How Do Those Who Call Themselves Catholic Support Gay Marriage?

[Nacho45]

Yes you are confused. That is not what I said.

Have a great day and Christ be with you!

So, you have no real answer? I ask because that is pretty much what you said. You said it was hateful so I asked how is following Gods direction hateful. Then you said you didn’t say it was. Perhaps a clarification of what you meant would be helpful.

 

[aidanbradypop]

So, you have no real answer? I ask because that is pretty much what you said. You said it was hateful so I asked how is following Gods direction hateful. Then you said you didn’t say it was. Perhaps a clarification of what you meant would be helpful.

Go read 131 again and stop trying to make something out of nothing. Have a good night

 

[Nacho45]

Go read 131 again and stop trying to make something out of nothing. Have a good night

I cannot express the magnitude of my embarrassment. Please except my deepest apology! I will endeavor to make a more thorough reading of others statements in the future. After reading the post again, I realize the confusion was self imposed. Very sorry.

 

[Origen52]

Jesus sort of did address the issue with the very verse you presented.

Okay, this you need to explain, carefully and clearly. How does Luke 16:18 relate to homosexuality?

And why have you, blatantly decided to ignore my question; why are Catholics who are so disturbed by laws which violate church teaching about homosexuality, not as upset about laws which violate church teaching about divorce. Furthermore, why are you not advocating laws against fornication? It is this hypocritical stance which has turned many young people away from the church. You can’t cherry pick which church laws you will demand that the government support.

Finally, how does this insistence that the secular state enforce one religion’s moral rules make you any different from Muslims who demand sharia law.

 

[Nacho45]

Okay, this you need to explain, carefully and clearly. How does Luke 16:18 relate to homosexuality?

I bolded the portions which relate to marriage as husband and wife. The fact Jesus made no mention of same sex relationships is telling. Most likely, it didn’t need to be addressed because people at that time weren’t confused about that sort of thing.

And why have you, blatantly decided to ignore my question; why are Catholics who are so disturbed by laws which violate church teaching about homosexuality, not as upset about laws which violate church teaching about divorce.

I didn’t ignore your question, at least I had no intention to ignore it. I just didn’t answer, but I will do what I can. My understanding is, Catholics also do not promote divorce. While people still get divorced, it is with the understanding it is not supposed to happen. There is but one circumstance where divorce is allowed to be considered an option. If you need further information I must refer you to someone who actually does support divorce. I do not.

Furthermore, why are you not advocating laws against fornication? It is this hypocritical stance which has turned many young people away from the church. You can’t cherry pick which church laws you will demand that the government support.

It isn’t cherry picking. This thread is specifically addressing homosexual unions, not fornication, although every homosexual sexual encounter is fornication so it actually is addressed. In some places, adultery and fornication are against the law. In some states, alienation of affection laws exist. If there were a thread about this, I would probably chime in and provide my thoughts on the matter. I have found most people turn from the Church because they want to live in any way they like and the Church does not agree with them.

Finally, how does this insistence that the secular state enforce one religion’s moral rules make you any different from Muslims who demand sharia law.

I could ask the same thing for those advocating against what was once the secular state moral rules to get what they want. What laws are NOT built on religious moral value?

 

[SMGS127]

There is but one circumstance where divorce is allowed to be considered an option.

Not to nitpick, but there are actually 2. You are allowed to legally divorce if you obtain an annulment, and you are allowed to legally divorce if doing so is necessary for your or your children’s personal safety (such as in the case of abuse). In the latter case, you are still married (unless an annulment was granted), but you can still legally divorce without sin.

 

[Nacho45]

Not to nitpick, but there are actually 2. You are allowed to legally divorce if you obtain an annulment, and you are allowed to legally divorce if doing so is necessary for your or your children’s personal safety (such as in the case of abuse). In the latter case, you are still married (unless an annulment was granted), but you can still legally divorce without sin.

I also do not mean to nitpick, but you are allowed to divorce for reasons of infidelity and rules come into play with this (remember marriage is a sacrament instituted by God, not a right instituted by a judge in Utah). An annulment is an entirely different action than divorce.

 

[SMGS127]

I also do not mean to nitpick, but you are allowed to divorce for reasons of infidelity and rules come into play with this (remember marriage is a sacrament instituted by God, not a right instituted by a judge in Utah). An annulment is an entirely different action than divorce.

I’m talking about legal divorce. I’m pretty sure it is not allowed to divorce merely due to infidelity, though you are allowed to separate. You are most certainly allowed to (and expected to) legally divorce in the case of Church annulment.

 

[kanrok]

What does divorce have to do with the subject matter of the thread?

This is the third time this issue is being brought up here.

Is there some state or federal divorce law that is being implemented somewhere currently?

New York was the last state to pass a “no-fault” divorce law.

That was in 2010.

Catholics certainly attempted to stop the passage of that law, as they did in each and every of the the other 49 states.

This thread deals with an issue that is on our plate currently.

My home state of Illinois just passed gay “marriage.”

The law could not have passed without the help of Catholic legislators.

Hence the reason for my initial question.

So, can you tell me how it is that those who call themselves Catholic can support gay marriage?

 

[aidanbradypop]

I cannot express the magnitude of my embarrassment. Please except my deepest apology! I will endeavor to make a more thorough reading of others statements in the future. After reading the post again, I realize the confusion was self imposed. Very sorry.

 

[aidanbradypop]

I bolded the portions which relate to marriage as husband and wife. The fact Jesus made no mention of same sex relationships is telling. Most likely, it didn’t need to be addressed because people at that time weren’t confused about that sort of thing.

I was very much an issue then as it is now Nacho.

.

 

[frobert]

I also do not mean to nitpick, but you are allowed to divorce for reasons of infidelity and rules come into play with this (remember marriage is a sacrament instituted by God, not a right instituted by a judge in Utah). An annulment is an entirely different action than divorce.

Marriage is a sacrament for Catholics. Question, does the church recognize civil marriage or a mixed marriage preformed in a protestant church or Muslim Mosque? I know that such marriages can not be considered as the sacrament of marriage, but don’t know if they are recognized by the church as binding.

 

[GEddie]

You are most certainly allowed to (and expected to) legally divorce in the case of Church annulment.

Actually, the legal divorce has to have happened before the annulment process can begin.

ICXC NIKA

 

[GEddie]

I was very much an issue then as it is now Nacho.

.

The relationships certainly were; but no-one from then through the 1900s thought to redefine them as “marriage”. That’s modern.

Also, our LORD came first and foremost to the house of Israel. Since the Torah forbids homosexual activity, probably no one ever came up to Him with a gay partner.

ICXC NIKA

 

[GEddie]

What does divorce have to do with the subject matter of the thread?

Comparatively, both divorce and homosexuality are against the Church and Scripture.

But there was never the hue and cry over the liberalization of divorce in the American States as there is now over gay marriage. The question was why.

A valid question, IMNAAHO.

ICXC NIKA

 

[frobert]

What does divorce have to do with the subject matter of the thread?

This is the third time this issue is being brought up here.

Is there some state or federal divorce law that is being implemented somewhere currently?

New York was the last state to pass a “no-fault” divorce law.

That was in 2010.

Catholics certainly attempted to stop the passage of that law, as they did in each and every of the the other 49 states.

This thread deals with an issue that is on our plate currently.

My home state of Illinois just passed gay “marriage.”

The law could not have passed without the help of Catholic legislators.

Hence the reason for my initial question.

So, can you tell me how it is that those who call themselves Catholic can support gay marriage?

When you are born as a Catholic or convert you are a Catholic. If you are excommunicated or renounce your religion you are an ex-Catholic. When you are in the state of sin you are not in good standing as a Catholic But even if you are not a Catholic or an ex-Catholic their is no law against labeling your or as parading as a Catholic.

Have any politicians been excommunicated for voting for same-sex marriage. I am not being facetious, I really don’t know.

Supposing a politician who voted for gay marriage has a change of heart and confesses his sin, the priest absolves him. The vote is over and same sex marriage is now legal in your state. Would he/she now be a Catholic in good standing? I believe he would.

 

[SMGS127]

Actually, the legal divorce has to have happened before the annulment process can begin.

ICXC NIKA

Wait…so does that mean anyone can get a divorce without sinning? Do you have to have your Priest’s approval to submit the legal divorce? That just seems counterintuitive (the Church teaches that there’s no such thing as a divorce, but you’re expected to get a legal divorce before you find out if your marriage was real or not?

 

[frobert]

Wait…so does that mean anyone can get a divorce without sinning? Do you have to have your Priest’s approval to submit the legal divorce? That just seems counterintuitive (the Church teaches that there’s no such thing as a divorce, but you’re expected to get a legal divorce before you find out if your marriage was real or not?

This is similar to the question a asked above. Would there be different answers for those who received the Catholic sacrament of marriage as opposed to those who had a civil ceremony or did not receive the sacrament of marriage?

 

[aidanbradypop]

Also, our LORD came first and foremost to the house of Israel. Since the Torah forbids homosexual activity, probably no one ever came up to Him with a gay partner.

ICXC NIKA

Hard for us to ever know but I would assume no.

Comparatively, both divorce and homosexuality are against the Church and Scripture.

So if they are both against Church and Spriture, why doesn’t the Church take are harder stance against divorce? Christ stated that the only reason divorce was allowed by Moses is because the people harden their hearts. What God has joined let no man break still rings true today, yet many Catholics and Protestant file for divorce every minute or maybe every second. The whole anulment process have become a joke IMO. I know a couple here that was married for TEN YEARS and they were granted an anulment and the lady was married to another 3 months later. Kind of fishy. lol

But there was never the hue and cry over the liberalization of divorce in the American States as there is now over gay marriage. The question was why.

A valid question, IMNAAHO.

ICXC NIKA

Indeed a valid question. I do not see this as a liberal ve conservative issue. If this is not what you meant by liberalization then please forgive me.

 

[aidanbradypop]

This is similar to the question a asked above. Would there be different answers for those who received the Catholic sacrament of marriage as opposed to those who had a civil ceremony or did not receive the sacrament of marriage?

Exactly. This thread state “How can someone call themself Catholic and support gay marriage.”

I know a couple that are both Catholic(crable for both) and were married by way of civil union in Hawaii. Their marriage has never been blessed by the Church, they wish to not have children and lived together for many years before actually getting united in the civil court. Church teachings say they are not “married” and are still living in sin, yet they claim to still be Catholic. What gives?

Why no debate and battle over this? They are living in “sin” just as the gay couple are but there is no priest on Good Moring America demanding this to stop.