How Do You Know Your Interpretation Is Correct?

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-What G-D provides as physical proof does not diminish faith -

ST. Thomas did not believe till he put his fingers in the nail holes​

Why do you think Jesus did those miracles? - For HIS benefit?
Excellent!

I am truly amazed at the utter condescension of God in granting us these miracles. He does not have to but He knows that some people’s faith are weak and may be helped by these miracles, so He gives them these gifts to help them along in their pilgrimage.

I am reminded of how understanding He was of Thomas’s unbelief. Instead of condemning Him for his lack of faith, He offers Thomas the chance to poke His wounds. What utter condescension from the God who came to save us.
 
*Who knows - I might have walked away also. I often think about that.

Thank God for 2000 years of witness.

Blessings
Cinette:)*
Yes, most probably me too.

I used to say to my mother that I am very thankful that I was born to a Catholic family. I probably would not have believed had it been otherwise. Praise and Thanks to God His great mercy in ordaining it to be so.
 
Tell you what, Tommy555, here are three items - and, if you would please, tell me the Scriptural basis why you:

1.) reject Christ founded His Church on Peter and three times the Resurrected Christ reaffirmed Peter’s leadership role over the other Apostles to guide and teach.

I do not reject it, although it appears that James was the Bishop at some point (from the epistles of St. Paul) and also Paul had to rebuke Peter for his actions when those sent from James appeared.

2,) reject the Eucharist is the Body, Blood, Human Soul and Divinity

I believe to the utmost in the real presence of our Lord. He said, "This is my body…This is my blood… I am not Pres. Clinton. I believe “is” means “is.”

3.) reject that Resurrected Christ delegated the Power of God to forgive sin to His Apostles.

I am LCMS (Lutheran Church Missour Synod). I believe in confession and absolution.

Once we address these clearly identified Catholic teachings - that have been taught by the same Catholic Church for the past 2,000 years - that are specifically in the NT, I will be happy to address your concerns about Marian doctrine.

Looking forward to hearing from you

God bless
 
A few responses
Code:
This thread is especially interesting, but I plan to drop out of it after this posting because I need to pay attention to more pressing matters. I am hopeful that God will somehow use my musings to spur on creative and less dogmatic thinking and help lead toward religious understanding among at least a few critical readers.

1. I respect the beliefs of most people. The ones that trouble me are those that are 'fundamentalist', whether Catholic or Protestant. By that I mean those belief systems that are adamant that they alone have the truth and all the rest are in serious error.

2. Most Catholics and Protestants I know may embrace generally the views advanced by their respective traditions, but they also are rather open-minded, have doubts, and do not consider other viewpoints as wickedly heretical. Most of them 'agree to disagree' and live together amicably in mutual respect. 

 3. Most mainline Protestants (Episcopal, Methodist, Presbyterian, UCC, etc.) that I know do not believe that their particular sect is the 'one true church'. For about 100 years they have worked together in such groups as the World Council of Churches and National Council of Churches. Members easily may join one denomination in Omaha, and quite another when they move to Chicago. They often pick a church on the basis of location, preaching, Sunday School facilities, friendliness, etc., and doctrine may be secondary. There is, as everyone knows, a major schism between 'big tent' Protestant churches that place less emphasis upon doctrine and more evangelical Protestant churches which are usually more dogmatic. After Vatican II priests rushed to join local clergy associations and Protestants became 'separated brothers and sisters' overnight. God bless John XXIII! 

  4. Ironically, while mainline churches generally are further away from Catholicism on various social issues, and sometimes even theological ones, these churches are more likely to have a friendlier attitude toward Catholicism. This arises from their less emphasis upon doctrinal conformity. "Thank and let think" typifies many of them. They often have more appreciation of Catholic concern for the poor and the sick, and work closely with Catholics in local soup kitchens and other humanitarian projects.  

 5, Freedom of inquiry means freedom of inquiry. I remember when I did my undergraduate thesis on St. Thomas Aquinas decades ago. I had to get permission of a priest to obtain certain 'caged' books if they were available at all in Catholic university libraries where I did extensive rsearch. Fortunately, Vatican II seems to have changed this. But freedom of inquiry is limited when the church's position is "you must believe everything the church teaches:!" How free is that? By the way, Aquinas stated that heretics should never be executed by the church. No, the church was to turn them over to the civil authorities so that the state would execute them! Real freedom, right? And separation of church and state, too? When I ran across this my admiration for Aquinas took a sharp tumble.

 6. I predicted that I would be accused of manufacturing my own god by responders. That seems to be the principal retort to my dissent. Ad hominum - sp? Charge the other party with egotism, pride, hauteur, cockiness, placing personal views over the infallible teaching of the Magisterium, etc. I commend independent thinkers for using their God-given brains. I'm sure that's what the good Lord had in mind when he gave us the ability to think. 

 6. Now, if you want to believe that God ordered Joshua to murder all the inhabitants of cities like Jericho and Ai or that he commanded Saul to murder every last Amalekite, that's your privilege. But then I would feel that we worship different gods. Mine is a God of love, of compassion, or mercy, of forgiveness, the God revealed to us by Christ.  I do not rejoice when the crowds shout "Saul has killed his thousands but David has killed his ten thousands!" I consider such shouts as approval of outrageous atrocities thought to be done in obedience to God. Do you really believe that Christ would approve of such atrocities? Have you ever read the Sermon on the Mount? Or, even the Ten Commandments? This blind literalism when it comes to scripture has been the cause of so much violence over the years. It is similar to wild Muslim extremists who grab on to verses in the Koran to justify their murders! "Allah is great!" What an insult to our God who must weep as we go about slaughtering one another. "Blessed are the peacemakers!"

 7. I'm interested in theology and have arrived at some views of my own. But I'm painfully aware that in this universe of perhaps a million (or billion) solar systems we may not know all that much. I walk by faith and not by knowledge, My trust is in God and not in a church or a book or a creed. Christ is my guide and inspiration, and when the lawyer asked him how to obtain eternal life he ignored theological language entirely and said love God and one another  That is the heart of the Gospel and I try to live by it. 

  8. Religion should be a bridge and not a barrier. For centuries religion has been at the root of so much injustice, oppression, hatred, and violence. Think of those Catholic explorers who tortured Indians who resisted the Gospel. And those Protestant Puritans who thought that they alone were God's chosen. Today fundamentalist Muslims are causing so much pain and violence. And we could go on.

  God bless all of his childrem - of every creed, color and country. And may God forgive all those who are infected by the grave sin of religious, racial or any other form of bigotry.
 
Well, they both believe in Baptism they just differ on when you are saved. We need to look at all the scriptures not just some. The Baptist believes you are saved when you believe and the Lutheran believes you are not saved until one is Baptized. So, if both believe and are baptized they both have the same opportunity for salvation. The Bible clearly teaches Baptism is an act of belief.

So, Let me ask you this question. If you are baptized before you are of an age to believe are you saved, using only scripture to show why or why not?
By your own answer are you using your God given Brain to determine that the Catholic Church is the only Church. The more I read here in these forums and the more I study the bible the more I realize I that the Catholic Church is not the Church Jesus established. Far from it.
davec66,

Sorry for jumping in here; but Scripture gives substantial support for infant Baptism, and the forgiveness of sins through Baptism.

John proclaimed a baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sins.

Mark 1 (ESV):
3 the voice of one crying in the wilderness:
‘Prepare the way of the Lord,
make his paths straight,’"

4 John appeared, baptizing in the wilderness and proclaiming a baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sins. 5 And all the country of Judea and all Jerusalem were going out to him and were being baptized by him in the river Jordan, confessing their sins.

Luke 3:
2 during the high priesthood of Annas and Caiaphas, the word of God came to John the son of Zechariah in the wilderness. 3 And he went into all the region around the Jordan, proclaiming a baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sins. 4 As it is written in the book of the words of Isaiah the prophet, "The voice of one crying in the wilderness: 'Prepare the way of the Lord, make his paths straight.

Ephesians 2:
11Therefore remember that at one time you Gentiles in the flesh, called “the uncircumcision” by what is called the circumcision, which is made in the flesh by hands— 12remember that you were at that time separated from Christ, alienated from the commonwealth of Israel and strangers to the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world. 13But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ. 14For he himself is our peace, who has made us both one and has broken down in his flesh the dividing wall of hostility

Colossians 2: 8 See to it that no one takes you captive by philosophy and empty deceit, according to human tradition, according to the elemental spirits of the world, and not according to Christ. 9 For in him the whole fullness of deity dwells bodily, 10 and you have been filled in him, who is the head of all rule and authority. 11 In him also you were circumcised with a circumcision made without hands, by putting off the body of the flesh, by the circumcision of Christ, 12 having been buried with him in baptism, in which you were also raised with him through faith in the powerful working of God, who raised him from the dead.

13 And you, who were dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made alive together with him, having forgiven us all our trespasses, 14 by canceling the record of debt that stood against us with its legal demands. This he set aside, nailing it to the cross. 15 He disarmed the rulers and authorities and put them to open shame, by triumphing over them in him.

The circumcision without hands is the “putting off of the body of the flesh,” by “circumcision of Christ”----being “buried with Him in Baptism,” and “raised with him through faith in the powerful working of God.”

Quotes from other threads: . . . .
davec66,

I’ve noticed you are posting anti-Catholic opinions on multiple threads, but you never actually engage in discussion. You don’t respond when sources are provided that contradict your claims. This does not help your credibility.

I strongly urge you to actually discuss the issues and consider what others post. You don’t have to agree. You can disagree in a respectful way.

It saddens me to see such misguided anti-Catholic rhetoric. Please listen and be open to the possibility that you may not be right about everything. None of us are right all the time.

There is so much to learn here. I hope you last long enough to realize this.

I would also urge you to stop drinking the poison from websites like CARM.

Christ called us to love one another.
 
Roy5,

I read Roy Shoeman’s book, ‘Salvation is from the Jews’. He is Jewish who became Catholic. The Hebrew Catholics will tell you the Sinai Covenant was replaced by the New Covenant of Jesus Christ. Roy has his own webpage, www.salvationisfromthejews.com.

I would strongly recommend others to visit his webpage. He said after becoming Catholic, he felt more Jewish than before. Judaism is fulfilled in the Catholic Church, the New Jerusalem. Roy also explains in his book the 6 constructs of Naziism, the role of Islam in the fulfillment of Scripture, as well as his experience in becoming Catholic.

Hebrew Catholics comprise perhaps 1/8 of Jews accepting Christ. The others are the Messianic Jews who do not have a central authority as we have.

Another site is www.hebrewcatholic.org. Here Hebrew Catholics are working to restore their own identity and culture as Catholics. I learn the Old and New Testament again through our Hebrew brothers and sisters.
 
A few responses

But freedom of inquiry is limited when the church’s position is “you must believe everything the church teaches:!” How free is that?
A change the Church has apparently made is that freedom of inquiry is considered normal and even encouraged. Ironically, however, Augustine or Aquinas would’ve had to have this quality in order to pursue their various lines of thought. But the Church also believes that honest inquiry should eventually lead one to the truths she espouses. So that, she can still maintain that her teachings are true, still be concerned about alternative teachings being off-based in large or small ways, and still say we must agree with her, if only because her teachings align with Gods will.

And why should we object? The problems with this world lie in how it differs with Gods will, so revelation can only be a good thing. We all want answers, that’s why we come to religion.

Christians agree that God exists? That’s good, but some people may find that too dogmatic a statement. We believe in Jesus-but what does that mean? Some well-intentioned people believe Him to be God while others don’t. Where do we draw the line on which tenets are important and which are not, whether regarding the nature of God/Jesus, salvation, God’s will for man in general? What measuring rod do we use to even know where/how to draw the line?
 
Interpretation of Scripture, if accurate, leads to faith, hope, and love. The sum of all commandments is love thy God all your heart, mind, soul, and strength and love your neighbor as yourself. The first three of the Ten Commandments deal with loving God; the other seven deal with loving thy neighbor. We cannot love God without loving our neighbor, and we cannot love our neighbor without loving God. There is a glaring omission in the Ten Commandments – me, myself, and I. Me, myself, and I are to take up our cross and follow Christ and die daily. Loving our neighbor does not mean to love myself and then love my neighbor as much as I love myself; it means to act as though I do not exist and treat my neighbor as though he was my person. When did Jesus think of Himself? St. Paul is another great example. All our Bible study and worship is to be for the benefit of our neighbor. If we do that, Christ will take care of us. Do not worry about what you will eat, wear, etc. Martin Luther stated that we eat and drink Christ’s body and blood at the Eucharist and we are to then let our neighbor eat us, i.e. be Christ to our neighbor. One of the benefits of the Eucharist is that we may decrease and Christ increase. Accurate interpretation of Scripture shows our sin, lets us see the “beam in our own eye” and makes us compassionate towards our neighbor. Accurate interpretation of Scripture does not puff up but causes humility. It does not elevate self above others, but elevates others above self. We must always look to Christ? And where do we find Him? Where His Word and His body and blood are.
 
Hi, Roy5,

Glad to hear you have other things to do.

Oh, and the word is “ad hominem” and this is a type of argument that would say, "You’re wrong because you (fill in the blank) some personal characteristic that has nothing to do with the topic (e.g., have blue eyes, eat meat instead of veggies, live on the other side of the tracks, etc.)

You claiming that YOUR GOD would not do such-and-such a thing (even though it is reported in the Bible that this is what took place) - and my calling your hand on this, is not an “ad hominem” argument. I took the time to enbolden your ‘my god’ statements so you could find them easily.

Merely pointing out that you have created your own god is simply an observation. Now, if you did predict that this would be identified - let me invite you to cite the posting number so I can read your prediction. I honestly do not remember reading this, but, I don’t remember everything… 😃

God bless
A few responses
Code:
This thread is especially interesting, but I plan to drop out of it after this posting because I need to pay attention to more pressing matters. I am hopeful that God will somehow use my musings to spur on creative and less dogmatic thinking and help lead toward religious understanding among at least a few critical readers.
SHORTENED FOR BREVITY
Code:
1. I respect the beliefs of most people. The ones that trouble me are those that are 'fundamentalist', whether Catholic or Protestant. By that I mean those belief systems that are adamant that they alone have the truth and all the rest are in serious error.


 6. I predicted that I would be accused of manufacturing my own god by responders. That seems to be the principal retort to my dissent. Ad hominum - sp? Charge the other party with egotism, pride, hauteur, cockiness, placing personal views over the infallible teaching of the Magisterium, etc. I commend independent thinkers for using their God-given brains. I'm sure that's what the good Lord had in mind when he gave us the ability to think. 

 6. Now, if you want to believe that God ordered Joshua to murder all the inhabitants of cities like Jericho and Ai or that he commanded Saul to murder every last Amalekite, that's your privilege. But then I would feel that we worship different gods. Mine is a God of love, of compassion, or mercy, of forgiveness, the God revealed to us by Christ.  I do not rejoice when the crowds shout "Saul has killed his thousands but David has killed his ten thousands!" I consider such shouts as approval of outrageous atrocities thought to be done in obedience to God. Do you really believe that Christ would approve of such atrocities? Have you ever read the Sermon on the Mount? Or, even the Ten Commandments? This blind literalism when it comes to scripture has been the cause of so much violence over the years. It is similar to wild Muslim extremists who grab on to verses in the Koran to justify their murders! "Allah is great!" What an insult to our God who must weep as we go about slaughtering one another. "Blessed are the peacemakers!"

     
  God bless all of his childrem - of every creed, color and country. And may God forgive all those who are infected by the grave sin of religious, racial or any other form of bigotry.
 
Hi, Anna Scott,

This was a very thoughtful - and, much appreciated post:thumbsup:

God bless
davec66,

I’ve noticed you are posting anti-Catholic opinions on multiple threads, but you never actually engage in discussion. You don’t respond when sources are provided that contradict your claims. This does not help your credibility.

I strongly urge you to actually discuss the issues and consider what others post. You don’t have to agree. You can disagree in a respectful way.

It saddens me to see such misguided anti-Catholic rhetoric. Please listen and be open to the possibility that you may not be right about everything. None of us are right all the time.

There is so much to learn here. I hope you last long enough to realize this.

I would also urge you to stop drinking the poison from websites like CARM.

Christ called us to love one another.
 
davec66,

I’ve noticed you are posting anti-Catholic opinions on multiple threads, but you never actually engage in discussion. You don’t respond when sources are provided that contradict your claims. This does not help your credibility.

I strongly urge you to actually discuss the issues and consider what others post. You don’t have to agree. You can disagree in a respectful way.

It saddens me to see such misguided anti-Catholic rhetoric. Please listen and be open to the possibility that you may not be right about everything. None of us are right all the time.

There is so much to learn here. I hope you last long enough to realize this.

I would also urge you to stop drinking the poison from websites like CARM.

Christ called us to love one another.
Hi, Anna Scott,

This was a very thoughtful - and, much appreciated post:thumbsup:

God bless
Peace and blessings to you as well.

Anna
 
Well, they both believe in Baptism they just differ on when you are saved. We need to look at all the scriptures not just some. The Baptist believes you are saved when you believe and the Lutheran believes you are not saved until one is Baptized. So, if both believe and are baptized they both have the same opportunity for salvation. The Bible clearly teaches Baptism is an act of belief.

So, Let me ask you this question. If you are baptized before you are of an age to believe are you saved, using only scripture to show why or why not?
Infants are baptized because it is a Gift of Grace, the action is not ours.

Not a true statement - *Lutheran believes you are not saved until one is Baptized. *

You are brought into the Church at baptism. Baptism is an outward sign of the Gift of Grace given to us by GOD. The promise of salvation, forgiveness and new life in Jesus.

Romans 6
4We were therefore buried with him through baptism into death in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead through the glory of the Father, we too may live a new life.

Romans 10
9That if you confess with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

Being baptized does not save you, but belief in what happens at baptism is what saves.
 
Well, now that you have made such a claim and seems to back that up with “the more I read here in these forums and the more I study the Bible”, then you must prove your point.

So here is just one question for you, Dave-Who-Uses-His-Brain, and this must be a piece of cake for you to answer with the claim to erudition that you have made.

If you believe in the Bible then you must believe that Christ established a Church (this is something very clearly stated in Matthew’s gospel).

So, can you please show by drawing precise historical lines which current Protestant church it is?

Please trace it back to the Apostles.
Ephesians 2
20built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Christ Jesus himself as the chief cornerstone.

What do we have, in fact **almost every human **on the face of the earth has access to it because of these Apostles and Prophets?

What was left for us? What tells us the whole story? The story that while the Disciples were living it did not actually understand it? At least not until the very end of the story?

John 20
8Finally the other disciple, who had reached the tomb first, also went inside. He saw and believed. 9(They still did not understand from Scripture that Jesus had to rise from the dead.)

The story that if we live as commanded by this legacy it will be our salvation?

GOD’s Word
 
But I don’t believe that we are saved by our theology
That, Roy, is a theological statement…
but by the grace of God,
which is Catholic teaching. 👍
I am confident that God does not condemn sincere people of any religion who love the Lord and love one another.
Indeed. However, “sincerity” is clearly not enough. Truth matters. In every other area in life, we expect truth --why should “sincerity” be enough in theological matters? Clearly, you wouldn’t accept the mistakes of an accountant doing your taxes, no matter how “sincere” he was.
 
To totally subject our God-given brains to a book or a church or a creed is to misuse what the Lord has provided us.
That is another theological pronouncement…

which is taught by the CC.
We are meant to wonder and ponder and question and seek and examine and weigh - and also respect the views of others as long as they respect our views, too. Conviction in our beliefs is fine. Arrogant intolerance is not.
Indeed. However, if one is saying that it doesn’t matter what one believes, as long as one is “sincere” is…well, silly.

From Peter Kreeft: (bold mine)
  1. “All religions are the same, deep down.”
**That is simply factually untrue. **No one ever makes this claim unless he is (1) abysmally ignorant of what the different religions of the world actually teach or (2) intellectually irresponsible in understanding these teachings in the vaguest and woolliest way or (3) morally irresponsible in being indifferent to them. **The objector’s implicit assumption is that the distinctive teachings of the world’s religions are unimportant, that the essential business of religion is not truth but something else: transformation of consciousness or sharing and caring or culture and comfort or something of that sort—not conversion but conversation.**Christianity teaches many things no other religion teaches, and some of them directly contradict those others. If Christianity isn’t true, why be a Christian?

By Catholic standards, the religions of the world can be ranked by how much truth they teach.
Code:
* Catholicism is first, with Orthodoxy equal except for the one issue of papal authority.
* Then comes Protestantism and any "separated brethren" who keep the Christian essentials as found in Scripture.
* Third comes traditional Judaism, which worships the same God but not via Christ.
* Fourth is Islam, greatest of the theistic heresies.
* Fifth, Hinduism, a mystical pantheism;
* Sixth, Buddhism, a pantheism without a theos;
* Seventh, modern Judaism, Unitarianism, Confucianism, Modernism, and secular humanism, none of which have either mysticism or supernatural religion but only ethics;
* Eighth, idolarity; and
* Ninth, Satanism.
To collapse these nine levels is like thinking the earth is flat.
 
I find alot of Protestants also see the Church as so authoritarian…but the reality of actually being Catholic is quite the opposite.

There is one point of faith I had trouble with, it was the dogma of the Assumption of Mary into heaven, which is her holy day today.

I could not understand that, but realized living life that everything the Catholic Church teaches coincides with the real world as well as its finiteness. But the key is living life.

One of the great things about being a Christian is that we believe God revealed Himself as a human being. This reality of the divine meeting the human continues in Christ’s Church. I experience no bondage, no letter of the law but the working of the Holy Spirit through the Church in the Word Made Flesh, in my community, in helping me understand the Word and integrate it in a world that is presently rejecting all that is holy, good and true.

Priests do not like being placed on pedestals…and those who have done so have committed grave aberrations in time.

I also think the American culture has a great effect on our own church culture. And we have these liberal/conservative churches, and when you have all these people together under one roof, it is hard to find the church law…and people want more leadership in these conditions.

We went to a ‘liberal’ parish that called itself an American parish. Some bragged there were no images of Mary in the church and no rosary said for many years. It had a cross on the altar without the corpus…and devout people saw that symbolic of people doing their own thing in the parish rather than doing the will of Christ.

This dissenting group had control over the parish for about 20 years. At one Midnight Mass, someone got dressed up as Santa Claus, went on the altar and they did some kind of action that said Santa Claus was dead…this happened before I got there.

Anyway, my friend finally went to the bishop. When he arrived at the door of the parish with his full bishop attire, a woman came up to him and asked what he was doing there. He just about closed down the parish. He put a priest in who was abused and suffered scars for a long time. My son told me Christianity there was just being nice.

Then I also attended a parish that was very traditional, didn’t want women doing anything during the Mass, refuse to shake your hand for fear of offending the Lord, not smiling or extending themselves…very impersonal…atleast to me. The priests always work to help them but the people just aren’t that way. People leave there feeling very hurt and invalidated as Christians.

Usually problems begin with the ecclesiastics being afraid to discipline or disaffect wealthy or powerful people…and so we have the Gospel compromised. But always during the Mass, no matter the conditions, we are still being fed the Word of God and the Eucharist. We are still being properly taught how to live out our faith in spite of any parish or church politics. I almost left the church after working overseas…but I told my Irish grandmother I am a Roman Catholic not an American Catholic…after working with southern Italians and experiencing such humane and joyous people, very devout Catholics and truly owning their own humanity.

Being Catholic is also being how you focus, where you put your focus, and spending time in prayer, especially before the tabernacle of God. It is there one really grows into the Spirit of the Church which is God Himself. The big challenge is not looking so much at people in the Church but looking at Christ.
 
Thank you, Larkin…

I really appreciated 'Candy’s take on observing Catholics in her search for church…almost 40 years ago when I attended college. She decided to become a Catholic because she found us so ‘earthy’. The Divine coming to the human and the human coming to the divine…but you have to be you…and that is the other part of becoming a Christian in the Catholic Church…dying to yourself in Christ so you can be truly who you are…and in relation to others…

Catholics are like Jews…we are really fulfilled Jews as John Paul II said…we believe as a gathering of people, an arguing, debating vocal people in a church that appears so legalistic on the outside…centering on God.
 
*Apparently the belief in the Assumption goes back to the time of the Church Fathers and was always celebrated. Pope Pius Xll declared it a dogma in 1952 but it was nothing new.

Cinette:)*
 
Thank you, Larkin…

I really appreciated 'Candy’s take on observing Catholics in her search for church…almost 40 years ago when I attended college. She decided to become a Catholic because she found us so ‘earthy’. The Divine coming to the human and the human coming to the divine…but you have to be you…and that is the other part of becoming a Christian in the Catholic Church…dying to yourself in Christ so you can be truly who you are…and in relation to others…

Catholics are like Jews…we are really fulfilled Jews as John Paul II said…we believe as a gathering of people, an arguing, debating vocal people in a church that appears so legalistic on the outside…centering on God.
With that kind of attitude, I might even let you take me to a service! There is a poetry and a grace in religious worship that is very appealing to me. Although there are other aspects of ritual that I find hollow and empty. And then of course the believing in miracles and stuff… 🙂

But I like your expressions and feeling of human warmth about it all.
 
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