How is the LDS a cult? Part 2

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Pacos_Pete said:
LDS is a cult because it requires tithing.
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Nobody said that. I think it is how you follow your President that makes Mormonism a cult.
Pacos_Pete said:
When I was in the military, there were solders that would party all week and go to confession every Sunday.
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Partying is not a sin, and weekly confession was typical pre-Vatican II.
Pacos_Pete said:
I don’t know about you, however I will still pay what is expected of me.
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Catholics do too, but we don’t have to tell a Priest we have.
 
Marie5890 said:
Which will decrease the busyness to the one in Mass, DC, and perhaps Manhattan.
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Tangent:

The Mormon bookstore near the DC temple is called “This is the place” (as in the Brigham Young statement). They even answer the phone that way. Always cracks me up. 😃
 
aspirant said:
Tangent:

The Mormon bookstore near the DC temple is called “This is the place” (as in the Brigham Young statement). They even answer the phone that way. Always cracks me up. 😃
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LOL…

I vaguely remember the visitor center there. The first time I did baptisms for the dead it was in the DC temple as a youth temple trip. It was the only time I ever went to that temple…
 
Pacos Pete…if you are implying I stirred up the hornet’s nest, actually it was your claim that priests make people pay to get their confession.

I am in my mid 60’s and that is a new one. I heard about priests and nuns having sex in the tunnels under the ground between the rectories and the convents. But never a priest making someone pay to go to confession.

But never heard this one about paying a priest for absolution. If this is how you are seeking truth…it will most difficult to say the least.

If you want to find the truth about Catholicism, get yourself a copy of the universal Catholic Catechism or the documents of Vatican II.
 
Wouldnt “paying a priest for absolution” being simony? Or am I getting my terms mixed up?

Perhaps Pete connected the idea of she was going to confession and also brought her offering with her as well. not realizing that they arent connected…but he thought they were.
 
Marie5890 said:
Kathleen which temple is near you? If you live in a highly populated area of Mormons, yea those temples tend be more busy than others…

I know one is planned for the Hartford area. Which will decrease the busyness to the one in Mass, DC, and perhaps Manhattan.

I do believe that the cleaning and the janitorial care of temples is done overnight or while the temple is closed
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Temple cleaning at my temple occurs after the last Endowment session is done and the baptistry is closed, usually between 8:30-9:30pm.

A few of my friends go to the early 6:30am endowment session before work, while some go after work in the evening. The temple (Manhattan) is usually packed on Saturdays, so I avoid going then. Last time I went a few weeks ago was on a Saturday, and there were youth groups doing proxy baptisms, 2 “live” endowments (i.e. 2 people were receiving their own endowment), everyone else doing proxy endowments and going to support the 2 receiving their own, people doing proxy initiatories (washing and anointing), and proxy sealings (English in one sealing room and Spanish in the other). In contrast, when I go midday during the week, it’s pretty much me and maybe 5-6 other patrons, plus the temple workers, so very quiet.
 
Pacos_Pete said:
When I was a teen, I would haul a lady across town to Mass so she could pay the Father $5.00 to hear her confession. I didn’t think it strange it was her belief.
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That is certainly odd, maybe you misunderstood what she was giving money for. When I was Catholic, I never paid for confession, and I’ve never heard of that occurring.
 
RebeccaJ said:
Joseph Smith & Co. were not heretics from Catholicism before they created Mormonism because they weren’t heretics as Protestants. Can we say they are heretics from Protestantism? Possibly. As far as I’ve read, Smith was raised by his parents to read the Bible and believe in Jesus, but they weren’t all that religious. He joined a Methodist church, but that was short-lived, and who knows what he really understood?

People say Catholicism is wrong, the whore of Babylon, the beast of Revelations, etc., that doesn’t mean they have an orthodox understanding. I’ve never read anything of Smith’s that indicates he understood orthodox Christian teachings. Sidney Rigdon was a Christian pastor before joining Smith to form Mormonism and helped formulate the Mormon view of God as three distinct beings. I think there is a stronger case to claim Rigdon was a heretic from Protestantism than there is for Smith.

Proclaiming a person is an unrepentant heretic is claiming they are damned. As I said, I leave judgment of individuals to God. The religion itself is of course heretical in its teachings.
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The held to the Arian heresy. They were baptized christians. The combination is anathematized… most likely, they are doomed to hell. Unless they repented…
 
Marie – Simony is taking that which is contributed to God, stealing it for one’s use, and lying when confronted.
 
Woah last time I checked this forum, my thread had 100 posts. Now it has over 1,000 and a second thread! :eek: Heh, at least it inspired debate. 🙂
 
Thanks, Marie, for reference.

We studied St. Hildegard of Bingen, Germany. She lived before the Reformation. She was exhorting some of the ecclesiastics of giving the impression of selling sacred things. I wonder if places such as this led to the selling of indulgences. This abuse did not happen everywhere or in every place in Germany.
 
RebeccaJ said:
Mt. Oly, here’s the thing with these type of stories, you have no idea what would have happened if you had kept the $500 and used it to support your family. You have made an association, like the classic, every time I wash my car it rains, therefore, washing my car causes it to rain.

Correlation is not causation.
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Of course you are right. It can never be proved what would have happend if I didn’t pay my full tithing. But it doesn’t matter. God has provided everything I have and 10% of my increase belongs to him. I had faith in the promise that God made to those who pay their tithing: “Prove me now herewith, saith the Lord of hosts, if I will not open the windows of heaven.” (Malachi 3:10)

All I know is that I paid $500 and the next day I received $3500 which was totally unexpected. And, that it was the amount required to carry us over until I found another job in my profession.

“Trust in the Lord with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding. In all thy ways acknowledge him, and he shall direct thy paths.” (Prov. 3:5-6)
 
Aramis said:
The held to the Arian heresy. They were baptized christians. The combination is anathematized… most likely, they are doomed to hell. Unless they repented…
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Actually, the Arians were closer to the beliefs of the JWs. Latter-day Saints believe that Jesus is divine.
 
mtolympus said:
Actually, the Arians were closer to the beliefs of the JWs. Latter-day Saints believe that Jesus is divine.
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However one similarity is that LDS believe that Jesus Christ/Jehovah was created by the Father. He did not always exist as the Son of God/Jehovah, but was begotten of Heavenly Parents, just like we all have, He being the First-born (and of course we all have a core intelligence that has existed eternally, that makes us co-eternal with God in that sense).

In contrast, traditional Christians believe that Christ has always existed eternally as God the Son, the Son of God.
 
mtolympus said:
Of course you are right. It can never be proved what would have happend if I didn’t pay my full tithing. But it doesn’t matter. God has provided everything I have and 10% of my increase belongs to him. I had faith in the promise that God made to those who pay their tithing: “Prove me now herewith, saith the Lord of hosts, if I will not open the windows of heaven.” (Malachi 3:10)

All I know is that I paid $500 and the next day I received $3500 which was totally unexpected. And, that it was the amount required to carry us over until I found another job in my profession.

“Trust in the Lord with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding. In all thy ways acknowledge him, and he shall direct thy paths.” (Prov. 3:5-6)
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No doubt all we have belongs to God.

I think, however, the idea that tithing is an investment with material reward is about 180 degrees from how Catholics view offerings. 🤷
 
RebeccaJ said:
No doubt all we have belongs to God.

I think, however, the idea that tithing is an investment with material reward is about 180 degrees from how Catholics view offerings. 🤷
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Blessings from tithing can come in many different ways. The only thing I knew was that if I paid my tithing everything would be OK. It wasn’t easy. It took over 15 months to get back into my very specialized profession.
 
LivingWaters7 said:
However one similarity is that LDS believe that Jesus Christ/Jehovah was created by the Father. He did not always exist as the Son of God/Jehovah, but was begotten of Heavenly Parents, just like we all have, He being the First-born (and of course we all have a core intelligence that has existed eternally, that makes us co-eternal with God in that sense).

In contrast, traditional Christians believe that Christ has always existed eternally as God the Son, the Son of God.
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Yes, but I still wouldn’t equate our beliefs with the Arians that believed that Jesus was a created being and therefore not divine.
 
RebeccaJ said:
No doubt all we have belongs to God.

I think, however, the idea that tithing is an investment with material reward is about 180 degrees from how Catholics view offerings. 🤷
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Not sure how many Mormons view tithing as afinancial investment and how many view it as an opportunity to be faithful. Sound like to me that MtOly took it as the latter and was blessed for his faithfulness.

God blesses whom he wills
 
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