How to counteract local Protestant evangelism crusades?

[posh6921]

Hmmm…

I think someone pointed out earlier that we shouldn’t condemn others who have at least some of the Truth. The problem is that they don’t have the fullness of truth. And while whatever truth they believe can still save them, how much better would it be to live in the fullness of truth while living in this life?

That being said, I do know that sometimes calling the Catholic Church “the one true religion” can feel condescending to people who don’t believe that, so in that regard I watch my tongue.

When we evangelize, we want to do what we can to turn people on to Catholicism. Although sometimes saying that the Catholic Church is the one true religion to people who are looking for a church that claims that, but for a lot of people I know, they believe that claiming that a particular religion as the “one truth” is arrogant and it just leaves them more reason to believe that Catholics are naive and stick their heads in a hole.

Certainly if anyone asks, we should say, “Yes, it is the fullness of truth,” but it might not be the first thing that should come out of your mouth when talking to a non-Catholic.

 

[posh6921]

Hmmm…

I think someone pointed out earlier that we shouldn’t condemn others who have at least some of the Truth. The problem is that they don’t have the fullness of truth. And while whatever truth they believe can still save them, how much better would it be to live in the fullness of truth while living in this life?

That being said, I do know that sometimes calling the Catholic Church “the one true religion” can feel condescending to people who don’t believe that, so in that regard I watch my tongue.

When we evangelize, we want to do what we can to turn people on to Catholicism. Although sometimes saying that the Catholic Church is the one true religion to people who are looking for a church that claims that, but for a lot of people I know, they believe that claiming that a particular religion as the “one truth” is arrogant and it just leaves them more reason to believe that Catholics are naive and stick their heads in a hole.

Certainly if anyone asks, we should say, “Yes, it is the fullness of truth,” but it might not be the first thing that should come out of your mouth when talking to a non-Catholic.

By “fullness” of truth, I assume you mean something like: The CChurch has more truth than any other Church. You should be aware, however, that the word “fullness” (pleroma gk) has important theological implications. Christ is the fullness of the Godhead and therefore, the fullness of Truth, bodily. He who has received Christ, by faith, through grace has the fullness of truth in him. Compare Col. 2:9 with Eph. 3:16.

Sometimes Catholics use language in reference to the Church or aspects of it, that should be reserved for God alone.

 

[Katrina5]

First, nobody is “deceiving local Catholics in to believing in Protestantism.” They are just doing what they sincerely believe is their part in fulfilling the Great Commission of Christ to “go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit…”

Second, how sure are you that they are “fundamentalists”? Not all Protestants/Evangelicals are fundamentalists. I myself take offense at being called a fundamentalist. It has a certain negative ring to it.

Fundamentalist hasn’t always had a negative ring to it. My Fundamentalist friends are proud to call themselves that, and call themselves “Bible Believing Christians”. They believe in the fundamentals of their faith, which is the Bible alone, grace alone, and “being saved” through being born again of the spirit, not water. They believe I don’t know scripture, and no amount of quoting it gets anywhere.
They know about twenty quotes, which they take out of context, and they don’t know that Luther edited the Bible. They don’t know who King James was, and don’t care.

As for the word “evangelical”, that now has a protestant connotation to it, which is too bad. We are all called to evangelize.

Things got worse after the “ecumenical” council when that word came to mean we had to become more protestant in our ways. We did stupid things like take the Blessed Sacrament out of the sanctuary, removed statues, and lost the reverence we once had for our sacred space. Thankfully, we are beginning to get some of this back.

I am tired of arguing with fundamentalists, though, because that word has come to mean “militantly ignorant.”
So I try to do what Christ told us: love them, even if they don’t love us.

 

[tweetymom]

Unfortunately, I seriously doubt that any Protestant church in my area is going to allow the Catholic Church in my area to set up a tent or booth or whatever to distribute Catholic material.

First, these people are deceiving local Catholics in to believing in Protestantism whether they intend to deceive or not.

Second, I am sure that the church I had in mind when I made the original post is a fundamentalist church because they openly admit to being a fundamentalist church.

Why don’t you set up a booth in your church yard and give out info about your church? Why would you want to counteract anyone trying to save people?

 

[Bengoshi]

Fundamentalist hasn’t always had a negative ring to it. My Fundamentalist friends are proud to call themselves that, and call themselves “Bible Believing Christians”. They believe in the fundamentals of their faith, which is the Bible alone, grace alone, and “being saved” through being born again of the spirit, not water. They believe I don’t know scripture, and no amount of quoting it gets anywhere.
They know about twenty quotes, which they take out of context, and they don’t know that Luther edited the Bible. They don’t know who King James was, and don’t care.

As for the word “evangelical”, that now has a protestant connotation to it, which is too bad. We are all called to evangelize.

Things got worse after the “ecumenical” council when that word came to mean we had to become more protestant in our ways. We did stupid things like take the Blessed Sacrament out of the sanctuary, removed statues, and lost the reverence we once had for our sacred space. Thankfully, we are beginning to get some of this back.

I am tired of arguing with fundamentalists, though, because that word has come to mean “militantly ignorant.”
So I try to do what Christ told us: love them, even if they don’t love us.

Well, I feel sorry that the “fundamentalists” think that way… That’s why I don’t consider myself or our church to be fundamentalists, because we study other stuff relating to the Bible as well, including church history.

 

[Karmartia]

Productions like “Heaven’s Gates and Hell’s Flames” have a long history of using hokey scare tactics to coerce people into quick conversions that rarely take root. That’s not good evangelization and has no place in the modern Church.

 

[Bengoshi]

Productions like “Heaven’s Gates and Hell’s Flames” have a long history of using hokey scare tactics to coerce people into quick conversions that rarely take root. That’s not good evangelization and has no place in the modern Church.

The thing is, it should not stop there. The people who signified their faith in Christ should be followed-up so that they could really be discipled. That’s what small groups and 1 to 1 discipleship is for. Otherwise, you are correct, the conversions will not take root. A good book on this paradigm with the same name is “Sticky Church” by Larry Osborne.

“Sticky Church” is the new paradigm for what has been called “assimilation," retention," or “closing the back door.”

A Sticky Church is a church that no one wants to leave!

StickyChurch.com is a community that is here to help your church be more effective in building authentic relationships with your visitors and attendees. It is our goal to help you deepen those important connections so people will STICK to your church and to the Lord.

 

[Holly3278]

Why don’t you set up a booth in your church yard and give out info about your church? Why would you want to counteract anyone trying to save people?

Ummm maybe because they are not really saving people but instead are just unwittingly deceiving them?

 

[Holly3278]

The thing is, it should not stop there. The people who signified their faith in Christ should be followed-up so that they could really be discipled. That’s what small groups and 1 to 1 discipleship is for. Otherwise, you are correct, the conversions will not take root. A good book on this paradigm with the same name is “Sticky Church” by Larry Osborne.

“Sticky Church” is the new paradigm for what has been called “assimilation," retention," or “closing the back door.”

A Sticky Church is a church that no one wants to leave!

StickyChurch.com is a community that is here to help your church be more effective in building authentic relationships with your visitors and attendees. It is our goal to help you deepen those important connections so people will STICK to your church and to the Lord.

Okay, please note that what I am about to type is nothing but me being silly.

Personally, I don’t think I’d want to join a “sticky” church. I think I’d rather be able to get up from my pew and leave at the end of the service with ease rather than with difficulty because the pews are sticky!

 

[tweetymom]

Ummm maybe because they are not really saving people but instead are just unwittingly deceiving them?

And you know this because?

 

[Katrina5]

I don’t know about calling a church “sticky”, but I see the point. If I feel the Real Presence of Jesus, know that he is there in the Blessed Sacrament, and feel his love and the love of the people there, I don’t want to leave.
Being scared into going to mass, scared into saying I’m a Christian is just backwards. Yes, we should be afraid and awed by God, and the Ten Commandments are all what NOT to do, but Jesus told us to love God with our whole hearts and love our neighbors as ourselves.
Who wouldn’t want to be a part of that?

The plays and hell nights that are being discussed here are to “put the fear of hell” into young people. They are given an opportunity to accept Christ, then sent on to the next room where they are scared again. They are locked in, and given one more chance, then told they are going to hell when they don’t make that commitment.

The documentary I saw about this had some Catholic teens who were defending their faith in the back of the building and doing a good job of it, even though it was not a nice argument. They were angry, and so were the adult leaders of the event. One teen said, “If it wasn’t for the Catholic church you people wouldn’t even HAVE a Bible!”
I think they kicked him out at that point, and he was angry because there was a $7 charge for attending this, didn’t know exactly what it was, since it was billed as an “alternate Halloween party.”

The documentary I saw is called Hell House, made in 2001. I would recommend it to anyone with children or teens, especially “vulnerable” kids who aren’t in a Catholic school, have protestant friends who may try to influence them, or have friends who aren’t in a church and would be sucked in by this. And of course, uncatechized kids who think this “party” would be fun.

I would recommend it for everyone who has an interest in this subject, particularly the person who started this thread.

 

[ccolley]

Hi everyone. Although it is now too late to act on this, a local independent fundamentalist Baptist church in my area recently held a play every night for three nights called “Heavens Gates and Hells Flames”. This is a fundamentalist Protestant evangelism play. They receive many “commitments to Christ” through this prayer and even a few baptisms. This is all well and good but I am concerned that they may be deceiving local Catholics in to believing in Protestantism. What can one do to mitigate the influence of such Protestant evangelism crusades against the Catholic population in one’s area?

1Peter3:15 “Always be ready to give a reason for the hope that is within you, but do it with gentleness and reverence, keeping your conscience clear.”

I am of the opinion that Catholics need to be more vigorous in their attempts to Evangelize. Vatican II’s Decree on the Apostolate of the Laity exhorts us to do just that. Perhaps we can learn from our Protestant Brethren here.

Catholic churches often have these kinds of “Missions” but they do them infrequently and they typically don’t actively invite non-Catholics to them. There are literally thousands of misunderstandings that non-Catholics have about Catholics. You could arrange to get a speaker for your own “Missions” and then invite non-Catholics to them. Topics could include: “What Catholics really believe about Mary”, " Do Catholics pray to the dead?", “The Rosary: Rote prayer or Real prayer?”

In recent history, Catholics have tended to “take the high road” and not try to proselytize. This has led to some non-Catholics taking up the proselytization banner and has led (perhaps unintentionally) to the creation of anti-Catholic websites and organizations such as “the conversion center” and “Mission to Catholics” as well as Jack Chick’s ridiculous drivel. I recently came across a website that asserts that the Catholic church “changed” the day of the Lord from Saturday to Sunday for purely Satanic reasons. While these websites may have “good intentions” they are promoting misinformation and outright lies…thereby eroding the faith of Catholics who may be badly or under-catechized. We first need solid adult catechesis for ALL Catholics, secondly we need to increase our evangelization efforts and third we need to take advantage of every opportunity to correct misinformation that is being spread about the Catholic faith.

I personally would like to see Catholics evangelizing door to door…imagine a family that is sitting around the dinner table and there a knock on the door…the kid answers and then comes back in and says…“Dad, the Catholics are back.”

Pax Christi,
CC
[SIGN] I love my Papal Papa! [/SIGN]

 

[Katrina5]

1Peter3:15 “Always be ready to give a reason for the hope that is within you, but do it with gentleness and reverence, keeping your conscience clear.”

I am of the opinion that Catholics need to be more vigorous in their attempts to Evangelize. Vatican II’s Decree on the Apostolate of the Laity exhorts us to do just that. Perhaps we can learn from our Protestant Brethren here.

Catholic churches often have these kinds of “Missions” but they do them infrequently and they typically don’t actively invite non-Catholics to them. There are literally thousands of misunderstandings that non-Catholics have about Catholics. You could arrange to get a speaker for your own “Missions” and then invite non-Catholics to them. Topics could include: “What Catholics really believe about Mary”, " Do Catholics pray to the dead?", “The Rosary: Rote prayer or Real prayer?”

In recent history, Catholics have tended to “take the high road” and not try to proselytize. This has led to some non-Catholics taking up the proselytization banner and has led (perhaps unintentionally) to the creation of anti-Catholic websites and organizations such as “the conversion center” and “Mission to Catholics” as well as Jack Chick’s ridiculous drivel. I recently came across a website that asserts that the Catholic church “changed” the day of the Lord from Saturday to Sunday for purely Satanic reasons. While these websites may have “good intentions” they are promoting misinformation and outright lies…thereby eroding the faith of Catholics who may be badly or under-catechized. We first need solid adult catechesis for ALL Catholics, secondly we need to increase our evangelization efforts and third we need to take advantage of every opportunity to correct misinformation that is being spread about the Catholic faith.

I personally would like to see Catholics evangelizing door to door…imagine a family that is sitting around the dinner table and there a knock on the door…the kid answers and then comes back in and says…“Dad, the Catholics are back.”

Pax Christi,
CC
[SIGN] I love my Papal Papa! [/SIGN]

I love your scenario!
My sister lives in a diocese that actually does the door to door. They go in pairs, a man and woman to be on the safe side. They are very gentle and kind, and have mostly gotten ex-Catholics back into the church.

It helps to have some pamphlets or “tracts”. In fact, I think some Chick-like booklets would be nice. Maybe I’ll work on that.

There is so much anti-Catholicism that is based on misinformation.

When I did St Vincent dePaul home visits, we got to do a little of this. Many people didn’t even know we were Catholics. My partner would say, “Well, we’re not supposed to protestantize, you know”
He meant “proselytize”.

 

[poetryforjesus]

I agree that Catholics MUST be more vigorous in evangelization. O how I wish I was reached by a Catholic before I was reached by the protestants!!!

A lot of people love the line “preach always, and use words if necessary.” This is a quote by St. Francis and certainly true. But I’d love to see a stronger desire in every Catholic to become a defender and preacher of the faith. Look at the world and see how much the truth, not just part of it but the whole truth, needs to be proclaimed. There is something wrong if the Catholic Church, who has the fullest truth revealed by God and the fullest blessings provided by God, is in the shadow compared to other christians when it comes to evangelization.

 

[mark_a]

fkjuliano’s point is well taken. To reject the Catholic Church is to reject the body of Christ and that’s a bad place for a Christian to be.

As a Catholic living in the deep south, it has been my experience, that to be Baptist is to be seriously misinformed about what Catholicsim is, what it teaches and what Catholics believe. Many Baptists and other Evangelicals sincerly want to bring souls to salvation but they do so aggressively and are very good at what they do.

We shouldn’t hold ill thoughts for them as individuals but their Church is teaching the word of God incorrectly. The individual members of the Baptist Church need to be firmly and confidently told that what they are teaching is wrong when they get agressive with Catholics.

As to evangelization, wishing won’t do anything. I find Catholics almost apologetic when asked where they go to Church. Being enthusiastic about your faith is a big first step and it has a wonderful effect.

Catholics have to view any attempt to remove people from the Church as anti-catholic. Catholics who are knowlegeable about the teachings of the Church, who know the biblical basis for Catholic doctrine and who are mature enough to be able to argue without getting angry and insulted bear a special responsibility to defend the faith. I take this responsibility seriously and wish I was better at it.

I sometimes invite Protestants to try to talk me out of Catholicism.It is not wrong to walk up to a group of people and say, “You know, I heard you talking about Catholicism. I’m Catholic and what you said about such-and-such is not what the Church teaches.”

In response to the original post, it may be enough to point out that the Church teaches that associating with Churches and attending events which teach docrines contrary to the Catholic faith is a sin.

-Tim-

Extremely well put. Thanks!

 

[posh6921]

AMEN!

We are the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church.
The True Church.

“One” does not mean, “1”. Any more than God is 1, numerically. The Catholic Church is a physical orgsanization with a spiritual organism. “Catholic” is not synonomous with the Body of Christ.

 

[Big_Dummy]

independent fundamentalist Baptist are well known for being King James Only and very anti-catholic. You may want to expose fellow Catholics to the superiority of modern translations, so that when someone tries to push an outdated translation they will culturally run away.

 

[Holly3278]

Fundamentalist hasn’t always had a negative ring to it. My Fundamentalist friends are proud to call themselves that, and call themselves “Bible Believing Christians”. They believe in the fundamentals of their faith, which is the Bible alone, grace alone, and “being saved” through being born again of the spirit, not water. They believe I don’t know scripture, and no amount of quoting it gets anywhere.
They know about twenty quotes, which they take out of context, and they don’t know that Luther edited the Bible. They don’t know who King James was, and don’t care.

As for the word “evangelical”, that now has a protestant connotation to it, which is too bad. We are all called to evangelize.

Things got worse after the “ecumenical” council when that word came to mean we had to become more protestant in our ways. We did stupid things like take the Blessed Sacrament out of the sanctuary, removed statues, and lost the reverence we once had for our sacred space. Thankfully, we are beginning to get some of this back.

I am tired of arguing with fundamentalists, though, because that word has come to mean “militantly ignorant.”
So I try to do what Christ told us: love them, even if they don’t love us.

I used to be a fundamentalist and I certainly wasn’t “militantly ignorant”. I knew who King James was (as did most people in my church), I didn’t quote scriptures out of context, and ecumenism was fine so long as we didn’t gang up with churches who diluted the gospel message by preaching a “gospel of works”. I now hate that term btw.

And you know this because?

Ummm, maybe because the Catholic Church is the one true Church and not some “Bible Believing” church. If you’re going to take up this topic, take it up in a different thread. I think I said this already but please stop hijacking my thread. I know you just dread the idea of a Catholic evangelism crusade to counter your fundie efforts to “save” people but I am not going to stop until I’m dead and even once I’m dead, I’ll continue to pray that the Church is spread throughout the world in Purgatory and in Heaven, if I make it there. I did not create this thread so anti-Catholic “believers in Jesus” could come and debate me. I created this thread so that Catholics could come and give me some suggestions and advice!

Oh, and aren’t you a former Catholic? Why did you commit the grave sin of schism then?

 

[Karmartia]

Ummm, maybe because the Catholic Church is the one true Church and not some “Bible Believing” church. If you’re going to take up this topic, take it up in a different thread. I think I said this already but please stop hijacking my thread. I know you just dread the idea of a Catholic evangelism crusade to counter your fundie efforts to “save” people but I am not going to stop until I’m dead and even once I’m dead, I’ll continue to pray that the Church is spread throughout the world in Purgatory and in Heaven, if I make it there. I did not create this thread so anti-Catholic “believers in Jesus” could come and debate me. I created this thread so that Catholics could come and give me some suggestions and advice!

Oh, and aren’t you a former Catholic? Why did you commit the grave sin of schism then?

Wow, that’s harsh. Let’s do the math. How many converts to Catholicism will you get using judgement and sarcasm? I keep coming up with zero.

 

[tweetymom]

I used to be a fundamentalist and I certainly wasn’t “militantly ignorant”. I knew who King James was (as did most people in my church), I didn’t quote scriptures out of context, and ecumenism was fine so long as we didn’t gang up with churches who diluted the gospel message by preaching a “gospel of works”. I now hate that term btw.

Ummm, maybe because the Catholic Church is the one true Church and not some “Bible Believing” church. If you’re going to take up this topic, take it up in a different thread. I think I said this already but please stop hijacking my thread. I know you just dread the idea of a Catholic evangelism crusade to counter your fundie efforts to “save” people but I am not going to stop until I’m dead and even once I’m dead, I’ll continue to pray that the Church is spread throughout the world in Purgatory and in Heaven, if I make it there. I did not create this thread so anti-Catholic “believers in Jesus” could come and debate me. I created this thread so that Catholics could come and give me some suggestions and advice!

Oh, and aren’t you a former Catholic? Why did you commit the grave sin of schism then?

I didn’t think you were supposed to call people names? I do not dread the idea of a Catholic evangelism crusade, it would be a great idea dear lady if it did happen. Oh and by the way I am not anti anything,

You really are full of yourself.God Bless you as you continue your journey with our Savior.