How to evangelize the Hindu culture??

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Please, I do not take any offense. You come across to me as a very nice person who cares very much. But putting that aside for the sake of our discussion, it just seems to me that your position has the potential to run itself out, as it has in history, to violence toward those who don’t accept that the Catholic Church is the only reservoir containing the whole truth. For example, what happened to the monks on Mt. Athos (1275-1282) for rejecting the authority of “The Church.” (orthodoxword.wordpress.com/2011/01/04/the-holy-martyrs-of-mount-athos-january-4th/.) This is just one of many sad examples of what “my way it the only way” kind of thinking can lead to. When you say, “only in Him subsists the fullness of truth…God’s only Word…only the Catholic Church…,” and you cement yourself to that position, aren’t you next going to say, because there is no other possibility, that when others saints outside of Catholicism claim to be speaking the Word of God, that they are liars? Personally, I reject that whole mess. It is not what love is about. I would rather spend my time figuring out how we can both be right.

I have spoken in the past of these two divine waves. Or, call them two different systems. There is certainly a very powerful ministry going on in the Catholic Church that cannot be denied and I find it very sweet and attractive. Like any system, it has its laws, Words, and you have also stated some of their beliefs. Out of love for Christ you accept this system as the only system, as noted above. You feel that it will deliver you to eternal life, accomplished for you by the mercy of Jesus. A Lexus or a Kia will both get you from point A to point B. But you will disagree with this, in spiritual terms. Only Jesus, only my Lexus. Of course this offends all the millions of Kia owners and offending is not loving. I acknowledge the differences but without offending. To me, that our two religions can exists is a great wonder and glory of God. It kind of goes against the rules, but this is what makes religion so cool. St. Joseph of Copertino approaches the altar to say Mass. He notices a statue of Mary and goes into ecstasy before the entire congregation. Then as everyone is watching, his body is magically lifted off the ground, where he remains floating for many many minutes. And this happens to him all the time. Completely against all rules of nature, but it happens. Neither you or I can deny this. I don’t know how it happens, but it does. How did Sor Maria de Jesus guide the Indian population in the 1600s to accept Christ? Spainish records tell us that back then, 60,000 plus American Indians became Catholics in and around the present-day city of San Angelo, Texas. She claims she bilocated to save the Indians around 500 times while cloistered in her convent in Agreda. How is any of this possible. Eyewitness tell us that Lord Chaitanya performed different miracles, just as amazing and wonderful. However we get it right, our eternal destiny is to serve God. Me, my own savior, yeah right.

I guess you are implying that this all fits me since your are mentioning it. Seems that way. The Vedas teach that there is a “place” called the spiritual world. This material world is nothing in comparison. And in this spiritual world there are countless planets. This spiritual world is called Vaikuntha (krishna.com/description-vaikuntha) This is the world of variegatedness without difference. What is generating all the waves that come crashing in on the beach? What is the force pushing them onto the shore? These are all the same in one sense (salt water), but yet different. God is the ultimate force. Nothing can exist without His authority. If a person is honest and takes the time to read both of our religions, He will accept both. My friend Alex is from Columbia. He grew up Catholic. My friend Chit, he grew up Catholic. We were all together with more than a dozen other friends at my house last Christmas expressing our love for Jesus. These friends of mine are great. Chit’s wife was raised Catholics. And any of us can also walk into a Hare Krsna temple anywhere in the world and worship Krsna. We all accept the inconceivableness of God. God preaches according to time and circumstance. So, OK, there can appear to be differences, but keep looking.
What does it mean to be a Hindu? Yours is an highly disorganized religion which doesn’t have even a bit of truth in it. The early Vedic people worshipped Indra, Rudra, Aruna, Varuna, Soma, Agni, Pushan, Prana , Mithra, Ashvins , Usha and other gods. They did not worshipped Krishna or Shiva. So why boast about some scriptures which you guys doesn’t really follow?
 
What does it mean to be a Hindu? Yours is an highly disorganized religion which doesn’t have even a bit of truth in it.
Pleroma, every religion has some degree of truth. That is a very unfair statement.
 
Yes, the pneumatic Christ.
‘Afterwards broke out the heretic Basilides. He affirms that there is a supreme Aeon, by name Abraxas, by whom was created Mind, which in Greek he calls Nous; that thence sprang the Word; that of Him issued Providence, Virtue, and Wisdom; that out of these subsequently were made Principalities, powers, and Angels; that there ensued infinite issues and processions of angels; that by these angels 365 heavens were formed, and the world, in honour of Abraxas, whose name, if computed, has in itself this number. Now, among the last of the angels, those who made this world, he places the God of the Jews latest, that is, the God of the Law and of the Prophets, whom he denies to be a God, but affirms to be an angel. To him, he says, was allotted the seed of Abraham, and accordingly he it was who transferred the sons of Israel from the land of Egypt into the land of Canaan; affirming him to be turbulent above the other angels, and accordingly given to the frequent arousing of seditions and wars, yes, and the shedding of human blood. Christ, moreover, he affirms to have been sent, not by this maker of the world, but by the above-named Abraxas; and to have come in a phantasm, and been destitute of the substance of flesh: that it was not He who suffered among the Jews, but that Simon was crucified in His stead: whence, again, there must be no believing on him who was crucified, lest one confess to having believed on Simon. Martyrdoms, he says, are not to be endured. The resurrection of the flesh he strenuously impugns, affirming that salvation has not been promised to bodies.’
-Tertullian
Two problems. First of all, this is Tutrullian’s description of the gnostic philosophy of the heretic Basilides. How does this in any way affirm your position? Secondly, do you even know the definition of “pneumatic”?

Definition of pneumatics (n) (Bing Dictionary)
  1. science of gases: the branch of physics dealing with the mechanical properties of air and other gases
Definition of pneumatic (adj) (Bing Dictionary)
  1. using compressed air: operated by compressed air in a tool or machine
  2. filled with air: filled with air, especially compressed air
  3. involving compressed gases: relating to, operated by, or typical of the pressure of compressed gases, especially air pressure or compressed air
Please explain what Christ has to do with compressed air? 🤷
Is this your forum?
No it is not and you do not have to provide an answer. I just asked you a question which I would have no trouble answering and so assumed that you wouldn’t either.
 
Please, I do not take any offense. You come across to me as a very nice person who cares very much. But putting that aside for the sake of our discussion, it just seems to me that your position has the potential to run itself out, as it has in history, to violence toward those who don’t accept that the Catholic Church is the only reservoir containing the whole truth.
I promise, I have no intention of causing any violence, so you can relax. 🙂 You are avoiding the point I have made repeatedly which is based purely on rational thought without regard to any particular belief. The point is that two contradicting and conflicting philosophies or beliefs cannot be simultaneously true. That is simply an objective truth. Will you please address this issue specifically while explaining how two or more religions can contain the fullness of truth while holding beliefs that conflict with the other?
For example, what happened to the monks on Mt. Athos (1275-1282) for rejecting the authority of “The Church.” (orthodoxword.wordpress.com/2011/01/04/the-holy-martyrs-of-mount-athos-january-4th/.) This is just one of many sad examples of what “my way it the only way” kind of thinking can lead to. When you say, “only in Him subsists the fullness of truth…God’s only Word…only the Catholic Church…,” and you cement yourself to that position, aren’t you next going to say, because there is no other possibility, that when others saints outside of Catholicism claim to be speaking the Word of God, that they are liars? Personally, I reject that whole mess. It is not what love is about. I would rather spend my time figuring out how we can both be right.
While I must say that the link you cited is more than a little bias and I don’t know enough about the event to really comment, yes, we have had many members of our Church who have violated its teachings, including popes and bishops.

But reb, do you really want to discuss our warts, because the Hindu culture has plenty of its own. Would you like to discuss Hindu violence in India against Muslims, Christians, Jews and Sikhs that still goes on today? Would you like to discuss the wonderful caste system? Why don’t we just stay on the topic at hand, okay?
A Lexus or a Kia will both get you from point A to point B.
But neither a Lexus nor a Kia will get you across the ocean. That requires a completely different vehicle and unless you get into that vehicle you will not make it. In terms of Christianity that vehicle is Christ; God himself, as compared to man. If you remain in your Lexus or Kia you will get to the shore, but you will never cross the ocean. As a Catholic, I am only inviting others to climb into the boat. It would not be loving of me to tell someone that they can cross the ocean in their car.
 
I promise, I have no intention of causing any violence, so you can relax. 🙂 You are avoiding the point…that two contradicting and conflicting philosophies or beliefs cannot be simultaneously true…please address this issue specifically while explaining how two or more religions can contain the fullness of truth while holding beliefs that conflict with the other?
Steve, I just don’t see the contradiction that you do. Let the saints of our religions speak. They both place the highest premium on love of God. How is it possible that they have reached this same opinion?
But neither a Lexus nor a Kia will get you across the ocean. That requires a completely different vehicle and unless you get into that vehicle you will not make it. In terms of Christianity that vehicle is Christ; God himself, as compared to man. If you remain in your Lexus or Kia you will get to the shore, but you will never cross the ocean. As a Catholic, I am only inviting others to climb into the boat. It would not be loving of me to tell someone that they can cross the ocean in their. car.
You are making a good point. I understand. Thank you.
 
Pleroma, every religion has some degree of truth. That is a very unfair statement.
There is truth in Vedism and Valentinianism but not in Hinduism and orthodox Christianity. I strongly criticize both Hindus and Christians for not following the things that exists in their own scriptures.
 
Two problems. First of all, this is Tutrullian’s description of the gnostic philosophy of the heretic Basilides. How does this in any way affirm your position? Secondly, do you even know the definition of “pneumatic”?

Definition of pneumatics (n) (Bing Dictionary)
  1. science of gases: the branch of physics dealing with the mechanical properties of air and other gases
Definition of pneumatic (adj) (Bing Dictionary)
  1. using compressed air: operated by compressed air in a tool or machine
  2. filled with air: filled with air, especially compressed air
  3. involving compressed gases: relating to, operated by, or typical of the pressure of compressed gases, especially air pressure or compressed air
Please explain what Christ has to do with compressed air? 🤷
Oh common don’t be such an ignoramus. A simple google search on the word ‘Pneumatic Christ’ returns loads of responses.

**‘Whoever receives this pneumatic baptism receives gnosis of who we were, what we have become…whence we came, from what we have been redeemed; what birth is and what rebirth’ **

As I said orthodox Christians will not receive this pneumatic baptism since they don’t even know about pneumatic Christ and do not even accept him.
 
Two problems. First of all, this is Tutrullian’s description of the gnostic philosophy of the heretic Basilides. How does this in any way affirm your position? Secondly, do you even know the definition of “pneumatic”?

Definition of pneumatics (n) (Bing Dictionary)
  1. science of gases: the branch of physics dealing with the mechanical properties of air and other gases
Definition of pneumatic (adj) (Bing Dictionary)
  1. using compressed air: operated by compressed air in a tool or machine
  2. filled with air: filled with air, especially compressed air
  3. involving compressed gases: relating to, operated by, or typical of the pressure of compressed gases, especially air pressure or compressed air
Please explain what Christ has to do with compressed air? 🤷
Just an FYI: Although I have no idea about the concept of the “pneumatic Christ” (though a Google search points to it being a Gnostic concept, and I believe the poster has stated that he follows Gnosticism, if I remember correctly), pneumatic in this context problem is referring to “pneuma”, which is Greek for “breath”, and obviously refers to the soul and/or spirit, and is used in the Bible. It is also used to refer to the Holy Spirit. The definition provided above is a contemporary understanding of the word, though it kind of points to the more ancient understanding of “air” or breath (I immediately think of the creation of Adam).

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pneuma
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pneumatic_%28Gnosticism%29
biblesuite.com/greek/4151.htm
biblestudytools.com/lexicons/greek/nas/pneuma.html
newadvent.org/cathen/14153a.htm
catholic.com/magazine/articles/the-divinity-of-the-holy-spirit
 
Pleroma, every religion has some degree of truth. That is a very unfair statement.
Coming from this guy it is not unfair at all. This guy is weird, really, really weird - one must expect such statements from him.

It is best to ignore him completely and hope he will go away (but don’t count on it).
 
Just an FYI: Although I have no idea about the concept of the “pneumatic Christ” (though a Google search points to it being a Gnostic concept, and I believe the poster has stated that he follows Gnosticism, if I remember correctly), pneumatic in this context problem is referring to “pneuma”, which is Greek for “breath”, and obviously refers to the soul and/or spirit, and is used in the Bible. It is also used to refer to the Holy Spirit. The definition provided above is a contemporary understanding of the word, though it kind of points to the more ancient understanding of “air” or breath (I immediately think of the creation of Adam).

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pneuma
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pneumatic_%28Gnosticism%29
biblesuite.com/greek/4151.htm
biblestudytools.com/lexicons/greek/nas/pneuma.html
newadvent.org/cathen/14153a.htm
catholic.com/magazine/articles/the-divinity-of-the-holy-spirit
Thank you for this, LW. I stand corrected. Guess I didn’t look far enough. The fact that it is a Gnostic concept makes a lot of sense in the context of this “discussion”.
 
Oh common don’t be such an ignoramus. A simple google search on the word ‘Pneumatic Christ’ returns loads of responses.

**‘Whoever receives this pneumatic baptism receives gnosis of who we were, what we have become…whence we came, from what we have been redeemed; what birth is and what rebirth’ **

As I said orthodox Christians will not receive this pneumatic baptism since they don’t even know about pneumatic Christ and do not even accept him.
My apologies, although I still don’t have a clue what you are talking about.
 
My apologies, although I still don’t have a clue what you are talking about.
The psychic Christ which you believe in is the son of the demiurge and he came in flesh and the pneumatic Christ which I believe in was sent by the Holy Father and he did not came in flesh for the body of Christ is not made of flesh.

Gnostic Religion in Antiquity

**“The Valentinians apparently infer from Romans 10:10 that Paul intends to discriminate between the psychic and the pneumatic faith. To the psychic he says that “if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord.” this verbal confession will suffice “for salvation.” To the pneumatic he adds that those who “believe in (their) hearts that God(the Father) has raised him from the dead” will recieve “justification”.”
  • The Gnostic Paul, Elaine Pagels**
 
The psychic Christ which you believe in is the son of the demiurge and he came in flesh and the pneumatic Christ which I believe in was sent by the Holy Father and he did not came in flesh for the body of Christ is not made of flesh.

Gnostic Religion in Antiquity

**“The Valentinians apparently infer from Romans 10:10 that Paul intends to discriminate between the psychic and the pneumatic faith. To the psychic he says that “if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord.” this verbal confession will suffice “for salvation.” To the pneumatic he adds that those who “believe in (their) hearts that God(the Father) has raised him from the dead” will recieve “justification”.”
  • The Gnostic Paul, Elaine Pagels**
Once again, Pleroma, I will pray for you. You have traded the truth for the lie of Gnosticism.
 
Once again, Pleroma, I will pray for you. You have traded the truth for the lie of Gnosticism.
I have no obligation to give any justification for my beliefs. The truth is out there for anyone who seriously studies the world religions. I will pray for Hindus and Christians so that they can come out of this delusion that they have created for themselves. There is no truth in Hinduism and orthodox Christianity and these religions are not going to stay for too long, it will perish soon.
 
I have no obligation to give any justification for my beliefs. The truth is out there for anyone who seriously studies the world religions. I will pray for Hindus and Christians so that they can come out of this delusion that they have created for themselves. There is no truth in Hinduism and orthodox Christianity and these religions are not going to stay for too long, it will perish soon.
Hinduism has been around for 5,000+ years what makes you think it’s going to perish soon?
 
Hinduism has been around for 5,000+ years what makes you think it’s going to perish soon?
Define Hinduism first please and then we can have a fruitful discussion. Hindu is a modern word, the people who followed the Vedas and the Upanishads called themselves as Aryans - Venerable and highly civilized and cultured people known for their learning, wisdom and large heartedness. They did not called themselves as Hindus. Modern Hindus worship Krishna, Shiva, Kali, Ganesha, Hanuman etc and none of these gods and goddesses exists in the Vedas as portrayed by Hindus. The gods that exists in the Vedas are Pushan, Agni, Varuna, Indra, Mithra, Usha, Ashvin etc.

Show me a modern Hindu who literally believe in the existence of these Vedic Gods and worships them with devotion and argues in favour of them, I bet you can’t.

Or else let me put it this way that ancient Hinduism and early gnostic Christianity will blossom again and modern Hinduism and orthodox Christianity will perish soon for the truth doesn’t exist in them from the very beginning.
 
Define Hinduism first please and then we can have a fruitful discussion. Hindu is a modern word, the people who followed the Vedas and the Upanishads called themselves as Aryans - Venerable and highly civilized and cultured people known for their learning, wisdom and large heartedness. They did not called themselves as Hindus. Modern Hindus worship Krishna, Shiva, Kali, Ganesha, Hanuman etc and none of these gods and goddesses exists in the Vedas as portrayed by Hindus. The gods that exists in the Vedas are Pushan, Agni, Varuna, Indra, Mithra, Usha, Ashvin etc.

Show me a modern Hindu who literally believe in the existence of these Vedic Gods and worships them with devotion and argues in favour of them, I bet you can’t.

Or else let me put it this way that ancient Hinduism and early gnostic Christianity will blossom again and modern Hinduism and orthodox Christianity will perish soon for the truth doesn’t exist in them from the very beginning.
The only definition i can think of for Hinduism is the eternal law, other than that Hinduism is to vast to define. I know the tern “Hindu” is a misnomer, but it’s a word people are used to. So is your argument that because most modern Hindu’s don’t worship the Vedic gods that their not practicing Hinduism? People still worship the Vedic gods but under different names for instance Rudra is now Shiva. Hinduism is not a stagnant religion it moves with the times.
 
The only definition i can think of for Hinduism is the eternal law, other than that Hinduism is to vast to define. I know the tern “Hindu” is a misnomer, but it’s a word people are used to. So is your argument that because most modern Hindu’s don’t worship the Vedic gods that their not practicing Hinduism?
Yes.
People still worship the Vedic gods but under different names for instance Rudra is now Shiva. Hinduism is not a stagnant religion it moves with the times.
If you want to know the importance of the names of Gods in rituals then read Iamblichus and Porphyry in “Offering to the gods - a neoplatonic perspective”. The names of gods will have ritual efficacy, that’s why it is so important to preserve the names of gods during cultural transfusion.
 
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