How do we define freedom?

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Robert_Sock

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And are we free in the Western world? I think we are anything but free. First off, we are all slaves to Satan and sin. Based on these facts, we are living in a miserable and corrupt world that cannot begin to be compared with the true freedom of the soul once it separates from this body of death and is allowed to enter Heaven.

Second, we believe that we live in a democracy, and that it is a form of freedom, but looking at our two-party system here in America, we really do not have much of a choice. It’s often the candidate with the most money and the best speaking skills that get officials elected.

Finally, we really do not live in a democracy when laws are passed based on a secret agenda. For example, abortion, euthanasia and gay rights are all agenda related issues that are largely determined before such issues are voted on by the public. Again, its got to do with outside funding and clever arguments.The formation attitudes and beliefs are often created by the media. (Look at how public support for gay marriages has changed tides in the past few years! Somebody in the media has taken a course or two in attitude formation and change in psychology.). When these issues do not pass, they are simple ruled unconstitutional.
 
Robert_Sock said:
And are we free in the Western world? …
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I am. I’ve got the basics of a good life: faith, home, family, career, expensive hobbies. the government for the most part leaves me alone but manages to fill the pot holes and issue permits when I need them. I don’t buy into the “secret agenda” conspiracies and looking for reasons to complain is a waste of my time and energy.
 
Fairwinds said:
I am. I’ve got the basics of a good life: faith, home, family, career, expensive hobbies. the government for the most part leaves me alone but manages to fill the pot holes and issue permits when I need them. I don’t buy into the “secret agenda” conspiracies and looking for reasons to complain is a waste of my time and energy.
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I truly wish you a blessed life, but I also think your attitude could very well change if you ever contract a terminal illness that results in prolonged suffering. My brother recently dies of pancreatic cancer and, wow, did his attitude toward life change.
 
The Catechism of the Catholic Church defines freedom well:
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1731** Freedom is the power, rooted in reason and will, to act or not to act, to do this or that, and so to perform deliberate actions on one’s own responsibility. By free will one shapes one’s own life. Human freedom is a force for growth and maturity in truth and goodness; it attains its perfection when directed toward God, our beatitude.
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So yes I am free.

And in the U.S., we live in a republic, not a democracy.
 
I would define it as freedom to think and live. Freedom from persecution, religious dogma and fundamentalism. Freedom of conscience and political ideology.
 
EVeryone is free to do the right thing. That is all the freedom anyone needs. The key is to take up your freedom and make good use of it.

No one can “give” you your freedom - otherwise you remain a slave to that person. You must accept it and take it up of your own will.
 
aprilfloyd said:
I would define it as freedom to think and live. Freedom from persecution, religious dogma and fundamentalism. Freedom of conscience and political ideology.
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Catholics believe in religious dogma. Dogma comes from Christ. So if we don’t believe in the truth of each and every Catholic dogma, we are not following Christ.
 
aprilfloyd said:
I would define it as freedom to think and live. Freedom from persecution, religious dogma and fundamentalism. Freedom of conscience and political ideology.
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Catholic dogma is infallible, meaning it is received from Christ himself, without any trace of error. This is Catholic teaching. The Church cannot make an error when teaching faith and morals, because Christ himself teaches through Catholic dogma. This is what the Catholic church has always believed, because it is based on Christ’s promise to keep his church free of error until the end of time.
 
FrStevenJones said:
Catholics believe in religious dogma. Dogma comes from Christ. So if we don’t believe in the truth of each and every Catholic dogma, we are not following Christ.
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I believe that you should be free to believe in your religions’ dogma, but that the wider community should be protected, where a religion’s dogma or subsequent actions derived from it, contravenes laws and freedoms enacted by a democracy.

We have room in our society for all religions and none.
 
Robert_Sock said:
I truly wish you a blessed life, but I also think your attitude could very well change if you ever contract a terminal illness that results in prolonged suffering. My brother recently dies of pancreatic cancer and, wow, did his attitude toward life change.
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I never said what the state of my health is.
 
aprilfloyd said:
I believe that you should be free to believe in your religions’ dogma, but that the wider community should be protected, where a religion’s dogma or subsequent actions derived from it, contravenes laws and freedoms enacted by a democracy.

We have room in our society for all religions and none.
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Well, I guess you are not Catholic. We are discussing Catholic dogma, which comes from God himself. So anyone who disagrees is disagreeing with God, so they cannot be correct!
 
FrStevenJones said:
Well, I guess you are not Catholic. We are discussing Catholic dogma, which comes from God himself. So anyone who disagrees is disagreeing with God, so they cannot be correct!
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surely you’re not promoting a catholic theocracy.
 
Fairwinds said:
I believe aprilfloyd is asking for the civil right to dissent, the inevitable consequence of living in a republic.
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She has the right to dissent, but in the eyes of the Catholic church, she is 100% in error, without any question, if she disagrees with Catholic dogma. We are all free to live in error, but freedom is living in the truth!
 
Fairwinds said:
I never said what the state of my health is.
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That’s why I said “if.” I’m not trying to guess your current health, but I hope that you are blessed with good health until the day you die. For me, if it got me to Heaven, I pray that I may die a martyr for the love of Christ. This was also the prayer of St Therese, The Little Flower. Like with her life, this will probably never happen.
 
marty1818 said:
The Catechism of the Catholic Church defines freedom well:

So yes I am free.

And in the U.S., we live in a republic, not a democracy.
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Do we in America live in a republic that involves democratic ideals?
 
FrStevenJones said:
Well, I guess you are not Catholic. We are discussing Catholic dogma, which comes from God himself. So anyone who disagrees is disagreeing with God, so they cannot be correct!
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But not everyone believes in God, let alone a specific Catholic God. There have been 1000s of (and no doubt will be more!) Gods created through the years. Why would a Catholic God have a monopoly on what is correct. That is ignoring the very obvious elephant in the room that religions are man-made.
 
FrStevenJones said:
She has the right to dissent, but in the eyes of the Catholic church, she is 100% in error, without any question, if she disagrees with Catholic dogma. We are all free to live in error, but freedom is living in the truth!
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she may well be in error in the eyes of the church, but note that you have the right to state that because you live in a republic that guarantees the free expression of any or no faith. she finds RC dogma unimportant and is the reverse of the coin.

these kinds of reciprocal rights have got to be recognized by the civil authority because, as you are aware, there have been many times times and many places where both RC and atheist would go to the gallows.
 
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