How to tell Catholic in-laws you're not using NFP

[Xantippe]

EasterJoy said:

“When the topic comes up, I would say this: I have no intention of ever telling anyone whether we are “trying” or “not trying” or “really trying” or “avoiding” or whether we want boys or girls or twins or two or four or ten or anything else. If you get pregnant when you told everyone you were avoiding, then there are mouths flapping about that, and if you tell everyone you’re trying, and then you don’t get pregnant, there are mouths flapping about that and it is hard enough to want a child and not be able to have one without that. I don’t need it, and our children certainly don’t need it.”

Yes!

 

[LittleFlower378]

But she does not identify as a member of that Church, she specifically identified as agnostic.
Does she attend regulary, hold to the beliefs of this Church? Or is this just where her family wants them to get married. For a dispensation to be given there needs to be some pressing issue. Yet the OP repeatedly states that it is HIS family that they are placating with a sham.

I think there is some ingeniousness going on here.

The silver lining may be that IF the OP fiancee ever finds his way back to the Church, and decides a life of children and Catholicism is for him. An annulment will most certainly be on the table.

Because they are admittedly not agreeing with the vow and sacrament of Marriage. And we as Catholics should not encourage that.

This type of thing is why I have so much trouble with having a “more pastoral” approach to the Catholic divorced and invalid remarried always complaining about how they cannot receive communion.

This marriage is a decision that will impact the rest of their lives and their very souls. I think they should respect their families enough to not be dishonest about it. And respect my faith enough to not be sacrilegious with it.

Good points and just to add the OP is relying on a marriage that is contraceptive. Artificial Contraceptive marriages have a hard time lasting. We can’t force or tell you what to do but we must speak the truth in love. Artificial Contraception doesnt help marriages. Its funny because I am in the middle of reading “The Art of Natural Family Planning,” which is a great book on this subject.

On the other hand, it is not good for people to pry into your marriage. And couples definitely have to remember that they are to “leave their father and mother and cleave to their wife.” But remember this is a big deal, contraception and marriage in the Church that is, so I do understand the concern of the parents. Its not like they are telling you that you must join the work force or how to raise your kids.

 

[prodigalson2011]

But she does not identify as a member of that Church, she specifically identified as agnostic.
Does she attend regularly, hold to the beliefs of this Church? Or is this just where her family wants them to get married. For a dispensation to be given there needs to be some pressing issue. Yet the OP repeatedly states that it is HIS family that they are placating with a sham.

I think there is some disingeniousness going on here.

The silver lining may be that IF the OP fiancee ever finds his way back to the Church, and decides a life of children and Catholicism is for him. An annulment will most certainly be on the table.

Because they are admittedly not agreeing with the vow and sacrament of Marriage. And we as Catholics should not encourage that.

This type of thing is why I have so much trouble with having a “more pastoral” approach to the Catholic divorced and invalid remarried always complaining about how they cannot receive communion.

This marriage is a decision that will impact the rest of their lives and their very souls. I think they should respect their families enough to not be dishonest about it. And respect my faith enough to not be sacrilegious with it.

While this is true, it is not a reason to commit a fraud or a sacrilege.

I’m glad to see someone else on this thread making sense.

To the OP: if neither you nor your husband intend to have a sacramental marriage, you should NOT be getting married in the Catholic Church.

Your future in-laws sentiments aside, you are lying to yourselves, his parents, the Church, and–given that you are agnostic and thus at least open to the possibility of God’s existence–God Himself.

It’s incredibly disrespectful and dishonest.

 

[shelby_sun]

Good points and just to add the OP is relying on a marriage that is contraceptive. Artificial Contraceptive marriages have a hard time lasting. We can’t force or tell you what to do but we must speak the truth in love. Artificial Contraception doesnt help marriages. Its funny because I am in the middle of reading “The Art of Natural Family Planning,” which is a great book on this subject.

On the other hand, it is not good for people to pry into your marriage. And couples definitely have to remember that they are to “leave their father and mother and cleave to their wife.” But remember this is a big deal, contraception and marriage in the Church that is, so I do understand the concern of the parents. Its not like they are telling you that you must join the work force or how to raise your kids.

The parents, on either side should be telling them what to do in their marriage. You have children to love, raise, and teach as best you can what you morals, belief,and values are, but I would hope parents also want their children to be strong, confident, independent people who can go on and take care of themselves. Parents are not going to like every decision every child they have makes, of which most is none of their business. They got a chance to live their lives, each child deserves that same right.

 

[LittleFlower378]

The parents, on either side should be telling them what to do in their marriage. You have children to love, raise, and teach as best you can what you morals, belief,and values are, but I would hope parents also want their children to be strong, confident, independent people who can go on and take care of themselves. Parents are not going to like every decision every child they have makes, of which most is none of their business. They got a chance to live their lives, each child deserves that same right.

Very true, but the parents do have the right to evangelize to their children as well. There can be a point where it does cross a line.

 

[shelby_sun]

I’m glad to see someone else on this thread making sense.

To the OP: if neither you nor your husband intend to have a sacramental marriage, you should NOT be getting married in the Catholic Church.

Your future in-laws sentiments aside, you are lying to yourselves, his parents, the Church, and–given that you are agnostic and thus at least open to the possibility of God’s existence–God Himself.

It’s incredibly disrespectful and dishonest.

If you are going to post please read the post correctly out of respect to the OP. She clearly stated she was getting married in a Christ of Christ church!

 

[firead]

Your private life is none of your mother-in-law’s business. She may be trying to be helpful, assuming you are using NFP and might want help or guidance, but you would be totally within your rights telling her it’s not something you want to discuss with her.

Just be prepared for future questions about why it’s taking so long to get pregnant if she’s the nosy or just concerned type (I got a ton of that even though my in-laws were not Catholic- I struggled with infertility for 10 years and had 2 early miscarriages they did not know about, which has given me the perspective that it’s a really rude thing to ask a person).

You could tell her your on the Pill, but she probably doesn’t really want to know and it woul likely worry her and cause strife within your family. I think I would prefer not to know because, if I did, I would feel obligated to try to change her mind.

As far as the Pill, just do some research on your own on the type you think you will be using and both long and short-term side effects and how it works (ie whether it only prevents fertilization or if it can cause early abortion). They use different types and levels of hormones and can cause people’s bodies to react in different ways, and some take longer than others to get out of your system.
My mom had me put on the Depo shot when I was still a teenager, even though I wasn’t sexually active at the time. My OB thinks it might be a contributing factor to my infertility & PCOS, even though I stopped it before I ever got married because she sees a lot of women who started that particular form of BC at a younger age and had ongoing fertlity problems as adults.

 

[shelby_sun]

Very true, but the parents do have the right to evangelize to their children as well. There can be a point where it does cross a line.

Your right. I was raised Catholic, went to 12 years or Catholic school, and have worked at a Catholic school for twenty year and I have rarely heard the term evangelize. We use the term teach, so I do not know how far one goes with evangelizing. Maybe what I see has bullying is actually suppose to be evangelizing.

For example, on this post, the OP was very clear what this post was to be about yet there seem to be posters who just want to “evangelize” their point rather than to respect the OP request. There are plenty of other post for that, but the insist, which to me is uncharitable. I think they are too crossing a line.

 

[NFPWife]

To the original question, EasterJoy has it dead on. Not only do you not divulge whether you’re doing NFP or not doing NFP, you don’t divulge any of your family planning plans until you’re pregnant. I have friends who would say 3 months along, but life begins at conception so why not start celebrating when the stick turns

I’m curious as to what “shunning” would look like? Does it mean pulling of financial support for the wedding? Is it a complete cutting you out of their lives - no relationship at all? Is it being disinherited, etc. etc.?

I see you going through a lot of machinations to make things, externally, appear one way. That’s what ppl are labeling disingenuous. If you’re doing it for some immediate gain (like cash for wedding expenses) then it could become dishonest.

 

[The_Bucket]

For example, on this post, the OP was very clear what this post was to be about yet there seem to be posters who just want to “evangelize” their point rather than to respect the OP request. There are plenty of other post for that, but the insist, which to me is uncharitable. I think they are too crossing a line.

You have a very… interesting… definition of bullying and “crossing the line.” As in, if we don’t focus on one very narrow point, then all of a sudden we’re being uncharitable and downright cruel.

 

[The_Bucket]

I see you going through a lot of machinations to make things, externally, appear one way. That’s what ppl are labeling disingenuous. If you’re doing it for some immediate gain (like cash for wedding expenses) then it could become dishonest.

It’s dishonest no matter what. If they are doing to keep things “smooth” but don’t care about the actual vows, I don’t see the point. In fact, I see it as counterproductive and deceitful. I ascribe and assume no ulterior motive here aside from wanting to spare the feelings of the OP’s husband.

Hey, it’s fine to not to want to ruffle feathers unnecessarily, but going through as you said, certain machinations to try and keep people happy when the underlying spiritual reality is something else is just plain wrong in my opinion.

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

IF one receives a dispensation is one still making the promises of a Catholic marriage and is one bound by those promises?

 

[kozlosap]

+++++1!!!
Yes, the OP was very clear that they are not being married in the Church. Obviously (LMFAO), his parents must realize that since a priest is not officiating at the ceremony and the wedding is not in a Catholic Church, that the marriage will not be considered a Catholic Sacramental marriage. It appears to me that the OP and her fiancé have been quite truthful about their way of life. The fact that they went over and above their obligations and attended all of the pre canna classes including NFP training is very, very respectful to the Catholic parents. I would advise the OP to use the phrase that I utilize every time my adult daughter wants to share a sexual tidbit with her old baby boomer Mom, “TMI, JUST PLAIN TMI”!!!

 

[bitterhope]

As a mother I can assure you I would never want to know anything at all about my adult children’s sex lives, and that includes if or when or how many children they will have. I came from a big Catholic family and so did my husband and no parents on either has asked what we do for family planning or cares how many or few kids we have/will have. I don’t think it’s normal or healthy for parents to be that intimately involved with their adult kids’ lives. The time for the parents to discuss NFP and Theology if the Body and all the rest is as the kids are growing up. Plant the seeds and water them with good examples of holiness and fervent prayers. I don’t think it would be wise to blurt out anything that would damage the relationship, but it is best to let them know that you do not feel comfortable speaking about bedroom matters with anyone besides your (future) spouse and your doctor. If they won’t drop it, let them know that if they continue to insist on causing you discomfort you will be walking out the door and not returning until they apologize. I know for a fact that if my in laws it even my parents asked us about our family planning (AKA sex life) I would not tolerate it. I don’t want to know about theirs, they shouldn’t want to know about ours.

 

[NFPWife]

+++++1!!!
Yes, the OP was very clear that they are not being married in the Church. Obviously (LMFAO), his parents must realize that since a priest is not officiating at the ceremony and the wedding is not in a Catholic Church, that the marriage will not be considered a Catholic Sacramental marriage. …

I’m not so sure. They’re requesting a dispensation, there are circumstances where a dispensation is given and the marriage is considered a valid, Sacramental marriage. So the parents could be under the impression that they are entering into a valid, Sacramental marriage.

 

[MJJean]

I’m not so sure. They’re requesting a dispensation, there are circumstances where a dispensation is given and the marriage is considered a valid, Sacramental marriage. So the parents could be under the impression that they are entering into a valid, Sacramental marriage.

And they ARE!

A Sacramental marriage is made between two baptized Christians who are free to marry. A Catholic is required to marry in the Church OR get dispensation to marry elsewhere in order to make a valid marriage.

The couple seem to both be baptized, they have taken their pre-Cana, and they are waiting on their dispensation in addition to having talked honestly with the priest. And remember, the Church considers ALL marriages valid unless PROVEN otherwise by a Tribunal. So, unless they divorce and apply for annulment the marriage will be seen as a valid Sacramental marriage according to the Church (assuming the dispensation is granted).

 

[shelby_sun]

It’s dishonest no matter what. If they are doing to keep things “smooth” but don’t care about the actual vows, I don’t see the point. In fact, I see it as counterproductive and deceitful. I ascribe and assume no ulterior motive here aside from wanting to spare the feelings of the OP’s husband.

Hey, it’s fine to not to want to ruffle feathers unnecessarily, but going through as you said, certain machinations to try and keep people happy when the underlying spiritual reality is something else is just plain wrong in my opinion.

When she respectfully and clearly asked then, yes that is what it is, yes.

 

[haileenotbailee]

Thank you everyone for your replies!

I would appreciate if no more replies were made since my initial question has been answered. Thank you for your time!

 

[NFPWife]

That really was your first visit here, because I’m relatively new and even I know it doesn’t work like that around here

Best wishes on your marriage.

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

Thank you everyone for your replies!

I would appreciate if no more replies were made since my initial question has been answered. Thank you for your time!

You can either unsubscribe from the thread or ask the mods to close it.

But you can’t open Pandora’s Box and expect to pack it back up nicely.

That being said, I will TRY to abstain. I feel that your initial question was answered and answered almost unanimously that it is none of their business. But there were other issues brought up that I’m sure people will be curious about and discuss on a theological and legal level. IF it causes you strife. Probably best to look away!

I wish you all the best.