How Do You Charitably Complain About Music?

[YADA]

Our last two popes also “complained” about liturgical music in the Church and called for improvements.

But I do agree that anybody who wants to see something more in line with what the Church calls for should join up if at all possible.

AND of course when those popes c*omplained *though this is not a term I - personally - would use to describe the writings and pronouncements of a pope] we know for certain that it was only about the Amercian Church and not any of the other catholic churches around the entire globe …

We also know without a doubt that they were speaking of exactly the insert your favorite complaint here … music selection at parish XYZ, music selection in the catholic churches of merica in general, the published missals and music contained there in, any and every intsrument used at mass except an organ and piano … this or that cantor, this specific hymn … that translation of an old standy and every hymn that came to us via any protestant tradition … even though the specifics wer not in the writings or the pronouncements …

ALso, the pope offering instruction and guidance is a far cry from most of the complaints surroiunding music … and no pope ever instructed a parishioner to “complain” if the mass is not to their satisfaction … We are, however, instructed to support our parish with our money, our time and according to our talents … and in return we have a right to have the Rites of the church executed properly and to have access too those Rites … it is a two way street … if you don’t participate with all oif your gifts [time, talent and treasure] the church cannot exist to provide the sacraments …

IMHO, anyone exercising te office of music critic [appropriate for use at mass and performed witht he proper respect and decorum Christ derserves] should be a part of the proccess and has the necessary skills to join in the work. We are the church, it is not father nor the music minister … and it is a rare parish that does not operate with (name removed by moderator)ut from a variety of sources and volunteers … there is just too much work to be done …

 

[KestrelRose]

Back to the original question.

I have been thinking about this since my last comment. I can see that as a musician my defenses were up. The question is in itself rather irritating. So, let me backup a bit and rephrase the question.

“How can I discuss the music selections with the music director without sounding like I am complaining?” Would be a much better approach.

Musicians work hard at what they do. If you can understand that, you would be in a better position to make the changes that would be in line with what the Church is striving for.

 

[KestrelRose]

I am coming from a different position all together. I love Gregorian Chant and Latin. I am trying my best to bring this love to my small mission church.

I understand the difficulties. Charity, love, compassion, understanding are the only ways that will work. Complaining only makes people dig their heels in further.

 

[YADA]

Back to the original question.

I have been thinking about this since my last comment. I can see that as a musician my defenses were up. The question is in itself rather irritating. So, let me backup a bit and rephrase the question.

“How can I discuss the music selections with the music director without sounding like I am complaining?” Would be a much better approach.

Musicians work hard at what they do. If you can understand that, you would be in a better position to make the changes that would be more in line of what you want.

Tell the music director you would like to join the music ministry: tht you are interested in …singing and/or playing this instrument and that you are interested in participating in the committee that makes the selections for the music used at Mass …

If I were you I would ask what docuemnts they are currently studying as they make these selections adn if they have begun a study of this: usccbpublishing.org/productdetails.cfm?sku=7-022

One of God’s greatest gifts to us, his creation, was the gift of song. In words and music, our ancestors in faith-Moses, David, Deborah, Paul, St. Gregory-have taught us how to revel in God’s infinite love, proclaim His glory, give thanks for His abounding generosity, and plead for mercy and forgiveness. Sing to the Lord: Music in Divine Worship recalls this vast, rich musical tradition as it provides basic guidelines for understanding the role and ministry of music in the liturgy.

Standing on the foundational work of the Council fathers, Sing to the Lord echoes the call to full, active, and conscious participation in the Liturgy through its sung elements. It addresses the practical concerns of pastoral leaders-appropriate ministers, cultural diversity, instrumentation, formation, acoustics, and copyrights. It also outlines considerations for preparing and judging music for worship with an in-depth review of the musical structure of Liturgy.

Use Sing to the Lord to
" evaluate your parish’s current musical repertoire
" better understand your role in sung worship
" prepare particular sacramental liturgies
" train parish music ministers

Ask him about the practice committement, mass attendance committemnt and how often they come together in a formation/educational component … see how the process works before you offer any criticism or suggestions … and participate first … 'walk the mile or ten" as they say …

 

[YADA]

I am coming from a different position all together. I love Gregorian Chant and Latin. I am trying my best to bring this love to my small mission church.

I understand the difficulties. Charity, love, compassion, understanding are the only ways that will work. Complaining only makes people dig their heels in further.

What do you bring to the table besides a love of Gregorian Chant and Latin? … What documents of Vatican II or other sources have you studied at length on the liturgy? Have you studied theology? What parish committees have you particpated on in the past? What parish functions have you supported … do you go to coffee and donuts after mass or a spaghetti dinner? How many parishioners do you call friend? How many parishioners do you know by name? … how long have you been a parishioner?

YOu call it a small mission church … is the music director a staff/paid position? or is he a volunteer? What are the financial resources this mission has - are they able to purchase new music materials or are they using what they have available … do you know and understand the copyright laws for using music, printing music on a leaflet?

 

[prettyflower]

I’m a professional church musician. I do this for a living. I teach the choir and play the piano. I have a bachelor’s degree in music and I’m working on a master’s degree in Theology.

I’m very conservative in my music. I play different styles in different Masses, depending on the assembly. But, I’m still on the conservative side. I think it is more appropriate and people appreciate it more in the end.

I really appreciate when people say what they think. I also welcome constructive criticism because it gives me the opportunity to improve.

I know by experience the many choirs are not that open for suggestions. But I know, we all want to do our best and we want people to feel comfortable about our work.

I would suggest that you find something that is good about that choir. Anything would do even something that is non musical such as the way they dress, or how friendly they are. Approach the choir and compliment on that first and then, very politely, make your suggestion as something you would like to see in your parish and that probably somebody else out there would like to see too.

Hope it works

 

[KestrelRose]

Let me explain my mission church. We have one Mass Sunday morning, and if the priest can make it we have mass on Tuesday evening. I know by-name at least 30 maybe 50 parishioners most of whom know because this is a very small town and I work for a water company and many of these people are part of that water company.

I have studied what I can about the liturgy pretty much on my own.

My church has little or no money for music. No music staff and no music director. There a four groups of musicians who alternate each Sunday. My husband and I try to be part of each group when we can.

Yes I understand copy right laws. We sing out of the GIA Gather Hymnal. There are about five of us who can read music. The leader of the “Guitar Choir” has great talent and a beautiful voice but does not read music. He chords and sings.

The musicians are a close knit group and although we have different approaches, we work well together.

We have learned to not “step” on each other’s egos and toes.

The parishioners are mainly farmers, construction workers or retirees. Many resist classical music of any sort.

My husband of 40 years became a Catholic last year because of the openess and warmth of this little community.

I am very protective of my little church it and I understand why they resist Latin.

Being a country bumpkin myself, I have very low tolerance to condescension.

What do you bring to the table besides a love of Gregorian Chant and Latin? … What documents of Vatican II or other sources have you studied at length on the liturgy? Have you studied theology? What parish committees have you particpated on in the past? What parish functions have you supported … do you go to coffee and donuts after mass or a spaghetti dinner? How many parishioners do you call friend? How many parishioners do you know by name? … how long have you been a parishioner?

YOu call it a small mission church … is the music director a staff/paid position? or is he a volunteer? What are the financial resources this mission has - are they able to purchase new music materials or are they using what they have available … do you know and understand the copyright laws for using music, printing music on a leaflet?

 

[Sarabande]

I didn’t answer the question.

The answer: become a good musician yourself. Musicians listen to musicians. Musicians listen to people who understand where they are coming from. ** Musicians do not listen to people who think they know it all, but do not even have a clue has to what the C scale is, or what a chord is, what it means to practice day after day, or how to read the different notations of a Gregorian Chant.**

Then you can discuss all the wonderful possibilities with out “complaining”

This is true, especially when the person expounding on the music has a huge ego and acts like he/she knows more than the actual musicians when he/she actually doesn’t know a lick about music.

A couple of weeks ago, this big mouth who is part of the parish council and totally showed his igorance about music, mentioning that so many hymns we did at mass constantly change from “major to minor” and that the “meter” changed constantly during the hymns. I stood there politely and inside was thinking to myself, “I’ve been cantoring here for about 6-7 years and hardly ever did we sing a hymn which changed from major to minor and we’ve never done a hymn that changed meter.” All of our hymns are considered “traditional” with straight-forward rhythms. Little did he realize that just because I’m a cantor didn’t mean that I’m not a musician (unfortunately, singers get a bad reputation for not being musicians, but it is true many times, especially when it comes to cantoring) and knew that he was full of it. But he was the kind of man who just wanted to hear himself talk and act like he knew what he was talking about when he didn’t have a clue. A little knowledge is dangerous and someone who doesn’t know music might actually listen to him and think he was speaking truth.

All that said, there is still room for constructive criticism from the non-musician sitting in the pews. Not everyone is musically inclined and can’t become a musician for one reason or another. If approached in the right manner - meaning kind, charitable and well-meaning - constructive feedback can be received in a positive light.

Of course, constructive feedback from fellow musicians mean a lot more, but sometimes a musician can learn something from the “lay” person. My sister is not a musician at all, but I will listen to her feedback when she comes to a performance or when I cantor at mass. Some of it is not much to take in terms of being constructive or complimentary (although I appreciate the compliments, I’m still my worst critic, so no matter how much a person says he/she enjoyed the music, I’ll be beating myself up for something I did in the 5 measure of the 3rd system, etc.), but there are times when she provides a little bit of wisdom that perhaps a fellow colleague may not catch.

 

[Guitar]

All that said, there is still room for constructive criticism from the non-musician sitting in the pews. Not everyone is musically inclined and can’t become a musician for one reason or another. If approached in the right manner - meaning kind, charitable and well-meaning - constructive feedback can be received in a positive light.

Of course, constructive feedback from fellow musicians mean a lot more, but sometimes a musician can learn something from the “lay” person. My sister is not a musician at all, but I will listen to her feedback when she comes to a performance or when I cantor at mass. Some of it is not much to take in terms of being constructive or complimentary (although I appreciate the compliments, I’m still my worst critic, so no matter how much a person says he/she enjoyed the music, I’ll be beating myself up for something I did in the 5 measure of the 3rd system, etc.), but there are times when she provides a little bit of wisdom that perhaps a fellow colleague may not catch.

Amen, sister. Once more we are in furious agreement.

I will happily tell a mouth like the one you describe to go boil his head or get an education first then come back and talk to me. (Or use more charitable words with that general meaning.) But as far as I am concerned, being a musician or being involved is not a requirement for providing feedback as long as it is given politely and with recognition of the fact that there is more involved to the job than meets the public eye. If a musician comes to me and gives analysis and feedback in technical terms, great. But my job is to allow the “layman” to sing and pray. If said layman finds he cannot, I have no problem with him coming to me and telling me so. It’s then up to me as the musician to work out what I’m doing wrong. (Or humbly discern whether it is valuable feedback or simply one person’s taste-based opinion.)

A layman is quite able to say that he/she finds lyrics, pitch, tempo, rhythmic variability etc uncomfortable. A layman can also tell you better than a fellow music can, in many cases, when something isn’t “coming across the footlights”. Musicians who know how things are/should be done can often give a mental tick in the box for correct procedure without really listening closely to the result. The layman doesn’t know anything about procedure but knows he isnt getting the cues he needs. One example would be the number of times I’ve heard an organist using different manuals to differentiate between solo cantor and congregational parts but with registrations that don’t provide enough contrast for “ordinary folks” to tell them apart and thus know where their cue is. The organist and observer fellow organists are thinking, “swell means cantor, great means congregation” but the congregation just hears “organ” followed by “more organ”.

I believe a certain amount of decoding non-musicians’ feedback, or questioning/working with them to work out what they’re really trying to say, is part of the job.