How to deal with Catholics who regard Church teaching as merely a suggestion?

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Dannel11 said:
It’s a tough situation. It makes me want to follow them around all day undoing the damage they are creating in the community, especially when people like that are around RCIA candidates.
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Remember that we are called to teach one another, but at the same time it is the work of the Holy Spirit. So, God does not expect you to clear up all the poor teachings that are expressed against the teachings of the Church.

Prayer is important for us. Pray that those in RCIA have the guidance of the Holy Spirit and trust in God. They will hear error about the Church for the rest of their lives. Pray they discern the Truth.

God bless you for your love of neighbor and Church.
:knight1:

Trust God to bring Truth to others through us, but not so much that you must correct it all.
 
Ophelia23 said:
Please let it be known that I absolutely agree with what you have said. I was only trying to state my father’s order of beliefs while emphasizing that he is a good man who should not be kicked out of the Church simply because his understanding is biased so strongly in one arena that all other issues are “not a matter of politics”, as he would say.
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I hope you did not think that my comment was directed at you 🙂 I also agree with you totally. Fr. Serpa answered in one of the latest “Ask an Apologist” questions in a wonderful way:
if people sincerely follow their consciences, whether their consciences are well informed or through not fault of their own they are not, they do not sin
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Something like this surely makes us think twice where before we thought we knew what we were doing. But I think only voting directly for Antichrist would be ground for excommunication 😃
 
So we, members of an Internet board, are now qualified to decide who should be excommunicated? Is that what I’m reading here?

Look, I get that we should speak to a friend if they are walking into danger, but I simply do not believe that instruction should go beyond suggesting strongly that they speak to their Priest/Confessor about the issue.
 
Seeker1961 said:
So we, members of an Internet board, are now qualified to decide who should be excommunicated? Is that what I’m reading here?
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I’m not sure who you are responding to, but I will assume it is me.

Please quit jumping to conclusions. I am not talking about condemnation, excommunication, judging people, or poking “Bad Catholics” with pointy sticks. What I am talking about is a cancer in our midst. The cancer of misinformation by Catholics who knowingly spread personal opinion as Catholic teaching.
Seeker1961 said:
Look, I get that we should speak to a friend if they are walking into danger, but I simply do not believe that instruction should go beyond suggesting strongly that they speak to their Priest/Confessor about the issue.
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That is one way to deal with it.
 
Dannel11 said:
At what point would it be responsible for someone to stop identifying themselves as a Catholic when they deviate from Church teaching?
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I say when they stop believing in the Nicene Creed, they are no longer Catholic. Short of that, they are “bad” Catholics.
 
Dannel11 said:
I have encountered more and more Catholics who regard Catholic teaching as a suggestion, meaning that if they don’t concur, it is okay to live differently and promote your brand of Catholicism. For example, I was speaking to someone recently, whom I would consider to be a very pious Catholic, that felt that abortion was okay if the baby was going to cause a financial hardship for the mother. A different person, also whom I would consider pious, stated that personal use of illegal recreational drugs was okay. In both of these instances the Catechism is very clear, but they just won’t accept it.

My opinion is that if you don’t agree with the Church’s teaching and want to live a different way, that is your choice. However, when you start teaching others either explicitly or by your actions that your way is an acceptable way to live as a Catholic, then I have a problem. Am I off base with this?

At what point would it be responsible for someone to stop identifying themselves as a Catholic when they deviate from Church teaching?
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Pray for them for they are clueless.

At this point the only thing that will wake up these types of catholics that you refer to- will be the Warning and the Permanent Miracle.

I imagen that a lot of catholics and christians alike will make a drastic change in the way they live their catholicism after the Warning and the Permanent Miracle.
 
Dannel11 said:
I have encountered more and more Catholics who regard Catholic teaching as a suggestion, meaning that if they don’t concur, it is okay to live differently and promote your brand of Catholicism. For example, I was speaking to someone recently, whom I would consider to be a very pious Catholic, that felt that abortion was okay if the baby was going to cause a financial hardship for the mother. A different person, also whom I would consider pious, stated that personal use of illegal recreational drugs was okay. In both of these instances the Catechism is very clear, but they just won’t accept it.

My opinion is that if you don’t agree with the Church’s teaching and want to live a different way, that is your choice. However, when you start teaching others either explicitly or by your actions that your way is an acceptable way to live as a Catholic, then I have a problem. Am I off base with this?

At what point would it be responsible for someone to stop identifying themselves as a Catholic when they deviate from Church teaching?
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You are off base. You basicly state you condemn people. You basicly state you disassociate with these people because of some flaw that they can’t be held up to your own personal light. It sounds like you are trying to cut out a disease. Even Jesus ate with sinners. Besides what are you and other people trying to do? Create a hive-mind mentality? So I’m some sort of Catholic puppet?

You feel a sense of injustice because of people who think off key; but you’re the one who is really unjust. You have to learn how to accept people for who they are. Who cares? What, are you some sort of Templar on a Crusade? Take people with ease. Not contempt.

The only people I have any sort of contempt for are people who sit on their pedestal judging other people for the smallest of marks.
 
Dannel11 said:
I have encountered more and more Catholics who regard Catholic teaching as a suggestion, meaning that if they don’t concur, it is okay to live differently and promote your brand of Catholicism. For example, I was speaking to someone recently, whom I would consider to be a very pious Catholic, that felt that abortion was okay if the baby was going to cause a financial hardship for the mother. A different person, also whom I would consider pious, stated that personal use of illegal recreational drugs was okay. In both of these instances the Catechism is very clear, but they just won’t accept it.

My opinion is that if you don’t agree with the Church’s teaching and want to live a different way, that is your choice. However, when you start teaching others either explicitly or by your actions that your way is an acceptable way to live as a Catholic, then I have a problem. Am I off base with this?

At what point would it be responsible for someone to stop identifying themselves as a Catholic when they deviate from Church teaching?
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This is very interesting to me for a variety of reasons, but recently I saw someone reply to another thread with a comment that I think you will find useful with your post. They used the phrase “I think that the person you are speaking about was not properly cathechized as they grew up in the Catholic faith”. This has made a lot of sense to me, I have seen things posted on here that I have never heard before regarding the Church and it’s rules and I am a cradle Catholic who went to Catholic grade school, high school and college. Somehow along the way I have missed quite a bit myself so I have found that having some patience with others is the right thing for me to do at this point. Our faith has a lot of rules that are non-negotiable and yet many people don’t realize that, we have to try to get that message out there.
 
Rocco6196 said:
Do we really have to take the bible literally ?
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Rocco6196 said:
Some parts seem a bit extreme
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Yes some parts of the Bible can seem extreme.
The Bible is a complex book, which is why we have the Church to help us - and she has given us the Catechism. 👍

For myself - as regards the bible, I look mainly at the NT… The Gospels. Contained in these is what Jesus want’s us to do and believe me…that’s enough to keep me busy for the remained of my life. 😃

Peace
James
 
Dannel11 said:
I’m not advocating ex-communication. The purpose of the question you responded to was to see if there is a visible line that can be crossed.

The intention of all these questions is to determine a way to deal with Judas. When a Catholic tells another Catholic it is okay for them to get an abortion if they are poor, we have a huge problem as a community. How do we deal with that?
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When Catholic A tells Catholic B that it is acceptable to obtain an abortion on the grounds of poverty, Catholic A is certainly guilty of conspiracy to commit murder, and probably guilty of heresy as well.
 
Sacred_Heart said:
You are off base. You basicly state you condemn people. You basicly state you disassociate with these people because of some flaw that they can’t be held up to your own personal light. It sounds like you are trying to cut out a disease. Even Jesus ate with sinners.
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Who am I condemning? I am asking how to deal with people who blatantly and knowingly deviate from the teachings of the Church to the detriment of the community.
Sacred_Heart said:
Besides what are you and other people trying to do?
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People like me are trying to promote the teachings of the Church.
Sacred_Heart said:
Create a hive-mind mentality? So I’m some sort of Catholic puppet?
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If you think that following the teachings of the Church is “hive-mind mentality” or being a “puppet” then perhaps you have some discernment to do yourself.
Sacred_Heart said:
You feel a sense of injustice because of people who think off key; but you’re the one who is really unjust. You have to learn how to accept people for who they are. Who cares? What, are you some sort of Templar on a Crusade?
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We should all be on a crusade to defend the faith. Every one of us. When we see people polluting the laity we need to do something.
Sacred_Heart said:
The only people I have any sort of contempt for are people who sit on their pedestal judging other people for the smallest of marks.
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Well, given the fact you placed me in some category of people who condemn and disassociate, neither of which I actually said, then I believe you are judging me. In addition, if you believe that advising someone that abortion is permissible if it is going to cause a financial hardship for the mother is the “smallest of marks”, then I fear you may be part of the problem.

Also, Bishop Malone recently said that Catholics who support “same-sex marriage” are being “unfaithful to Catholic doctrine” and that faithful Catholics should give no credence to groups such as “Catholics for Marriage Equality” or “Catholics for a Free Choice”.

Would you group me in the same category as the Bishop?
 
Dannel11 said:
I have encountered more and more Catholics who regard Catholic teaching as a suggestion, meaning that if they don’t concur, it is okay to live differently and promote your brand of Catholicism. For example, I was speaking to someone recently, whom I would consider to be a very pious Catholic, that felt that abortion was okay if the baby was going to cause a financial hardship for the mother. A different person, also whom I would consider pious, stated that personal use of illegal recreational drugs was okay. In both of these instances the Catechism is very clear, but they just won’t accept it.

My opinion is that if you don’t agree with the Church’s teaching and want to live a different way, that is your choice. However, when you start teaching others either explicitly or by your actions that your way is an acceptable way to live as a Catholic, then I have a problem. Am I off base with this?

At what point would it be responsible for someone to stop identifying themselves as a Catholic when they deviate from Church teaching?
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None of us are perfect. We are all sinners. Is it possible to consider any of what your saying as part of a slippery slope argument? I don’t think one Catholic should put themselves in a postion above another Catholic as we are all sinners. Let he who is without sin cast the first stone…

I think it’s good to have discussions about things like this, but I don’t think any of us are in a postion to pass a rule on behalf of the Catholic Faith. I know for myself that I have a hard enough time living according to the teachings of my Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ. I am not in a postion to start telling other people who are Catholic what they should and shouldn’t be doing. I think it might be best to ask what the bible has to say about such things. I, myself, do not know exactly what the bible has to say with respect to what you are asking and have enough trouble trying to be a good Catholic, a good husband, a good father, and a good son myself.

God Bless,
Bill
 
Wow, I guess my church , which I wont even mention , is allot more
accepting and less judgmental, they welcome everyone, even gays. as far as drugs go I don’t advocate the use of narcotics , but other than being illegal marijuana is less harmful
than alcohol and I see so many Catholics drinking , I guess we know pick and choose, like bingo isint a sin , it’s gambling plain English ,
Stop being so judgmental , your not god , and welcome sinners into our faith that’s who we really need to help
 
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