How many Catholics think this way?

[Aydan]

ahhh yes now I understand what you’re saying better. Sorry I’m so used to the anti-Catholic stuff because that’s what I’m exposed to most of the time. Well I grew up as a baptized Catholic who received first Eucharist but was neve taught the faith my mom never went to church and I grew up not knowing who Jesus or why he died on the cross. but all this time I was searching for God and I even considered converting to Islam at one point. The Godparent that I mentioned earlier introduced me to Christ I decided that becoming Muslim was not a good idea because I would have to rejects the Trinity. and after that I started exploring different religions to find out who Jesus was I studied Protestant religions and asked for a Bible. That’s how I ended up with the Protestant study Bible. But the Protestant denominations just didn’t feel right to me One of the people that I went to school with is Catholic and she invited me to go with her several times and I declined because I believed what Protestants had been telling me which is that the Catholic Church teaches the wrong things. But finally one night I went with her and God spoke to my heart and told me that this is where I was supposed to be through John chapter 9. I didn’t even realize that the Protestant and Catholic Bibles were different until much later when I discovered that I could not find the book of wisdom in my Protestant Bible only then did I understand the Apocrypha. So I’ve always read the Bible since I started my faith journey and came home to the Catholic Church in 2003. And I still read the Bible except now I understand it much better because I understand who Jesus is. And I rely on be the experience of more experienced Catholics to guide me since I am still a fairly new Catholic. I guess it was my faith journey that caused me to have such a different perspective but at the time I assumed everyone read the Bible because when she introduced me to Jesus that’s what my godparent told me.

I wasn’t directing those responses to you. to the OP…I find very few Catholics that actually study the bible. The only reason I think I studied it so much as a teen was that 2/3rds of my large family consiting of mom and dad’s families are Protestant…anti-Catholic in fact. Many deacons and elders in mom’s family. My wife’s entire family are Protestant…Bishops/elders, deacons and preachers…lots of them. I was planning ot be a preacher. My anti-Catholic wife came to know the truth at the same time in late 2006. I left the Catholic faith when I was 28 and came back with my wife and 3 children. The oldest is discerning the priesthood like I did years ago. Unless you actually apply yourself and find the truth you will wonder about like a blind person…thinking you know where you’re at and then you begin to see the beauty of the Church in the Fullness of Christ…in the Catholic Church…not some ecclesial community that professes erroniously to be a church… If you carefully read your scriptures you will come to know the truth. Most Protestant faiths approach the bible trying to support what they believe rather than to approach it from trying to learn the truth…why? Because they already think they know the truth. If you listen and study apologetics and theology you begin to understand that the only Church out there standing up for the dignity of the human person is the Catholic Church…

 

[Dauphin]

I do not remember the USA being a Catholic State, or are you talking about something else?

I’m saying that it will never be a Catholic state.

 

[ChristianKnight]

I’m saying that it will never be a Catholic state.

Well, I’ll be honest, I wouldn’t mind if it was or not, cause I still do not see a lot of stuff in Catholocism, but I could pick worse religions that it turn into. Satanism for one.

 

[Dauphin]

Well, I’ll be honest, I wouldn’t mind if it was or not, cause I still do not see a lot of stuff in Catholocism, but I could pick worse religions that it turn into. Satanism for one.

… thanks… I think.

 

[Kaninchen]

War brings out atrocities - undeclared wars even more so.

In the spring of 2000, a group of Ulstermen (Protestant clergymen) shot down a group of Catholic schoolgirls, for using the sidewalk that went by their church as a shortcut to get to school after their lunch break.

Nonsense.

 

[Kaninchen]

The thing is that the ‘legend-history’ actually detracts from the real lessons that could be learned - the original story was powerful enough in and of itself.

 

[Kaninchen]

The wikipedia article is certainly right about it being a PR catastrophe for the Unionist’s cause - I can’t say that I knew many people with much sympathy for them in the first place but whatever little sympathy there was evaporated almost overnight.

 

[elts1956]

This is inaccurate. The Spanish Inquisition did no such thing.

The Church only has trouble “living down” people’s ignorance regarding the inquisitions.

Please tell us what the Spainish Inquisition did then. Or give us site/book that will enlighten us. I have only heard horror stories about it and that the Catholic Church, especially in Spain, supported it. I thought the Inquisition was mainly against the Jews and others deemed heretics by the Church. Thanks.

 

[minkymurph]

Yes, three counties of Ulster are in the Republic of Ireland and are 95% Catholic.

 

[minkymurph]

Do you have any idea what year that bombing campaign took place in England? Because I lost a very dear penpal friend who died in an IRA bombing in London, in 1982. He was someone who was just an innocent bystander, on his lunch break as an administrator of a hospital…

I don’t know which particular bombing campaign this Priest was involved in. I know it all came out when the peace process started about 10 years ago and the story received a very high profile in the media; the debate being should the Priest have broken the seal of the confession or not, therefore I’m sure I would have no trouble getting you the details as I’m sure there’s any amount of information on it. Just let me know what details you want. You could also try going on-line and look for reports in the Belfast Telegraph or the Irish News. I’ll try and get you the exact year the story for a more accurate search if you like.

 

[minkymurph]

Sheprahad

I found the article on the Belfast Telegraph site. I knew I was hazy on some of the details; I think the Priest who heard the confession was living in England which is why I said the bombings where in England but it was actually the Claudy bombings in 1972. Sorry if this doesn’t help but you can read the story anyway.

The article if found at: www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk
The article is - Review of Priest link to Bomb and IRA nears end.
Date 6th December 2006.

There are other articles there as well. I am hazy on the details but I think the Priest who heard the confession may have died as well in England a few years later and if my memory serves me right, he left a journal or a letter of something saying he’s heard the confession. If I find anything else I’ll let you know.

 

[elts1956]

I have heard horror stories of the Spanish Inquisition most of my life, mainly, I have to admit through movies and stories, but I did find the following on the website JEWISH VIRTUAL LIBRARY.

Jewish Virtual Library
jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/History/Inquisition.html

In the beginning, the Inquisition dealt only with Christian heretics and did not interfere with the affairs of Jews. However, disputes about Maimonides’ books (which addressed the synthesis of Judaism and other cultures) provided a pretext for harassing Jews and, in 1242, the Inquisition condemned the Talmud and burned thousands of volumes. In 1288, the first mass burning of Jews on the stake took place in France.
In 1481 the Inquisition started in Spain and ultimately surpassed the medieval Inquisition, in both scope and intensity. Conversos (Secret Jews) and New Christians were targeted because of their close relations to the Jewish community, many of whom were Jews in all but their name. Fear of Jewish influence led Queen Isabella and King Ferdinand to write a petition to the Pope asking permission to start an Inquisition in Spain. In 1483 Tomas de Torquemada became the inquisitor-general for most of Spain, he set tribunals in many cities. Also heading the Inquisition in Spain were two Dominican monks, Miguel de Morillo and Juan de San Martin.
First, they arrested Conversos and notable figures in Seville; in Seville more than 700 Conversos were burned at the stake and 5,000 repented. Tribunals were also opened in Aragon, Catalonia and Valencia. An Inquisition Tribunal was set up in Ciudad Real, where 100 Conversos were condemned, and it was moved to Toledo in 1485. Between 1486-1492, 25 auto de fes were held in Toledo, 467 people were burned at the stake and others were imprisoned. The Inquisition finally made its way to Barcelona, where it was resisted at first because of the important place of Spanish Conversos in the economy and society.
More than 13,000 Conversos were put on trial during the first 12 years of the Spanish Inquisition. Hoping to eliminate ties between the Jewish community and Conversos, the Jews of Spain were expelled in 1492…
The next phase of the Inquisition began around 1531, when Pope Leo X extended the Inquisition to Portugal. Thousands of Jews came to Portugal after the 1492 expulsion. A Spanish style Inquisition was constituted and tribunals were set up in Lisbon and other cities. Among the Jews who died at the hands of the Inquisition were well-known figures of the period such as Isaac de Castro Tartas, Antonio Serrao de Castro and Antonio Jose da Silva. The Inquisition never stopped in Spain and continued until the late 18th century.
By the second half of the 18th century, the Inquisition abated, due to the spread of enlightened ideas and lack of resources. The last auto de fe in Portugal took place on October 27, 1765. Not until 1808, during the brief reign of Joseph Bonaparte, was the Inquisition abolished in Spain. An estimated 31,912 heretics were burned at the stake, 17,659 were burned in effigy and 291,450 made reconciliations in the Spanish Inquisition. In Portugal, about 40,000 cases were tried, although only 1,800 were burned, the rest made penance.
The Inquisition was not limited to Europe; it also spread to Spanish and Portugese colonies in the New World and Asia. Many Jews and Conversos fled from Portugal and Spain to the New World seeking greater security and economic opportunities. Branches of the Portugese Inquisition were set up in Goa and Brazil. Spanish tribunals and auto de fes were set up in Mexico, the Philippine Islands, Guatemala, Peru, New Granada and the Canary Islands. By the late 18th century, most of these were dissolved.
Also see Auto de fe
and the following websites. There are many more. I suggest we all become a bit more educated about this horrible period of human history.

galileo.rice.edu/chr/inquisition.html
catholic.net/rcc/Periodicals/Dossier/1112-96/article2.html

 

[elts1956]

With all due respect, that is only recorded in the NT, which was never meant to be an historical work, but a religious work of faith.

But even if it did happen, it was limited to a few Christians, and in one time period only. The long, sad history of Christian persecution of Jews involved many thousands upon thousands of Jews, and lasted 2000 years.

The Jews have been a persecuted people for as long as they have existed. But not only by those calling themselves Christian. I for one would not include anyone who persecutes another because of their Faith a Christian, or a Muslim, or a Jew.

This type of human does not fit in any category known to us.

And the history of the persecution of the Catholic Church for 2000 years is also a part of history.

 

[Deconi]

I still haven’t gotten over the Romans using Christians as human torches (Because they were Christians) to light their roads!

Perhaps I should commence a case against the Italians!!

…or the Germans for the autrocities of both wars against non-Germans (not just the Jews)

…or every American for the Indians

…or the South Africans for the coloured

…or the Chinese for the non-Chinese…

…or the Israelis for the Palestinians

…or vice versa

The human experience records ‘suffering’ from a people against a people, over and over. Perhaps we should all start apologising to each other for the “wrongs” our ancestors did to each other! (Preposterous!)

My own lineage had their share of suffering and some still endure and persevere in theirs, to reach, “freedom.” But we don’t hold the ‘past’ accountable for our ‘present’ but rather, our existence in spite of our past!

Unless you can travel through time, there is little to be gained by ‘dwelling’ on the past. ** Do not forget the past, for the present cannot BE without IT! ** “You” are here because of EVERYTHING that occurred in your lineage! Change one iota, could have resulted in “you” being erased from existence, and another of your line, being here, live and in person.

The past is supposed to teach us how to deal with the present so the future does not repeat the negatives of the past. Be grateful that Providence chose “you” to be here! Make use of it to better the unknown (future) and not to ‘correct’ the past, for you cannot!

All the apologies and money in the world or restoration of previous lineages of royalty or pauper is not going to prevent one whiplash, hanging, burning, enslavement, oppression or death of those that have gone before us!

 

[MDK]

Do you have any idea what year that bombing campaign took place in England? Because I lost a very dear penpal friend who died in an IRA bombing in London, in 1982. He was someone who was just an innocent bystander, on his lunch break as an administrator of a hospital.

To think that an ordained priest of the Catholic church could have havd anything to do with a bombing campaign that killed innocent human beings…I just have no words for that.

As a comment on the Priesthood… Priests do not lose their free will when they become ordained. They can still sin just like anyone else… small and large. They will have to answer to God just like everyone else. To add to the picture, to one that more has been given, more is expected. Almost all priests I’ve encountered in my life are wonderful, and do the work of God for which they became ordained.

This brings up an interesting question for you. First, are you really being honest when you say you have no words for that, because you’ve had plenty of words of accusation and broad brush vilification thus far for members of the Church and the Church itself. I haven’t read all the threads, but do you believe this priest to be validly ordained in the true priesthood? If not, and the Catholic Church is false, then wouldn’t you expect this kind of thing or expect to see a lot more of it? You seem to have implicated along the way that throughout history, the Catholic Church and it’s members have engaged in campaigns of terrorizing and taking away liberties… including paving the way for killing. Why then would this kind of thing be any different from what you have claimed… yet, you act shocked and appalled. Have you had a conversion where you believe the Catholic Church is what it claims to be, and if it’s members follow the teachings, they will walk in God’s Ways, therefore the exceptions you have “just no words for”…?

 

[panoikei]

ahhh yes now I understand what you’re saying better. Sorry I’m so used to the anti-Catholic stuff because that’s what I’m exposed to most of the time. Well I grew up as a baptized Catholic who received first Eucharist but was neve taught the faith my mom never went to church and I grew up not knowing who Jesus or why he died on the cross. but all this time I was searching for God and I even considered converting to Islam at one point. The Godparent that I mentioned earlier introduced me to Christ I decided that becoming Muslim was not a good idea because I would have to rejects the Trinity. and after that I started exploring different religions to find out who Jesus was I studied Protestant religions and asked for a Bible. That’s how I ended up with the Protestant study Bible. But the Protestant denominations just didn’t feel right to me One of the people that I went to school with is Catholic and she invited me to go with her several times and I declined because I believed what Protestants had been telling me which is that the Catholic Church teaches the wrong things. But finally one night I went with her and God spoke to my heart and told me that this is where I was supposed to be through John chapter 9. I didn’t even realize that the Protestant and Catholic Bibles were different until much later when I discovered that I could not find the book of wisdom in my Protestant Bible only then did I understand the Apocrypha. So I’ve always read the Bible since I started my faith journey and came home to the Catholic Church in 2003. And I still read the Bible except now I understand it much better because I understand who Jesus is. And I rely on be the experience of more experienced Catholics to guide me since I am still a fairly new Catholic. I guess it was my faith journey that caused me to have such a different perspective but at the time I assumed everyone read the Bible because when she introduced me to Jesus that’s what my godparent told me.

Great story. I grew up in my mom’s home, not Catholic dad until much later. I was baptized Catholic but mom didn’t like it one bit. she bent over backwards to make sure we never became Catholic - truly anti-Catholic. Dad was in Vietnam and came back home to find 2 hours of being in the home that mom wanted him out of her life. It broke his heart and he really never recovered form it emotionally and Vietnam along with divorce kept him in the gutter mentally and emotionally most of the rest of his life. I wish zoloft existed back then. I receive first communion when I was almost 15 and less than six months later ended up in my stepmom’s southern baptist country area… 30 minutes to nearest highway access anti-Catholic area parish church.

Welcome home. I’m a revert too. I walked with my wife’s church for 17 years. She actually pulled me back to Catholicism while I was journeying towards Orthodoxy. I understand much better now my faith and feel like a fool for having done most of the things I’ve done in the past.

Pax et bonum

 

[minkymurph]

As a comment on the Priesthood… Priests do not lose their free will when they become ordained. They can still sin just like anyone else… small and large. They will have to answer to God just like everyone else. To add to the picture, to one that more has been given, more is expected. Almost all priests I’ve encountered in my life are wonderful, and do the work of God for which they became ordained."…?

I live in Northern Ireland and I have to say that no one here was really all that surprised a Priest was involved. It is a well known fact that individual Priests where involved with the IRA. The vast majority however where not and condemned their actions. You can read reports of this on the Belfast telegraph link.

This brings up an interesting question for you. do you believe this priest to be validly ordained in the true priesthood?

Interesting point. I don’t know anyone can say but I would say two things. Jesus himself picked Judas and the Church is not invulnerable against those who would infiltrate the Priesthood for their own ends. As the saying goes however, it all comes out in the wash as God is always refining his Church.

 

[MDK]

I live in Northern Ireland and I have to say that no one here was really all that surprised a Priest was involved. It is a well known fact that individual Priests where involved with the IRA. The vast majority however where not and condemned their actions. You can read reports of this on the Belfast telegraph link.
MDK;3978279:

This brings up an interesting question for you. …do you believe this priest to be validly ordained in the true priesthood?

Interesting point. I don’t know anyone can say but I would say two things. Jesus himself picked Judas and the Church is not invulnerable against those who would infiltrate the Priesthood for their own ends. As the saying goes however, it all comes out in the wash as God is always refining his Church.

Your post is complimentary in nature and adds insight. What I still don’t know is how our fellow forum member who belongs to our ancestors in faith, believes here. Are they saying that they consider the Catholic Church valid, teaching God’s Word, and with validly ordained priests, such that this individual (and those who do likewise) are not living the teachings? In other words, one can be shocked since there is such a disparity between what the Church teaches and the behavior of one who has taken a Sacramental vow to uphold and administer the teachings and Sacraments. Has there been some kind of metamorphosis, growing from the caterpillar in the cocoon into the butterfly? Alternately, are they saying that the Catholic Church has a history of this, and this is more of the same… in which case I wonder why they would somehow be shocked and have nothing to say, when heretofore they have had more than enough to say in this regard.

 

[reff]

Sir, or Ma’am…That statement is so erroneous…its hysterical. You are foisting or believing what is known as “revisionist history”.

At “best” the United States was founded on Judeo-Christian Principles. Not “protestant”!

Might be that you need to spend some time studying US History and discover precisely who came to our shores first and exactly why they did. I’ll give you the lead in… They were fleeing from Protestants!! You can take it from there.

And on top of it all…you may wish to delve further into the facts that several of the “founding fathers” of this country and signers of the Constitution were “Deists”…

Please be accurate.

AMEN my friend!!!

 

[distracted]

Yes I now full well you no comprendo…thats exactly the point… Am I the pope? no…ut that statement shows how you are controlled, that only a pope can think and speak on these things.

that makes me laugh. You obvously haven’t read that one Thread i posted some time ago… where i discuss the issue of priests being allowed to marry… I think it is under Non-Catholic religions… I made a mistake when i posted, should have put it elsewhere… but anyway…