How come we fight?

[Gottle_of_Geer]

I am in a very good mood right now, so I am just gonna type out one of them hippie topics. Prepare yourselves.

How come Christians fight each other? Debating, thats good, helps the mind, but some of what I see, not just on here, is just flat out bashing. It is like gangs. One bashes the other, the other retaliates, it counter-retaliatites, goes on and on and on. Rather retarded.

How come ? Because human nature (at present anyway) is very nasty indeed. Not just unpleasant - but revolting, horrible, foul. IOW, not nice.​

Christians have always fought one another, ever since James & John wanted to have places of honour next to Christ. Paul accuses Peter (but does not,of course, give Peter’s side). Paul quarrels with Barnabas because of John Mark. Paul spent years running down those he called “false brethren”. He does not give their side either; he lectures people unceasingly, so we never hear one word of what the Ephesians, Romans, Phlippians, Colossians & the rest may have thought. His voice alone is audible.

Christianity has always been full of bitterness & rivalry & oneupmanship. So much for the Gospel of reconciliation Paul talked about - Christianity is anything but conciliatory. Its appallingly violent record is what one would expect of a religion so full of bitterness so early on. What you’ve noticed goes back to the earliest days of Christianity

That Christianity is so poisonous surely says something about the sort of thing it is - its works betray its character.

 

[Gottle_of_Geer]

This wouldn’t work. Those who didn’t like the outcome of the votes would just break off and start their own denominations. This isn’t a shot at Protestantism it is just what would happen. Liberal Christians would not remain in a Church that voted down their liberal beliefs and conservatives wouldn’t remain if the vote went the other way. Look at the Anglican Communion.

God bless

Maybe this shows that Christianity is not, cannot be, must not be, a dogmatic religion: that dogma distorts it, by making it a body of propositions that must be believed on pain of excommunication (& in the past, often on pain of death), rather than a message of liberation from the power of sin & evil. The lust to know what has not been revealed is no better than the sexual kind - worse, in fact. Who cares if God is Triune or not ? Jesus commanded love of one another - not curiosity & prying into the hidden things of God; nor dogmatic perfection. Silly squabbles about the Incarnation have done nothing but shatter the Church into armed camps hurling curses at one another - what could possibly be more blasphemous than such a horrible distortion of the expressed Will of Christ ? That is what the dogmatic principle has done If beliefs have no connection with, no influence on, how we behave, they are a waste of time.​

 

[Roman_Catholic_1]

Maybe this shows that Christianity is not, cannot be, must not be, a dogmatic religion: that dogma distorts it, by making it a body of propositions that must be believed on pain of excommunication (& in the past, often on pain of death), rather than a message of liberation from the power of sin & evil. The lust to know what has not been revealed is no better than the sexual kind - worse, in fact. Who cares if God is Triune or not ? Jesus commanded love of one another - not curiosity & prying into the hidden things of God; nor dogmatic perfection. Silly squabbles about the Incarnation have done nothing but shatter the Church into armed camps hurling curses at one another - what could possibly be more blasphemous than such a horrible distortion of the expressed Will of Christ ? That is what the dogmatic principle has done If beliefs have no connection with, no influence on, how we behave, they are a waste of time.​

Perhaps you are right, but how do you escape dogmas? The statement that Christianity is the liberation from the power of sin and evil is, in itself, a dogma, or rather contains dogmas, namely the dogmas of sin, evil and the liberation from them.

You are also right that Jesus commanded us to love one another but we are also told to worship in Spirit and in Truth. Scripture also speaks to unity and staying away from dissensions and false doctrines:

Rom. 15:5 Paul tells us we must have harmony between us.

Rom. 16:17 Paul again is warning us to stay away from those who create dissensions and conflicts.

1 Cor. 14:33 God is not the God of confusion.

1 Peter 3:8 Peter charges us to have unity in spirit.

Phil. 2:2 Paul prays that we will have one mind.

1 Tim. 1:3 Paul states that he commanded Timothy to remain in Ephesus to keep believers in the truth

1 Tim 4:1 Paul talks about those in the future giving head to errors.

Ephesians 4:14 Paul speaks on cunning men tossing children to and fro with false doctrines and lies.

Titus 1:9 Paul talks about being in sound doctrine.

I don’t have the answers, my original comment was a reflection on the the history of Christianity.

I don’t know GoG, you are a very thoughtful contributor to this forum, but would you as a Catholic sacrifice your beliefs in the Eucharist or the divinity of Christ for unity? What kind of unity would that be?

I found this to be a great article by Peter Kreeft on uniting the Church:

Can unity be achieved? If and only if there is a way, a road. A dream is not enough. There must be a Jacob’s ladder to connect the heavenly dream to earth. There is a ladder, and the angels continually ascend and descend on it. It is not a method or a teaching or a technique. It is a way, not a method; a truth, not a teaching; a life, not a technique. It is, of course, the one who said: “I am the Way, the Truth, and the Life,” and then continued: “No man comes to the Father but by me.” Unity is with the Father. The only way to unity is the Son.”

The way from unity to disunity was through the loss of Christ as the center. Therefore the only way back is through Christ as the center, through letting Christ rule our churches completely. This is a guaranteed recipe for success. For we know his will is unity (reread Jn 17:20—26). Therefore if we only let him do his will in us we will have unity.

http://www.peterkreeft.com/topics-more/toward-reuniting.htm

God bless

 

[MDK]

Maybe this shows that Christianity is not, cannot be, must not be, a dogmatic religion: that dogma distorts it, by making it a body of propositions that must be believed on pain of excommunication (& in the past, often on pain of death), rather than a message of liberation from the power of sin & evil. The lust to know what has not been revealed is no better than the sexual kind - worse, in fact. Who cares if God is Triune or not ? Jesus commanded love of one another - not curiosity & prying into the hidden things of God; nor dogmatic perfection. Silly squabbles about the Incarnation have done nothing but shatter the Church into armed camps hurling curses at one another - what could possibly be more blasphemous than such a horrible distortion of the expressed Will of Christ ? That is what the dogmatic principle has done If beliefs have no connection with, no influence on, how we behave, they are a waste of time.​

Doctrines and dogma are essential to knowing more about Christ. It’s not the problem with doctrine or dogma, it’s that people have rejected what Christ has established. In rejecting Christ and preferring their own ways, they create their own doctrine and dogma, which is at variance with what Christ gave us in His deposit of faith, and the visible head of His Church, and the authoritative teaching Church He built, which never has taught error in faith and morals. Christ gave us a means to know the Truth. However, some reject this in part or in whole. It’s not a problem at all of true doctrine or dogma as given to us by Christ through His deposit of faith and taught without error only in His Church, which upholds and defends the truth.

 

[MDK]

I am in a very good mood right now, so I am just gonna type out one of them hippie topics. Prepare yourselves.

How come Christians fight each other? Debating, thats good, helps the mind, but some of what I see, not just on here, is just flat out bashing. It is like gangs. One bashes the other, the other retaliates, it counter-retaliatites, goes on and on and on. Rather retarded.

I think we should all unite under Orthocatholotastints (Catholics+Orthodox+Protestants=ITS OVER 9000!).

Well, that might not work, but this might.

How about we have a minister from every church (yes I mean every physical church) meet at certain locations, probably 1 per state, and for Europe and others, 1 per province, or however, and they vote on certain subjects, larger subjects, such as:

Homosexuality, Women Preachers, Abortion, and others.

Then all of them elect 1 to represent them, then they meet at a national one ,then they elect 1 to represent them, then International. I doubt it’d work, but just throwing things out.

Or we could just work on more focused issues seperately. I would focus on these mainly:

Trinity, Prayer, Respect, Tolerance, Intelligence (If I ran a church, I’d want every member to be able to recite the bible, but thats just cause I am insane over lack of organization and lack of policy).

Good video fro us all to kinda watch and see how people unite: youtube.com/watch?v=7cMxJBenigY

We are not a peace with each other, because we are not at peace with ourselves. We are not at peace with ourselves, because we are not at peace with God.

Peace be with you.

 

[MDK]

How come ? Because human nature (at present anyway) is very nasty indeed. Not just unpleasant - but revolting, horrible, foul. IOW, not nice.​

Christians have always fought one another, ever since James & John wanted to have places of honour next to Christ. Paul accuses Peter (but does not,of course, give Peter’s side). Paul quarrels with Barnabas because of John Mark. Paul spent years running down those he called “false brethren”. He does not give their side either; he lectures people unceasingly, so we never hear one word of what the Ephesians, Romans, Phlippians, Colossians & the rest may have thought. His voice alone is audible.

Christianity has always been full of bitterness & rivalry & oneupmanship. So much for the Gospel of reconciliation Paul talked about - Christianity is anything but conciliatory. Its appallingly violent record is what one would expect of a religion so full of bitterness so early on. What you’ve noticed goes back to the earliest days of Christianity

That Christianity is so poisonous surely says something about the sort of thing it is - its works betray its character.

Christianity is not poisonous. These are not the works of Christianity. These are works done by fallible people who call themselves Christian, and may seek to follow Christ, but can and do fail.

Works of Christianity are identified by faith working in love, by the Grace of God. They are life-giving, and counteract the poisons of the world which rejects Christ. Faith working in love aids in working out one’s salvation, acting by the saving Grace of God to do what Christ has asked us to do as fruitful branches of the One Vine.