How to combat Atheism?

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Oh, PUKE! What is it about atheists? Why are they always such pompous sophists? I swear, every time I come up against these guys they act as though we should be giving them six-hour footrubs in honor of their intellects.

Why are you here, bud? To convert us? I seriously doubt it–or that you could. I think you’re here merely to preen. Idea: why don’t you step away from the mirror for a little bit and try to engage us in a real discussion instead of sermonizing about your alleged brilliance? Sound good?

Good.
 
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reelguy227:
I have a question, does anyone know how to combat atheists
I am an atheist and somebody who wants to combat me is an enemy. You lose by default. That was easy, wasn’t it? Rethink your approach and perhaps you’ll fare better.

With regards to an honest discussion, this thread is already too toxic…
 
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montanaman:
Oh, PUKE! What is it about atheists? Why are they always such pompous sophists? I swear, every time I come up against these guys they act as though we should be giving them six-hour footrubs in honor of their intellects. .
There’s an old saying: “Misery loves company”

I wonder if these atheists realize just how much they seem like raving lunatics.

Oh well, just let them get it out of their system. They’re like teenagers that need to rebel before they become mature.
 
One of the problems (especially on forums) seems to be that Catholics often to point out a particular atheist who happens to be a jerk and say: “See what awful people atheists are” And atheists look at a particular Catholic who doesn’t take the same approach to solving problems as he or she does and say “Look, these theists are incoherent.”

Then the herd mentality of us against them kicks in …

and heck that’s probably why I won’t be around this forum much longer … the atmosphere, as an earlier poster pointed out, tends to get toxic. There are healthier ways to spend my time.
 
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DuMaurier:
There’s an old saying: “Misery loves company”

I wonder if these atheists realize just how much they seem like raving lunatics.

Oh well, just let them get it out of their system. They’re like teenagers that need to rebel before they become mature.
Please let me get this straight. It is your intent to convert atheists to Cathlicism?
 
In regard to the question originally asked, I think the best thing you can do is to be a good person. Be kind, be charitable - stand out. There must be something different about you - you must try to reflect truth, beauty, adn goodness.

Assuming the people you are dealing with are seekers of truth and not just asking you questions to ruffle you up, I would just start giving them books and articles to read. Bombard them with all that these is out there - and read it your self. You can copy Aquinas’ proof’s for God’s existence (use the pocket Aquinas since striaght Aquinas can be difficult.) If the person is into science, get the books on Quantum Physics and the Mind of God. Pascal’s wager is a also a classic. If you need more specific titles, let me know and I will be glad to help.

RE porn, that is not the root problem. I would try to understand what underlies the desire/need for porn and try that angle. But, obviously, imho the worst thing about porn is the objectification of everyone involved. If someone can’t see that, they probably have other issues. You can only be charitable and answer their questions. Perhaps they will come around.

If people really want the truth, they will find it.

And a last thought, I am really sad to see some uncharitable things said on this thread. The hostility is really not necessary. May we all be looking for truth and not looking to just stir the pot. Kindness goes a long way, as does intellectual honesty.
 
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montanaman:
Oh, PUKE! What is it about atheists? Why are they always such pompous sophists? I swear, every time I come up against these guys they act as though we should be giving them six-hour footrubs in honor of their intellects.

Why are you here, bud? To convert us? I seriously doubt it–or that you could. I think you’re here merely to preen. Idea: why don’t you step away from the mirror for a little bit and try to engage us in a real discussion instead of sermonizing about your alleged brilliance? Sound good?

Good.
I absolutely love your honest self-expression! It’s very admirable. I much rather discuss religion with a “theist” who assesses honestly and openly rather than with a “theist” who has the audacity to think that he can rationally defend the indefensible.

And, it is true that most atheists are rather pompous, however, you must understand that our pomposity is philosophically justified. Imagine that you live in a world where everyone believes in goblins and dragons that can turn acorns into theologians … Then, and only then, shall you necessarily understand me well.
 
Scott Waddell:
When people think of God, people think of a supernatural being who is presumed to exist outside of the natural universe, and not the sub-atomic reality, which is composed of matter. No atheist equates the sub-atomic reality with God; that is very misleading, as it abuses the term God. Atheists desginate God with nothingness, since the term means nothing. You’re thinking of an absurd philosophical position known as pantheism–not atheism.
 
the forum yu guys should join is on a website called swbattlefront.net ,click on forums and then click on sliced tauntaun .HELP everyone ,im being eaten alive by them ,there are two questions they always ask and I cant answer them ,maybe a better more knowledgable Catholic can .here they are

1.How do yu prove God exists? if it cannot be proven ,it does not exist. how do i answer that question ?

2.this next question is copied and pasted in their own words:

How can an all-powerfull, loing and caring God let so many people suffer?

Either he isn’t all powerful, or not loving and caring…

how do i answer that question also? help everybody yu really got to come on these forums and help.
 
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reelguy227:
the forum yu guys should join is on a website called swbattlefront.net ,click on forums and then click on sliced tauntaun .HELP everyone ,im being eaten alive by them ,there are two questions they always ask and I cant answer them ,maybe a better more knowledgable Catholic can .here they are

1.How do yu prove God exists? if it cannot be proven ,it does not exist. how do i answer that question ?

2.this next question is copied and pasted in their own words:

How can an all-powerfull, loing and caring God let so many people suffer?

Either he isn’t all powerful, or not loving and caring…

how do i answer that question also? help everybody yu really got to come on these forums and help.
Or you could bone up on some of these things and try again in a few years … learn some philosophy, talk to some real life atheists. Don’t try to combat them as enemies. Try to interact with them as ‘neighbours’. Leave the converting to God.
 
I absolutely love your honest self-expression! It’s very admirable. I much rather discuss religion with a “theist” who assesses honestly and openly rather than with a “theist” who has the audacity to think that he can rationally defend the indefensible.
And, it is true that most atheists are rather pompous, however, you must understand that our pomposity is philosophically justified. Imagine that you live in a world where everyone believes in goblins and dragons that can turn acorns into theologians … Then, and only then, shall you necessarily understand me well.
Glad you like it. Sarcasm is my greatest gift, though it hasn’t paid off very well yet.

Seriously, though, the condescension doesn’t do anyone any good. And keep in mind that while our beliefs and “proofs” seem insane, you might misunderstand us so fundamentally any understanding of our beliefs is impossible.
 
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DuMaurier:
There’s an old saying: “Misery loves company”

I wonder if these atheists realize just how much they seem like raving lunatics.

Oh well, just let them get it out of their system. They’re like teenagers that need to rebel before they become mature.
When discussing atheism, many religionists adopt the following procedural rule: if all else fails, psychologize. If you cannot defeat the atheist in the realm of ideas, become his therapist: sympathize with him, inform him of his buried psychological problems that lead to his rejection of god. And, above all, assure him that fulfillment and happiness await him at his neigborhood church.

A philosopher speaks of “the natural desire for god,” which, if not fulfilled, “leads to utter fustration.” Another philosopher asserts that, if men decide not to believe in god, “in sofar as they are intelligent they are saddened by their decision,” because a godless world “would be strikingly short of joy.” Fulton Sheen tells us happiness “is an ascension from what is inferior within us to what is its superior, from our egotism to our god.” One theologian has gone so far as to state that the phrase “the godless man” involves a contradiction.
For instance:
“To be a man is to fear god” . . . . God, who is the Author of nature, is integral to the nature of man. Therefore, the man who does not fear god somehow does not exist, and his nature is somehow not human. On the other hand, there he is. That is the problem.

To be an atheist is suddenly to be less than a human being–to be an enigma, a walking paradox, a psychological problem. As one theist puts it, “Unbelief is an interruption in development.” Mental health, asserts a psychologist, “demands good interpersonal relations with oneself, with others, and with God”–which, observes Thomas Szasz, “neatly places all atheists in the class of the mentally sick.”

These assertions deserve little comment, but it is interesting to note the appaling standard that is used in assessing the relationship between atheism and happiness. If the atheist is unhappy, this is attributed to his lack of belief. By relating happiness to an intimate connection with god, the “happy atheist” is defined out of existence.
 
The usual pattern for linking god and happiness is as follows: every human being naturally desires the good, the object of happiness. God is the ultimate, self-subsisting good. Therefore, every person naturally desires god as a corollary of his nature as a human being. Happiness divorced from god is a contradiction in terms.

From this dubious line of thought, we have the further conclusion that the atheist is struggling with fustrating internal conflicts. He desires happiness but, by denying god, he denies himself happiness. The atheist is somehow waging a war against himself, against his nature–and this makes him neurotic, if not schizophrenic.

This theological psychology is Freudianism in reverse. While religionists have become annoyed with the attempts of psychologists to reduce theism to neurotic motivations, these theists do not hesitate to employ the same technique to their advantage against atheists. When the theist announces his belief in a supernatural being, he is usually taken at his word. When the atheist announces his disbelief in a god, however, he is often confronted with : “Oh, not really!” Or: “I’m sorry that you’re so unhappy.” Or: “I hope that your negative attitude toward life will change.”

The atheist also finds his disbelief analyzed with reference to his age: If the atheist is young, his disbelief is attributed to youthful rebellion and immaturity–a “phase” that will hopefully pass. If the atheist is middle-aged, his disbelief is traced to the fustration of daily routine, the bitterness of failure, or the alienation from oneself and one’s fellow man. In the atheist is old, the explanation lies in the disillusionment, cynicism and loneliness that sometimes accompany one’s later years.

Contrary to what many theists would like to believe, atheism is not a form of neurotic rebellion or mental illness. The religionist cannot rid the world of atheists by committing them to an isolated asylum where they can be ignored. To label atheism as a psychological problem is a feeble, almost laughable attempt to evade the fundamental questions of truth and falsity. Is theism true? What reasons are there for believing in a god? These are the important issues, and these are the issues to which the theist must address himself if he wishes to confront the challenge of atheism.

Furthermore, there is a gross dishonesty involved in offering happiness as a motivation for believing in god. Theists who appeal to happiness as a reward for belief display a shocking disregard for intellectuality and the pursuit of truth. Even if theism did lead to happiness (which it does not), this would not demonstrate its correctness. The psychologizing of atheism, therefore, is irrelevant to the subject of theism versus atheism. The theist who attempts to defeat atheism by subordinating truth to emotionalism accomplishes nothing, aside from revealing his contempt for man’s ability to think.
 
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reelguy227:
still no one has told me how to answer those three questions?
A starting point might be to read the book that was suggested. Discover an answer that makes sense to you. Then, once you’re ready, try to articulate it to others.

These are things that aren’t easy to answer. There are lots of proposed answers out there, though. Take some time to think about them.

No rush.
 
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reelguy227:
still no one has told me how to answer those three questions?
Sigh. Please do your own homework. Even if I were on your side, it would be intellectually and ethically dishonest to spoonfeed you answers. Now I’m almost tempted to post a link to this thread in the forum you indicated.
 
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reelguy227:
the forum yu guys should join is on a website called swbattlefront.net ,click on forums and then click on sliced tauntaun .HELP everyone ,im being eaten alive by them ,there are two questions they always ask and I cant answer them ,maybe a better more knowledgable Catholic can .here they are

1.How do yu prove God exists? if it cannot be proven ,it does not exist. how do i answer that question ?

2.this next question is copied and pasted in their own words:

How can an all-powerfull, loing and caring God let so many people suffer?

Either he isn’t all powerful, or not loving and caring…

how do i answer that question also? help everybody yu really got to come on these forums and help.
Reply:
  1. Proof is required for those that would reject God anyway. God would have to continually prove Himself billions of times over since we all think our intellect is greater than the next person and “God must prove Himself to me”. God is revealed to a person from within. It is personal revelation that combines intellect, emotion, and faith. And faith in God is the fruit of belief.
2 Suffering is a complex topic with much written about it. Understanding it must begin with an acceptance that God exists and that He has a plan for ALL THINGS. And some plans are unknowable. Additionaly, immence temporal suffering is miniscule compared to the eternal glory in heaven. If we were god we would eliminate suffering but God knows better and permits it. He has a purpose that is His to know.

I enjoy Mere Christianity when reflecting on these topics. Keep patient witnessing active and be assured that God is working on the hearts of those that don’t believe in Him. We all are on our spiritual journey. Even when they don’t believe in a spirit!

Chuck
 
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