How do Muslims (who read the NT) answer Luke 24: 19 -27?

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Answer Jesus first then be fair and kindly go back a bit:)

Luke 9:22-27

22 saying to his disciples , ‘The Son of Man must undergo great suffering, and be rejected by the elders, chief priests, and scribes, and be killed, and on the third day be raised.’

23 Then he said to them all, ‘If any want to become my followers, let them deny themselves and take up their cross daily and follow me. 24For those who want to save their life will lose it, and those who lose their life for my sake will save it. 25What does it profit them if they gain the whole world, but lose or forfeit themselves? 26Those who are ashamed of me and of my words, of them the Son of Man will be ashamed when he comes in his glory and the glory of the Father and of the holy angels. 27But truly I tell you, there are some standing here who will not taste death before they see the kingdom of God.’

May peace reign in your heart as mine. Alleluia. What a beautiful Sunday it has been. :highprayer: Today’s Gospel was awesome. Luke 5: 1-11. Praise the Lord!

MJ
If Gospels were directly from Jesus then we could say that Bible and Qur’an conflict but Gospels were written very later. And that can be interpreted in that way: God might had informed Jesus that he would be rejected and adjudged to be killed. So perhaps Jesus had not known that God would save him. Because Jesus did not say that he had raised from death after cross.
 
Old Testament: Isaiah 53…

Who has believed our message

and to whom has the arm of the Lord been revealed?




because he poured out his life unto death,

and was numbered with the transgressors.

For he bore the sin of many,

and made intercession for the transgression.
That is for prophets before Jesus and that demonstrate that suffering was/is not a specific case only for Jesus but for many prophets who suffered and being killed. So that doctrine Jesus was suffered and died on cross as sacrificial for all human sins is not so valid.
 
If Gospels were directly from Jesus then we could say that Bible and Qur’an conflict but Gospels were written very later. And that can be interpreted in that way: God might had informed Jesus that he would be rejected and adjudged to be killed. So perhaps Jesus had not known that God would save him. Because Jesus did not say that he had raised from death after cross.
Jesus said to her, “I am the resurrection and the life. Whoever believes in me, though he die, yet shall he live, and everyone who lives and believes in me shall never die. Do you believe this?”

John 11:25-26

Jesus said, “Do not hold on to me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father. Go instead to my brothers and tell them, ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.’”

Mary Magdalene went to the disciples with the news: “I have seen the Lord!” And she told them that he had said these things to her.

John 20:11-18

So the Bible was interpreted badly, but people say Qur’an was interpreted badly so which is it ?
 
That is for prophets before Jesus and that demonstrate that suffering was/is not a specific case only for Jesus but for many prophets who suffered and being killed. So that doctrine Jesus was suffered and died on cross as sacrificial for all human sins is not so valid.
Catechism of the Catholic Church 601
The Scriptures had foretold this divine plan of salvation through the putting to death of “the righteous one, my Servant” as a mystery of universal redemption, that is, as the ransom that would free men from the slavery of sin.Citing a confession of faith that he himself had “received”, St. Paul professes that “Christ died for our sins in accordance with the scriptures.” In particular Jesus’ redemptive death fulfills Isaiah’s prophecy of the suffering Servant. Indeed Jesus himself explained the meaning of his life and death in the light of God’s suffering Servant. After his Resurrection he gave this interpretation of the Scriptures to the disciples at Emmaus, and then to the apostles.
 
If Gospels were directly from Jesus then we could say that Bible and Qur’an conflict but Gospels were written very later. And that can be interpreted in that way: God might had informed Jesus that he would be rejected and adjudged to be killed. So perhaps Jesus had not known that God would save him. Because Jesus did not say that he had raised from death after cross.
Catechism of the Catholic Church 430
Jesus means in Hebrew: “God saves.” At the annunciation, the angel Gabriel gave him the name Jesus as his proper name, which expresses both his identity and his mission. Since God alone can forgive sins, it is God who, in Jesus his eternal Son made man, “will save his people from their sins”. in Jesus, God recapitulates all of his history of salvation on behalf of men.

436 The word “Christ” comes from the Greek translation of the Hebrew Messiah, which means “anointed”. It became the name proper to Jesus only because he accomplished perfectly the divine mission that “Christ” signifies. In effect, in Israel those consecrated to God for a mission that he gave were anointed in his name. This was the case for kings, for priests and, in rare instances, for prophets.This had to be the case all the more so for the Messiah whom God would send to inaugurate his kingdom definitively. It was necessary that the Messiah be anointed by the Spirit of the Lord at once as king and priest, and also as prophet. Jesus fulfilled the messianic hope of Israel in his threefold office of priest, prophet and king.

Jesus was in full knowledge of the plan from the Father
 
“To be Lovers of the Light, no matter where it Shines” Then why the need for the Baha’i faith?
Dawn of a new day on the Horizon of Baha 😉

Same Sun, but it is not Yesterday or the day Before.

When we are not earthbound, there is only One Sun with no seasons or different rising points!

Regards Tony
 
Yes that cup was valid. Jesus prayed God to take away that cup from him and God accepted that pray and another man whom made look like Jesus was crucifixed. And pain and suffering of Jesus was not because of physical but morally as He said in Matthew 26:38( “My soul is overwhelmed with sorrow to the point of death. ). That suffer was because of rejections against Jesus.
 
So now let’s get back to the subject of the thread.

Jesus was killed and resurrected. Amen!

MJ
 
Let’s look at Luke:

Luke: 22: 42 -45 Father if you are willing, take this cup from me; yet not my will, but yours be done. And an angel from heaven appeared to him and strengthened him. And being in anguish, he prayed more earnestly, and his sweat was like drops of blood falling to the ground.

There Is no one replacing Jesus.

Then of course the point of this thread… .

Luke 23 : 44 -46 : It was now about noon, and darkness came over the whole land until three in the afternoon, for the sun stopped shining. And the curtain of the temple was torn in two. Jesus called out with a loud voice, “Father, into your hands I commit my spirit.” When he had said this, he breathed his last.

Jesus own words.

MJ
 
=Techno2000;13649697]Jesus said to her, “I am the resurrection and the life. Whoever believes in me, though he die, yet shall he live, and everyone who lives and believes in me shall never die. Do you believe this?”
John 11:25-26
Yes with all my heart. Faith is ever lasting heaveness life and death cannot change it but is a gate to it.
Jesus said, “Do not hold on to me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father. Go instead to my brothers and tell them, ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.’”
Mary Magdalene went to the disciples with the news: “I have seen the Lord!” And she told them that he had said these things to her.
John 20:11-18
So the Bible was interpreted badly, but people say Qur’an was interpreted badly so which is it ?
Both Bible and Qur’an can be interpreted badly and it is possible and usual and many people do.

Jesus did not say that He had rasied from death and grave, did He?

And notice that Jesus said “to my God and your God” which is exactly written in Qur’an:

72-They have certainly disbelieved who say, " Allah is the Messiah, the son of Mary" while the Messiah has said, “O Children of Israel, worship Allah , my Lord and your Lord.” Indeed, he who associates others with Allah - Allah has forbidden him Paradise, and his refuge is the Fire. And there are not for the wrongdoers any helpers. Al-Ma’idah(5)
 
Catechism of the Catholic Church 601
The Scriptures had foretold this divine plan of salvation through the putting to death of “the righteous one, my Servant” as a mystery of universal redemption, that is, as the ransom that would free men from the slavery of sin.Citing a confession of faith that he himself had “received”, St. Paul professes that “Christ died for our sins in accordance with the scriptures.” In particular Jesus’ redemptive death fulfills Isaiah’s prophecy of the suffering Servant. Indeed Jesus himself explained the meaning of his life and death in the light of God’s suffering Servant. After his Resurrection he gave this interpretation of the Scriptures to the disciples at Emmaus, and then to the apostles.
Muhammad had suffered very much. He was being rejected and suffered curelty by His people for years. Believers were killed and prophet Muhammad was poisoned from which he suffer for yaers and according a count died from that. But all suffers Muhammad sustained was not redemption to forgive sins but it was to show way to repentance for sins.

If such thing is not supported by Bible clearly then it cannot be valid in religion.
 
Muhammad had suffered very much. He was being rejected and suffered curelty by His people for years. Believers were killed and prophet Muhammad was poisoned from which he suffer for yaers and according a count died from that. But all suffers Muhammad sustained was not redemption to forgive sins but it was to show way to repentance for sins.

If such thing is not supported by Bible clearly then it cannot be valid in religion.
He’s not the subject of this thread.

MJ
 
Jesus did not say that He had rasied from death and grave, did He?

And notice that Jesus said “to my God and your God” which is exactly written in Qur’an:
**Jesus did many other things as well. If every one of them were written down, I suppose that even the whole world would not have room for the books that would be written.

John 21:25**

And notice that Jesus said “to my God and your God” which is exactly written in Qur’an:

**NOT Two Natures, but One.
Not just One Person, but Two.
Equal by Nature,
Different through the personal relationships of [Their] begetting.
One single Being, while being two distinct Persons.
Therefore: the Father [is] God, as the Son [is] God, and forming only One God. The Father is eternal as the Son is eternal.
Almighty, infinite, most perfect the Begotten, as is the Begetter.

One single will, knowledge, power of the Two, though being reciprocally independent in action: the Word—willing, knowing, able to do as He wills—knows and can know the Thought [the Father] Who has begotten Him [the Word], contemplating Himself in His most perfect Perfections, and understanding Himself: since only God can understand God, and exult in seeing Himself.

And in this exultation, He begets the Light, the Life, so these might exist and create: multiplying the loving joy of God Who is radiant at being able to pour out His love on endless creatures, giving to all [His] Providence. And to the creature made in His image and likeness, giving Himself and His Kingdom in order to surround Himself with a people who are His sons, illumined by the Light during their [earthly] time, so that they may be able to know, serve, and love the Lord; and that they may be gladdened by the eternal enjoyment of the beatific vision of God beyond time.

Nor is it by an inferior relationship that the Begotten Word is subject to the Begetting Thought. Rather He is spontaneously obedient solely out of the most holy love of this Divine Son for His Father Who has divinely Begotten Him.

Because it is Love which makes of the distinct Persons “One single Thing.” The Unity of the Trinity is effected by the Spirit of God, that is, by the Charity which is the Spirit of the Lord: the Most Holy Spirit of the Most Holy God.

The Son, exults in the bosom of the Father—Who exults in contemplating His Word and in seeing every creature in the Light He has begotten, and to Whom He has communicated His Own Life and all His other properties, save that proper to Himself as Father. In the same way, every creature endowed with spirit and with reason can know God his Creator sufficiently through the eternal begetting of the Word and through His Incarnation in Time: because in the Uncreated Word and in the Word Incarnate, all the wondrous perfections of God the Father are visible.

Present in the Most Holy Word are all the unknowable truths of Heaven and the marvelous history of the destinies of man. And through the Word, man can know, can be made fit to love, and be predestined to possess, God—Who is the Incomprehensible One, but Whom the Light reveals in a suitable way, so that man may know God and be saved by loving Him, and through this love, have Life.

The Father is pleased with the willing exultation of His Son, image of His substance and splendor of His glory: Maker of all that is made, Author of man’s regeneration for supernatural life.

And from this mutual exultation and pleasure of the One with the Other, of the One in the Other, and—from the beginning without beginning—God being with God, God in God: from this mutual exultation and pleasure, proceeds Love: He Who, at the right time, will give Flesh to the Eternal Word, and make of the Son of God: the Christ [Messiah]—Who is always One with the Father, but no longer one Nature in Two Persons, as it was at the beginning. But there will be two Natures in the one Person of the Man-God: true God in the substance of the Father from which He is never separated, and true Man through the substance taken from His Mother.**

bardstown.com/~brchrys/Trin%2bRdm.html
 
**Jesus did many other things as well. If every one of them were written down, I suppose that even the whole world would not have room for the books that would be written.

John 21:25**

And notice that Jesus said “to my God and your God” which is exactly written in Qur’an:

**NOT Two Natures, but One.
Not just One Person, but Two.
Equal by Nature,
Different through the personal relationships of [Their] begetting.
One single Being, while being two distinct Persons.
Therefore: the Father [is] God, as the Son [is] God, and forming only One God. The Father is eternal as the Son is eternal.
Almighty, infinite, most perfect the Begotten, as is the Begetter.

One single will, knowledge, power of the Two, though being reciprocally independent in action: the Word—willing, knowing, able to do as He wills—knows and can know the Thought [the Father] Who has begotten Him [the Word], contemplating Himself in His most perfect Perfections, and understanding Himself: since only God can understand God, and exult in seeing Himself.

And in this exultation, He begets the Light, the Life, so these might exist and create: multiplying the loving joy of God Who is radiant at being able to pour out His love on endless creatures, giving to all [His] Providence. And to the creature made in His image and likeness, giving Himself and His Kingdom in order to surround Himself with a people who are His sons, illumined by the Light during their [earthly] time, so that they may be able to know, serve, and love the Lord; and that they may be gladdened by the eternal enjoyment of the beatific vision of God beyond time.

Nor is it by an inferior relationship that the Begotten Word is subject to the Begetting Thought. Rather He is spontaneously obedient solely out of the most holy love of this Divine Son for His Father Who has divinely Begotten Him.

Because it is Love which makes of the distinct Persons “One single Thing.” The Unity of the Trinity is effected by the Spirit of God, that is, by the Charity which is the Spirit of the Lord: the Most Holy Spirit of the Most Holy God.

The Son, exults in the bosom of the Father—Who exults in contemplating His Word and in seeing every creature in the Light He has begotten, and to Whom He has communicated His Own Life and all His other properties, save that proper to Himself as Father. In the same way, every creature endowed with spirit and with reason can know God his Creator sufficiently through the eternal begetting of the Word and through His Incarnation in Time: because in the Uncreated Word and in the Word Incarnate, all the wondrous perfections of God the Father are visible.

Present in the Most Holy Word are all the unknowable truths of Heaven and the marvelous history of the destinies of man. And through the Word, man can know, can be made fit to love, and be predestined to possess, God—Who is the Incomprehensible One, but Whom the Light reveals in a suitable way, so that man may know God and be saved by loving Him, and through this love, have Life.

The Father is pleased with the willing exultation of His Son, image of His substance and splendor of His glory: Maker of all that is made, Author of man’s regeneration for supernatural life.

And from this mutual exultation and pleasure of the One with the Other, of the One in the Other, and—from the beginning without beginning—God being with God, God in God: from this mutual exultation and pleasure, proceeds Love: He Who, at the right time, will give Flesh to the Eternal Word, and make of the Son of God: the Christ [Messiah]—Who is always One with the Father, but no longer one Nature in Two Persons, as it was at the beginning. But there will be two Natures in the one Person of the Man-God: true God in the substance of the Father from which He is never separated, and true Man through the substance taken from His Mother.**

bardstown.com/~brchrys/Trin%2bRdm.html
There is no any indication of divinity on Jesus. He lived merely as a human and non of mysterious doctrine and explaining can refute and change that reality. There is no any connection between humanity of Jesus and divinity of God. All statements of Jesus prove that fact. Jesus was human and prophet and all acts and words of Jesus demonstrate that.

It is enough for any one to believe that Jesus was sent by God as Jesus himself conveyed that many times. But it is not necessary to believe that Jesus was God himself which is very adventurous and dangerous and mysteriously and …
 
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