How to make a better world?

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First of all, then, I urge that supplications, prayers, intercessions, and thanksgivings be made for all men, for kings and all who are in high positions, that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life, godly and respectful in every way. (1 Tim 2: 1-2)

This is good, and it is acceptable in the sight of God our Savior, who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth. (1 Tim 2:3-4)
 
IWantGod said:
The only possible way to make a better world is if everybody shares everything and acts for a unified goal. But apparently that’s socialism and socialism is evil.
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But human nature will not agree with that. Capitalism says you get rewarded for your efforts. I may give some of my fruits to charity if I so wish. Those born with lesser endowments will not be as productive as those with more talents. Those who worked harder may not wish to support lazy people on the dole. But those unfortunate needed to be helped. Taking wealth forcibly from productive people does not make a better world either. We need to encourage productive people to maximize their talents. They need to be motivated correctly.

We don’t need equality to have a better world. We just need more good people. The richest people in the world even if they donate most of their wealth to the world’s poorest, will be gone in an instant. And we will be back at the same state. However, their targeted investments e.g. Bill Gates foundation etc can help at alleviating selected problems.

Even if poverty can be eradicated, as long as man’s desire in evil, immoral activities, it is difficult to have a better world. But first we need to define “better”. Better for who? What is the yardstick?
 
tonyrey said:
Not as far as atheists are concerned. What’s the point of inflicting a pointless life on more unfortunate victims of procreation?
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Sadly most atheists disagree with this or do not think much about it and have children, so not too much into your stereotype thing, but to me having children is a crime.
 
ANV said:
Sadly most atheists disagree with this or do not think much about it and have children, so not too much into your stereotype thing, but to me having children is a crime.
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The problem is that most procreation happens when the parents are still immature, they are under the influence of their hormones, and seriously influenced by peer-pressure. And, of course nature instilled in every living creature the irrational desire to propagate their genes.
 
ANV said:
Not as far as atheists are concerned. What’s the point of inflicting a pointless life on more unfortunate victims of procreation?
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In that case you should either reject the Universal Declaration of Human Rights or take every parent to court in the world for inflicting needless misery and suffering on their children!
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Vera_Ljuba said:
The problem is that most procreation happens when the parents are still immature, they are under the influence of their hormones, and seriously influenced by peer-pressure. And, of course nature instilled in every living creature the irrational desire to propagate their genes.
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If that hypothesis were true we would all be irrational because we would be the product of irrational behaviour - and your conclusion would be worthless.
 
ANV said:
Indeed, I love my children enough not to have them.
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I’m sure they’re very grateful to be deprived of the opportunity to exist. 😉 Perhaps if you fall in love you’ll change your mind…

There was no response to my previous post:
In that case you should either reject the Universal Declaration of Human Rights or take every parent to court in the world for inflicting needless misery and suffering on their children!
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tonyrey said:
I’m sure they’re very grateful to be deprived of the opportunity to exist. 😉 Perhaps if you fall in love you’ll change your mind…
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Belief in God is what makes procreation worth it, we co create with God to produce people so that they can be with God. Otherwise what is the point exactly? Procreation makes no sense if there is no ultimate purpose that makes it all worth it. It’s just becomes a pointless activity. And i tell you now, if there is no God, then i resent my mother and father for creating me.
 
IWantGod said:
Belief in God is what makes procreation worth it, we co create with God to produce people so that they can be with God. Otherwise what is the point exactly? Procreation makes no sense is there is ultimate purpose to it. It’s just becomes a pointless activity. And i tell you now, if there is no God, then i resent my mother and father for creating me.
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It is irrational to base such an important decision on an unconfirmed hypothesis.
 
tonyrey said:
It is irrational to base such an important decision on an unconfirmed hypothesis.
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You have to believe that it is an important decision in the first place. When Casual Atheists in western society are questioned about why they procreate they almost always end up saying that life is a gift or that life is to be preferred. But the only reason they end up saying these things is because they still have Christian sentimentalities often without really realizing it…

A rational atheist would realize that there really is no justification to procreate in a world where God does not exist. What possible good reason would one have for creating another living being outside of their subjective fantasies or beliefs?

Procreation is either an act of ignorance or an act of faith or possibly both.
 
IWantGod said:
You have to believe that it is an important decision in the first place. When Casual Atheists in western society are questioned about why they procreate they almost always end up saying that life is a gift or that life is to be preferred. But the only reason they end up saying these things is because they still have Christian sentimentalities often without really realizing it…

A rational atheist would realize that there really is no justification to procreate in a world where God does not exist. What possible good reason would one have for creating another living being outside of their subjective fantasies or beliefs?

Procreation is either an act of ignorance or an act of faith or possibly both.
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It’s not that gods don’t exist, even if I believed in gods I would still have the same sentiment because the world with or without gods would still be the same, whether you believe God(s) made the world, it would be the same world, whether you don’t believe any god made the world, it would still be the same world. I base it on the suffering that exists and not on my disbelief.
Many atheists procreate because that’s how nature and societies worked over ages, because of instinct, needs, desires, programmig etc… because they thought about religions and became atheists but that doesn’t mean they thought about other things, they have an optimist approach towards life and this has nothing to do with Christianity, they just say it’s evolution of the species.
Even as a pessimist realist, it doesn’t mean I don’t like everything about life, many things can be amazing and wonderful but you just don’t think they are worthy or equal the terrible stuff, I appreciate the good things in life, I contemplate what is beautiful in nature, the universe at night, they are fascinating but I don’t think they are worthy the suffering of any being in pain.
Even if there were any gods, I believe they must be horrible.
 
I will point out that all the instruction from God is there to of made life on this earth great if followed - you can’t deny that . The 10 commandments alone if followed by all would of make life great on earth. But man has rejected that instruction and this is the world that it created - we have only ourselves to blame in our selfishness and greed.We have done this we have made the world what it is. That is why man needs God - we are incapable of making this world and life good for all.
 
hu324b said:
I will point out that all the instruction from God is there to of made life on this earth great if followed - you can’t deny that . The 10 commandments alone if followed by all would of make life great on earth. But man has rejected that instruction and this is the world that it created - we have only ourselves to blame in our selfishness and greed. We have done this we have made the world what it is. That is why man needs God - we are incapable of making this world and life good for all.
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Which “commandment” would protect us from infectious diseases, meteor strikes or Earthquakes? Furthermore, a good designer would not resort to “commandments”, she would make it impossible to commit the undesirable actions. And to hell with the next-to unlimited “freedom”. No decent parent would leave a loaded gun where it is freely accessible for a small child, and issue a stern warning: “Do not point this toward your sister and pull this trigger!”. Or place a plate of poisoned fruit on the table, and say: “No matter what, don’t eat this apple!”.

From the assumed Omni-max attributes of God it follows logically that God is responsible for everything - either directly or indirectly - the good, the bad and the ugly. God has no excuse for allowing the undesirable behavior. The so-called “free will defense” is the worst argument imaginable. And no matter how many times this is pointed out, someone does not understand it.
 
Vera_Ljuba said:
Which “commandment” would protect us from infectious diseases, meteor strikes or Earthquakes? Furthermore, a good designer would not resort to “commandments”, she would make it impossible to commit the undesirable actions. And to hell with the next-to unlimited “freedom”. No decent parent would leave a loaded gun where it is freely accessible for a small child, and issue a stern warning: “Do not point this toward your sister and pull this trigger!”. Or place a plate of poisoned fruit on the table, and say: “No matter what, don’t eat this apple!”.

From the assumed Omni-max attributes of God it follows logically that God is responsible for everything - either directly or indirectly - the good, the bad and the ugly. God has no excuse for allowing the undesirable behavior. The so-called “free will defense” is the worst argument imaginable. And no matter how many times this is pointed out, someone does not understand it.
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Oh so now God has put nature against us.Every living thing in the physical world deals with that - its not God against man - it called nature. The question was how to make the world a better place not how can we can control nature so natural disasters do not happen - that would be a new thread.

Why would you build you home on a fault line that you knew was there and then say its Gods fault. Why would you build your house on a flood plain or in know paths of deadly hurricanes and then say its God fault. Why would you build your home at the base of a volcano and then say its Gods fault - no body wants to accept responsibility its all God fault - he should wrap us all in bubble wrap take our free will away and do all things for us - you wouldn’t be you if God did that. We learn more in life at our darkest moments and it brings us together - sorry everything can’t be sunshine and lolly pops that’s just not reality
 
ANV said:
It’s not that gods don’t exist, even if I believed in gods I would still have the same sentiment because the world with or without gods would still be the same, whether you believe God(s) made the world
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The difference being that a world with God at the very least offers ultimate fulfillment even if we don’t understand why a good God would allow natural suffering.
 
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