How do you transform a happy-clappy parish into a conservative one?

[Lepanto]

How do you transform a happy-clappy parish into a conservative (orthodox, traditional) one?

How can this be done, assuming that most people are satisfied with status quo and probably don’t know anything else?

What can the priest do?

What can the faithful do?

(Of course, changing the mindset of the people is much more difficult than simply installing a reredo.)

I’m not talking transforming NO to TLM, but happy-clappy NO to the NO that Vatican II intended, along with greater devotional life and practices.

 

[havemercy]

Bring in an exorcist.

 

[brigid12]

First, you’d probably want the bishop(s) and the priests to all go on an indepth retreat that was both catechetical and spiritual, led by Mother Angelica. hehe…she wouldn’t give them a chance to get away with anything. Then catechesis during the homily and to **all **church committees and offers of it to others of the parish. All this done, pray!

 

[jmcrae]

Is the priest on-side? If he’s not, then forget it - wait for the next one. If so, then here are some things that could work:

Get the Rosary ladies (yes, you have some - they’re hiding out, right now, because all that hand-holding and Kumabaya stuff scares them silly) to pray the Rosary out loud for 20 minutes before every single Mass - meaning all the Sunday Masses and all the weekday Masses, and have them pray the Prayer of St. Michael at the end of every Rosary, just before the prayer for the dead. (And if they aren’t in the habit of praying the prayer for the dead at the end of every Rosary, then get them to do that, too.)

Start up First Friday Adoration, if you can - even if it’s just you and the priest for one hour after the Friday Mass, that’ll get the ball rolling - others will start to join you, and you’ll see great things start to happen.

 

[brigid12]

Bring in an exorcist.

Love it!!!

 

[Dauphin]

How do you transform a happy-clappy parish into a conservative (orthodox, traditional) one?

How can this be done, assuming that most people are satisfied with status quo and probably don’t know anything else?

What can the priest do?

What can the faithful do?

(Of course, changing the mindset of the people is much more difficult than simply installing a reredo.)

I’m not talking transforming NO to TLM, but happy-clappy NO to the NO that Vatican II intended, along with greater devotional life and practices.

This sort of thing is a slow process. If the parish doesn’t already have it, the pastor should be encouraged to implement Eucharistic adoration. A greater appreciation for the Eucharist is the beginning of a fundamental change in attitude towards the liturgy. Also, if orthodox members genuflect, this should help a bit in reminding people what’s in the tabernacle, and the practice should gradually spread.

The priest can also start talking about sin again. I can’t recall ever hearing a priest give a sermon about sin during Mass - mortal vs. venial, state of grace, etc…

Once people start to understand the importance of remaining in a state of grace in order to receive the Eucharist, a greater appreciation for the liturgy should ensue.

Also, the MUSIC has alot to do with setting the mood for the liturgy. If not gregorian chant, then at least use some reverent old english hymns along the lines of “lift high the cross”. The music should convey that the Mass is a sacrifice, not a party.

 

[JuanCarlos]

Without a good pastor, you just can’t win.

That being said, there’s always hope. But if your parish is holding skits instead of homilies, uses more eucharistic ministers than people in the pews, and doesn’t know the meaning of “Dominus Vobiscum”, than here’s an analogy- your parish is the Titanic, and liturgical abuse is the iceberg. Forget saving the ship, just get out while you still can.

 

[Lepanto]

Without a good pastor, you just can’t win.

That being said, there’s always hope. But if your parish is holding skits instead of homilies, uses more eucharistic ministers than people in the pews, and doesn’t know the meaning of “Dominus Vobiscum”, than here’s an analogy- your parish is the Titanic, and liturgical abuse is the iceberg. Forget saving the ship, just get out while you still can.

Very good points.

For the sake of this discussion, let’s assume that the pastor wants to change the parish.

 

[JuanCarlos]

Maybe start taking noticebale steps. Ones that really attract peoples interest.

Post a sign on the doors that say “Thank you for respecting the Real Presense of Our Lord in this Church by maintaining silence when inside.”

Have the pastor give homilies about sin, the need for confession, and hell. As well as the lives of the saints and Heaven. In short, sermons that actually carry weight. Not “everyone is doing fine” homilies.

Have the pastor say some prayers in Latin.

Encourage the people to recieve on the tongue.

Start an after Mass Bible study (so people don’t have to come seperately- nice and conveniant)

 

[bpbasilphx]

<<How do you transform a happy-clappy parish into a conservative (orthodox, traditional) one?>>

Are you the pastor, Lepanto?

If not, just deal with it and accept it as a mortification.

 

[Joab_Anias]

How do you transform a happy-clappy parish into a conservative (orthodox, traditional) one?

How can this be done, assuming that most people are satisfied with status quo and probably don’t know anything else?

What can the priest do?

What can the faithful do?

(Of course, changing the mindset of the people is much more difficult than simply installing a reredo.)

I’m not talking transforming NO to TLM, but happy-clappy NO to the NO that Vatican II intended, along with greater devotional life and practices.

First thing you can do is get involved with your priest.

Ask him to be your spiritual director then bring up your concerns. You will need him to lead after all its his parish and he alone has the option to make changes. This is assuming that the rubrics and cannons are followed. If they aren’t then first you must approach him, (Don’t insult him) and if that fails write the Bishop.

If all is good this far you might consider asking permission to start a prayer group. Possibly a Rosary before or after Mass group where the whole parish is invited. This could lead to greater reverance. Maybe even your priest would lead.

Then of course by example. I attend several parishes traveling for work. When I see an abuse I do not follow the blind.

One church I go to they all stand through and after the consecration. This is allowed in the dioceses of the United States but I feel its irreverant so I kneel which is just as allowed.

This is the example I portrait, not because I am wanting to set an example for anyone but Jesus.

Lastly I would not be offended at clapping. Its good to support the efforts of those in the community. I assume its for things like the choir.

My home parish asks everyone to greet each other before the opening of the Mass and we pray a common prayer after the closing. These might be things you could recommend if you establish a relationship with your priest.

All the best.

Peace.

 

[brotherhrolf]

This glitch with the forums is really beginning to get annoying. I just had a lengthy post deleted when I tried to link to Amazon

Music is the key. You will never be able to transform your happy-clappy parish into anything else as long as the music is from “Glory and Praise” or any of that ilk.

When was the last time you heard “To Jesus Christ Our Sovereign King”, “Praise to the Lord”, “Come Holy Ghost”, or “Immaculate Mary” sung at your parish. I never ceased to be amazed at how strongly my parish sings these old hymns.

There is a mid-way point between the traditionalism of the past and the happy-clappy of the present - it’s called Taize. Taize draws me into the “Spirit” as much as Gregorian Chant and Latin motets do. On Pentecost Sunday, my choir sings the Taize “Veni Sancte Spiritus” (Latin, English, Spanish, German, French). I’d provide a link to this except that the forums are acting up.

Or Taize’s “Crucem Tuam” or “Jesus Remember Me”

We don’t have to succumb to happy-clappy. We have 1,500 + years of music to draw from. There is music being composed today which fits into our traditions. As soon as the forums straighten out, I’ll post the appropriate links.

 

[amontoya]

What’s wrong with being happy …and clappy?

 

[Pani_Rose]

First, you’d probably want the bishop(s) and the priests to all go on an indepth retreat that was both catechetical and spiritual, led by Mother Angelica. hehe…she wouldn’t give them a chance to get away with anything. Then catechesis during the homily and to **all **church committees and offers of it to others of the parish. All this done, pray!

I guess you never saw Mother Angelica rejoicing at a Charismatic Conference when she was much younger. You are right, the lady knows how to dance, but she also knows when it is in order and out of order.

We are truly called to ‘rejoice in the Lord always’, but God is a God of propriety and order. Glory to God!

 

[Dauphin]

What’s wrong with being happy …and clappy?

Was Mary “happy and clappy” at the foot of the cross? Did those witnessing the Crucifixion dance around and sing happy songs?

At Mass, we are at Calvary. We are present at the Lord’s sacrifice - His very Flesh and Blood presented for us on the altar. At Mass, we should behave exactly as we would if we were at the Crucifixion.

 

[brotherhrolf]

What’s wrong with being happy …and clappy?

Amontyoya: the answer to the question would be readily apparent if you had ever experienced a Mass before 1970. This is a large part of the problem. What is accepted as the norm today bears no resemblance to the norm forty years ago.

 

[amontoya]

I understand the need for, at times, silence in Mass, but I still see no reason to be unhappy about it. Shouldn’t we rejoice to sing the Gloria? Shouldn’t we rejoice to hear the Scriptures? Most of all, shouldn’t we rejoice to receive This Most Precious Gift from Our Savior? Maybe I’m wrong, but I can’t help but feel joy and happiness at Mass. After being protestant for most of my life, and finally finding Christ in His Fullness, what I feel most, is happy.

 

[Like]

Amontyoya: the answer to the question would be readily apparent if you had ever experienced a Mass before 1970. This is a large part of the problem. What is accepted as the norm today bears no resemblance to the norm forty years ago.

It is truly amassing how a OF (NO) parish would change if only the pastor would stand up and lead the parish in the right direction!

 

[Sure]

I have seen it happen…within 3 years a parish can be dramatically changed.

Some actions a pastor can take:

1. Hire a good music director.
2. If music director has to wait, eliminate heretical hymns and push for a few traditional hymns. People like to sing them and they are easy to sing.
3. Emphasize the importance of liturgy done right.
4. Sing the Mass whenever possible. After chanted prayers, the Glory and Praise hymnal will begin to sound as it really is - bland.
5. Use the Mass as a teaching moment. A series of homilies about the importance of liturgy and the Mass as a “foretaste of the heavenly liturgy” can make a big impression.
6. Celebrate “high” Masses - get some hired guns for the choir, pick some really powerful music, get a neighboring parish priest to serve as MC, use 12 altar servers, and dust off the thurible.

In short, let the power of the sacred liturgy convert the parish. A devout, sung “high” ordinary form Mass will speak to people’s hearts in ways that the “glory and praise” ad-libbed Mass does not.

Above all, the parish priest should speak the Truth with GREAT love and understanding and realize that conversion won’t happen overnight, but it WILL happen!

 

[Bridget07]

How do you transform a happy-clappy parish into a conservative (orthodox, traditional) one?

How can this be done, assuming that most people are satisfied with status quo and probably don’t know anything else?

What can the priest do?

What can the faithful do?

(Of course, changing the mindset of the people is much more difficult than simply installing a reredo.)

I’m not talking transforming NO to TLM, but happy-clappy NO to the NO that Vatican II intended, along with greater devotional life and practices.

Not all our Masses are happy clappy. The Vigil Mass has some Latin and Chant and pretty quiet most times. That is my favorite. I am glad at least we have a choice. And the 11:30 am Mass I stay away from; they have drums and guitars and folky music. 9am is usually not so bad at least they don’t have drums and guitars. This morning though the priest cheered the college football team because they won yesterday. We only had to clap once!!!