How My View on Gay Marriage Changed

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epan said:
Sure. Money lending, anti-semitisicm. divorce (annulment)… The Catholic Church has lagged behind society, and behind or ahead of other denominations, on these topics. Is not the explicit rejection of anti-semiticm in Vatican 2 not an issue of contention with a splinter group of Catholics, which the Holy Father is trying to reconcile with?
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Explain Money lending
Anti-semitiscism
Divorce

What is the splinter group you speak of?

Thank you
 
epan said:
No, more like automatic spelling correction on one of a number of Apple devices which come up with rather interesting, and sometimes frustrating “spell check” corrections as one types.

I’m bemused by the claims that the Catholic Church does not change its doctrine over time. Students of history disagree. Theologians disagree. This seems to be a hot topic with Benedict XVI. I know that he puts great store in immutability.
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Students of history are often wrong on these internal matters, because they fail to understand radical distinctions between doctrine and discipline, between doctrine and practice, and between doctrine and the language about that doctrine. Ditto for theologians, who have often been in error about that, including modern theologians, some of whom try to equate an explanation of a doctrine with the doctrine itself

Doctrine is merely official teaching of the Church. It is not capable of being changed because it is based on what we consider moral absolutes and theological absolutes. (Jesus Christ was not formerly a mere man but now defined as God; salvation, redemption, and other concepts have permanent meaning, applicable for all time, no matter how many Church councils are convened.)
 
epan said:
I’m bemused by the claims that the Catholic Church does not change its doctrine over time. Students of history disagree. Theologians disagree. This seems to be a hot topic with Benedict XVI. I know that he puts great store in immutability.
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Give some citations to prove your position.
 
TheTrueCentrist said:
But we were not talking about whether or not states allowed gay marriage. We were talking about whether or not people would say “the same” about gay marriage as we are currently saying about pedophile marriages. “The same” would be that people believed there was some serious legal impediment to legalization of gay marriage (beyond a simple law against gay marriage.)
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I don’t know your age, but I clearly remember a time when sodomy was considered sexual assault; it was not legal, and the concept of homosexual marriages was unthinkable - how could people be “married” who could only assault each other, and not have normal sex? I am only 51 years old; this isn’t ancient history.
in the case of pedophile marriage, the age of consent would have to be lowered to ridiculously young ages (lower even than countries with a more tolerant attitude towards that sort of thing) and children would have to be bound by contracts
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Sodomy was once considered just as repugnant as sex with children is, today.
in the case of incest marriage, the genetic harm done to the offspring is sufficient to render a ban on the practice. I have admitted that there might be exceptions for demonstrably infertile couples.
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There is always abortion or infanticide for those born defective … (speaking as devil’s advocate) - in any case, incest was not illegal in certain cases, even in the early 20th century - and Hutterites still engage in the practice today.
 
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