How to receive?

[otjm]

I think that it’s fair to say that human nature would prompt us all to react in similar fashion, nothing bold about that. Even a wicked fool would likely be so humbled under such an extraordinary event.

Actually, it is neither fair nor factually accurate to say that human nature would prompt us. The Eastern Rite Catholics have been standing for 2,000 years; Roman Rite calls us to kneel, and both are postures that are far more cultural than some would care to admit.

We can leave it to cultural sociologists and anthropologists as to whether kneeling before authority came from obeisance to civil authority or from the Church in the western world; but the cultures which have molded the Eastern Rite Catholics to stand give lie to saying that kneeling is a response of human nature. It is human nature to give obeisance to God; how that comes out in physical posture is most definitely not “universal”.

 

[JimR-OCDS]

But that’s not the reason the Church mandated receiving on the tongue only

The abuse was that people were putting the host in their pockets and taking home, or worse, taking it for desecration.

However, it has been known that receiving on the tongue doesn’t prevent this. In fact, it makes it worse as my wife and myself have found half melted hosts in the pews and outside the church on the ground.

 

[ThomasMT]

In fact, it makes it worse as my wife and myself have found half melted hosts in the pews and outside the church on the ground.

That’s interesting and obviously unfortunate. I’m not sure however, how receiving on tongue increases the likelihood of such an abuse. Hand or tongue, the host ends up in the mouth either way, no?

 

[JimR-OCDS]

Never mind

I intended not to get involved with threads like this during Lent

God’s Peace

 

[OurLadyofSorrows]

With respect, Father,
that’s all fine but… and I don’t know about you, if the Lord God Almighty were to appear right before me I’m sure that not only would my knees hit the ground, but so would my face. I would probably tremble. I wouldn’t care what anyone near me thinks of my I intentions or motivations. Nor do I when I receive.

To you and everyone making an argument knees are more reverent and holy,

consider this, we live in the Kingdom of God on earth. God is Being itself. God is everywhere. We , by these arguments similar to yours mean we should living our lives on our knees. God gave us legs and created us to stand upright . In the Book of Revelation, the Heavenly court is not described as being on its knees . It is either sitting on a chair or prostrate on the ground from my reading.

 

[MagdalenaRita]

When Jesus demonstrated the manner of receiving to the Apostles at the Last Supper, it wasn’t placed on the tongue. Hence I don’t buy this explanation as theologically accurate.

And whilst they were at supper, Jesus took bread, and blessed, and broke: and gave to his disciples, Matthew 26:26

Jesus answered: He it is to whom I shall reach bread dipped. And when he had dipped the bread, he gave it to Judas Iscariot, the son of Simon John 13:26

Scripture doesn’t tell us how Jesus gave it, whether He placed it in their hands or on their tongue,but we know the Church has traditionally through many decades given the host to the laity on the tongue. The only reason we can receive in the hand now is due to an indult.

Also, those twelve apostles were given new roles of bishops of Christ’s church. Not something He gave to us, so it would be incorrect to compare ourselves to the apostles at that time.

Bishop Schneider is a bishop in another country. The bishops of the United States requested and received a variance to the universal norm, and in the United States standing is the norm. The bishops did not invite his opinion and I suspect they do not see it as welcome.

Bishop Schneider is still a bishop in the Catholic church. We listen to other bishops of other countries many times when teaching the faith. His desire is to bring reverence and belief back to the Eucharist. I can’t see that being an unwanted desire.

God is everywhere. We , by these arguments similar to yours mean we should living our lives on our knees

Well, except that Christ is coming to us in an extremely special way in the Eucharist and we are receiving Him into our very beings, receiving graces and mercy when we receive and to be receiving Him worthily. Not anywhere near the same thing as God being everywhere.

 

[ThomasMT]

We can leave it to cultural sociologists and anthropologists as to whether kneeling before authority came from obeisance to civil authority or from the Church in the western world; but the cultures which have molded the Eastern Rite Catholics to stand give lie to saying that kneeling is a response of human nature. It is human nature to give obeisance to God; how that comes out in physical posture is most definitely not “universal”.

Dropping to the ground and bowing before one’s superior goes back to Genesis, preceding the church. As far as universality goes, even dogs recognize the posture of presenting oneself in the least threatening and most vulnerable manner. I could give many examples of animals that, when feeling threatened or challenged can be appeased by postures of submission often entailing the lowering of the head and drawing closer to the ground.

 

[Thom18]

You have a preference for kneeling. Not everyone does, and not everyone tries to establish their preferred form of reception as being more X.

Neither is more reverent than the other. It’s simple. If kneeling is more conducive to reverence for you, then that’s fine, but don’t try to establish it as a universal maxim.

 

[MagdalenaRita]

Neither is more reverent than the other. It’s simple.

Kneeling before someone has always been a sign of humility.

That in the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of those that are in heaven, on earth, and under the earth: Philipians 2

Peter kneeling down prayed, Acts 9:40

While standing does not show humility and at times can be a sign of pride or lack of humility:

The kings of the earth stood up, and the princes met together, against the Lord and against his Christ. Psalm 2

And the high priest rising up, said to him: Answerest thou nothing to the things which these witness against thee Matthew 26:62 DR

And the high priest stood up Matthew 26:62 RSV

 

[po18guy]

Reverence is indeed in the human heart. Now, maybe I’m a lunatic, but I focus on Who I receive rather than how I receive.

 

[ThomasMT]

In the Book of Revelation, the Heavenly court is not described as being on its knees . It is either sitting on a chair or prostrate on the ground from my reading.

Rev 7
[11]And all the angels stood round about the throne and the ancients and the four living creatures. And they fell down before the throne upon their faces and adored God, [12]Saying: Amen. Benediction and glory and wisdom and thanksgiving, honour and power and strength, to our God, for ever and ever. Amen.

Agreed. Should we receive sitting, then? Are we to consider ourselves, in our earthly and sinful state equal to heaven’s inhabitants? Perhaps then we should consider prostrating ourselves? After all, if it’s good enough for the Angels… no? Perhaps then it is reasonable that some of us may wish to at least kneel.

We , by these arguments similar to yours mean we should living our lives on our knees. God gave us legs and created us to stand upright .

That hardly means that we should be standing even when sleeping.
Are you against praying at all in a kneeling position?

Bottom line, you are obviously welcome to receive however you choose. The whole point of my rabbit hole rant was to show support for the OP’s desire to receive while kneeling, if he/so chooses. Can we not at least agree that we should be as free to receive kneeling as those standing? No one should be feeling judged… whether its simply in the OP’s mind or not.

 

[Johnofendore]

Keep it up wonderingCatholic. It is the most reverential way of receiving, and was the only way before it was a novelty introduced after VAT 2. It began in Germany and a couple of other European countries. Pope Paul VI tried to stop it, but couldn’t. . . .

 

[XXI_4]

It is the most reverential way of receiving, and was the only way before it was a novelty introduced after VAT 2.

Kneeling and prostration on Sundays was explicitly FORBIDDEN by Canon 20 of the Council of Nicea.

It did not become the norm in the West until the middle ages, and the East has an unbroken tradition of standing from the earliest liturgies.

 

[Emeraldlady]

Emeraldlady:

When Jesus demonstrated the manner of receiving to the Apostles at the Last Supper, it wasn’t placed on the tongue. Hence I don’t buy this explanation as theologically accurate.

And whilst they were at supper, Jesus took bread, and blessed, and broke: and gave to his disciples, Matthew 26:26

Jesus answered: He it is to whom I shall reach bread dipped. And when he had dipped the bread, he gave it to Judas Iscariot, the son of Simon John 13:26

Scripture doesn’t tell us how Jesus gave it, whether He placed it in their hands or on their tongue,but we know the Church has traditionally through many decades given the host to the laity on the tongue. The only reason we can receive in the hand now is due to an indult.

Also, those twelve apostles were given new roles of bishops of Christ’s church. Not something He gave to us, so it would be incorrect to compare ourselves to the apostles at that time.

The manner of receiving and the frequency of receiving Holy Communion has evolved in different ways over 2000 years. It is a matter for the Church hierarchy to monitor with their vast grasp of history. There is no evidence that the Apostles went out and instituted Communion on the tongue to distinguish their position from us non Apostles. In fact the evidence is that home Eucharists were very much in the context of a meal table in the same way that Jesus taught his Apostles.

It is recorded that in the 5th century Chrysostom lamented that no one was partaking in Communion at all because the mystique around the consecrated bread had become so distorted that no one felt worthy to receive. The Synod of Agde (506) had to strongly insist that people receive at least 3 times a year. Christmas, Easter and Pentecost. Jesus didn’t mean us to be so distant from Him in the Eucharist and the Church has to respond when obvious distortions are disturbing the authentic communion between Christ and His people.

I regard the contributions of Bishop Schneider as I regard those of the German Bishops. They each in their own ways have an agenda that suggests that the Magisterium is wrong and they are right.

 

[MagdalenaRita]

Wrong.

The problem with the article, as was demonstrated by some of the comments following, is that there is a lot about how they received in the early Church that we do not know. The early Church was much more strict than we are now and receiving on the tongue became the universal way to receive because of the same things happening today; irreverence and abuses.

 

[Emeraldlady]

Johnofendore:

It is the most reverential way of receiving, and was the only way before it was a novelty introduced after VAT 2.

Kneeling and prostration on Sundays was explicitly FORBIDDEN by Canon 20 of the Council of Nicea.

It did not become the norm in the West until the middle ages, and the East has an unbroken tradition of standing from the earliest liturgies.

That’s interesting.

Canon 20
Forasmuch as there are certain persons who kneel on the Lord’s Day and in the days of Pentecost, therefore, to the intent that all things may be uniformly observed everywhere (in every parish), it seems good to the holy Synod that prayer be made to God standing.

 

[Thom18]

Thom18:

Neither is more reverent than the other. It’s simple.

Kneeling before someone has always been a sign of humility.

That in the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of those that are in heaven, on earth, and under the earth: Philipians 2

Peter kneeling down prayed, Acts 9:40

While standing does not show humility and at times can be a sign of pride or lack of humility:

The kings of the earth stood up, and the princes met together, against the Lord and against his Christ. Psalm 2

And the high priest rising up, said to him: Answerest thou nothing to the things which these witness against thee Matthew 26:62 DR

And the high priest stood up Matthew 26:62 RSV

And as I said in another post, kneeling can show humility- other times it can be someone trying to draw attention to themselves.

As I also said, standing to receive can show more of a fraternal attitude. Rather than approaching the king in Communion, I am approaching my brother, Christ.

I’ll also add that “reverence” and “humility” are not synonyms.

 

[blackforest]

The OP has since deleted the post in which s/he wonders if people receiving in the hand are taking the Eucharist seriously. This is what I was largely addressing.

Not generally. Until coronavirus spread into our country, nobody could ever receive in the hand here.

Our priest brought this up at Mass this morning. I attend an OF Mass, but he asked one of his Latin rite cohorts what his parish is doing in the wake of our bishop’s recent orders to administer Eucharist only in the hand. In the true spirit of our faith, the EF priest said that if the bishop requires hand-only, then he obeys. This healthy attitude comes in the midst of numerous angry calls that our diocese is receiving about this latest missive.

 

[Thom18]

We’ve been discussing CITH vs COTT for how long now, and now we’re fighting about kneeling versus standing?

Both are allowed, reverence is internal, your preference is not “more reverent” or “more humble” than another, and that’s that.

 

[po18guy]

We’ve been discussing CITH vs COTT for how long now, and now we’re fighting about kneeling versus standing?

Both are allowed, reverence is internal, your preference is not “more reverent” or “more humble” than another, and that’s that.

Hear, Hear!

At parishes without a communion rail, I generally receive standing (after a bow) and on the tongue. When I visit a parish with a communion rail, well - when in Rome, I do as the Romans do.

Point: Just recently, except at the third elevation, I keep my eyes closed so as not to be distracted (distraction is one of the four primary tactics of the devil) and listen - just we are supposed to listen to “My beloved Son…” When Father says, “Behold…” I behold, for He is my Salvation!