctuary for the consecration; without knowing all the details I would refrain from saying whether this is an abuse or not.

I have taken part in celebrations of Mass in homes, hospital rooms and many locations where all were technically in the “sanctuary”. In a situation where there are larger numbers of people then no, it would not be appropriate. Furthermore, this as you stated is a campus chapel and probably relatively small.

As far as purifying the vessels, our bishop insists on placing the sacred vessels on the credence table and purifying them after Mass and after greeting the people. This is not an abuse but an option specifically afforded by the GIRM.

So I would say, effeminately do not write to anyone because there is nothing that is of any consequence top write about, then take the advice of the other posters, offer it up then let it go.
 
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