How to refute the Philosophical Zombie argument?

[Freddy]

Freddy:

HarryStotle:

HarryStotle:

Edward Feser: Search results for mind body dualism hylemorphism

No need to reinvent the wheel. Feser does a competent job making those arguments. See the link above.

‘Read this’ is your argument? I think not…

The purpose of the thread topic is to refute the PZ argument, it isn’t about hylemorphic dualism. Start a thread if you are sincerely interested.

In the meantime, the point and title of the thread – refuting the PZ argument – ought to concern what the PZ argument actually attempts to accomplish, which isn’t to establish mind-body dualism (as you claim) but to refute physicalism (eliminative materialism.)

Uh? You are the one that brought up hylomorphic dualism. And linked to an article that was meant to represent your views on it. If you don’t want to discuss any given matter then
a) don’t bring it up and
b) don’t link to an article that supports your position (I assume) if you are asked for it.

And the p-zombie thought experiment works both ways. It supports either materialism or dualism depending on whether you think that p-zombies are conceivable or not (and yeah, I know Chalmers proposed it to deny materialism but you can use it to deny either position). It’s an either/or position. Even if there were other options. And I’d definitely be keen to know that you have found another option that isn’t a variation on either materialism or dualism.

 

[HarryStotle]

And I’d definitely be keen to know that you have found another option that isn’t a variation on either materialism or dualism.

You appear to have lost the gist of the conversation. Hylemorphic dualism is that other “option.” Hylemorphic dualism isn’t dualism in substance, it is ‘dualism’ only conceptually speaking.

The ONLY reason I brought it up was to counter your claim that the PZ argument necessarily leads to mind-body dualism. Which it doesn’t.

It isn’t possible for someone who does not understand the argument to refute that argument – well, at least not by intention.

 

[Freddy]

Freddy:

And I’d definitely be keen to know that you have found another option that isn’t a variation on either materialism or dualism.

The ONLY reason I brought it up was to counter your claim that the PZ argument necessarily leads to mind-body dualism. Which it doesn’t.

Quite right. It can also lead to materialism depending on how you view p-zombies. It’s an either/or position. Conceptually speaking of course.

 

[HarryStotle]

WannabeSaint:

The Philosophical Zombie Argument asserts that there is a possibility that everyone in the world other than one person doesn’t have consciousness; even though their outward appearance and behavior is identical to a conscious human.

So easy to assert… So impossible to solidly prove…

No proof? No Argument…

Except that the other side is also easy to assert and so “impossible to solidly prove.”

Care to make a solid proof for the existence of other minds?

It isn’t enough to assume other minds exist to dismiss the alternative. In philosophy, both sides take on the burden of proof.

 

[HarryStotle]

HarryStotle:

Freddy:

And I’d definitely be keen to know that you have found another option that isn’t a variation on either materialism or dualism.

The ONLY reason I brought it up was to counter your claim that the PZ argument necessarily leads to mind-body dualism. Which it doesn’t.

Quite right. It can also lead to materialism depending on how you view p-zombies. It’s an either/or position. Conceptually speaking of course.

I am rapidly being driven to the conclusion that other minds don’t exist.

 

[HarryStotle]

HarryStotle:

I am rapidly being driven to the conclusion that other minds don’t exist.

That would be dangerous to your mental health. If you believe that all the contrarian arguments are the product of your own mind, you would be forced to accept your own insanity. Hopefully it will not happen.

I was being facetious with @Freddy. Think about my comment to him.

 

[EndTimes]

Except that the other side is also easy to assert and so “impossible to solidly prove.”

In other words, those who present the Philosophical Zombie argument can not prove it.

Of course, when anyone presents arcane concepts - the onus is always upon them to prove it…