How to tell someone to sit further back in church

[EasterJoy]

To be fair the hurt person leaving church in this situation could just as easily be someone who couldn’t fit their family in the pew while the priest did nothing. Something needs to be done but it’s best not to single people out, marking seats as reserved would be the way to go.

To clarify: I think the meaning was not leaving the church, but leaving the Church.

Yes, when the evil one has been working on someone, that much can be the straw that breaks the camel’s back. That is not to say that no one ought to be corrected, but that we need to realize that there can be grave consequences when we correct those not under our jurisdiction. When someone confronts you with their intention to do something seriously wrong, looking for your approval, that is one thing. When they are doing something that is not so serious and aren’t looking for your opinion, though, you need to think twice before you offer your point of view. The same goes for out-of-parish visitors telling parish staff what needs to be done. Unless the topic is “this is how this parish treats visitors, and it isn’t good,” usually the pastor and staff have enough (name removed by moderator)ut from their own parishioners to keep them busy.

 

[ConfusedLucy]

To clarify: I think the meaning was not leaving the church, but leaving the Church.

Yes, when the evil one has been working on someone, that much can be the straw that breaks the camel’s back. That is not to say that no one ought to be corrected, but that we need to realize that there can be grave consequences when we correct those not under our jurisdiction. When someone confronts you with their intention to do something seriously wrong, looking for your approval, that is one thing. When they are doing something that is not so serious and aren’t looking for your opinion, though, you need to think twice before you offer your point of view. The same goes for out-of-parish visitors telling parish staff what needs to be done. Unless the topic is “this is how this parish treats visitors, and it isn’t good,” usually the pastor and staff have enough (name removed by moderator)ut from their own parishioners to keep them busy.

Someone not in the parish probably isn’t the best person to get involved in this. Really that family should have more sense, I very much doubt they had randoms in the front pew at their weddings.

I’m all for reserved seat signs. I once had to go to a mass which wasn’t my normal one and we were told to sit near the front and ended up sat in the seat of someone who always sat there as they couldn’t stand for communion, really awkward and could have been avoided with a sign.

 

[Rosebud77]

How about:

Getting more altar servers - then weddings and funerals could have another youth serving - Problem solved …

The person responsible in the parish for planning the funeral liturgy or wedding liturgy could gently inform the families of all the altar servers that - unlike normal “Sunday” Masses - the family of altar servers should not sit in the seating reserved for family members - this could be on the information sheets provided and discussed during altar serving training … then its addressed to each and every altar server and not one family - Problem solved

This instruction can be mentioned each and every time an altar server is recruited - or assigned to serve at special Masses like weddings and funerals - as a standard practice - again addressed to each and every server - not directed at a certain family

Tactful , official,non-personal , professional. Perfect…

 

[EasterJoy]

Tactful , official,non-personal , professional. Perfect…

I’ve trained altar servers. If we were to do training with parents present and tell them that it is not OK to sit in the section usually reserved for families at funerals and weddings, particularly if there was gossip about one particular family doing that, everyone would see that as calling out the “offending party” in front of everyone. No one would be fooled by that.

This is not a widespread problem. It does not belong in the limited time available for altar server training. It is easily solved in a “tactful, official, non-personal, and professional” way by just having the ushers take care of the issue if it ever comes up again, handling as if it had never happened before and was an innocent mistake and an isolated incident.

Besides, it may never happen again. (For instance, the server might tip them off.)

 

[Phemie]

Well, they need to understand that as proud as they are of this young man,

1. it’s not a performance
2. they are likely making him terribly nervous, as you know they are probably going step by step on the car ride home. The person who also trains the servers could step in and tell them to leave the poor kid alone. As DRE, I would have no problem asking them to ease up on him. But it’s really the job of the Ushers, as I said above.

Not every parish has ushers. It’s been years since I’ve seen “ushers” do anything other than take up the collection. Certainly haven’t been in a parish in decades that has someone that would find you a place to sit or do anything like that.

 

[Phemie]

Pretty much everyone I know has their wedding and children’s Baptism Masses photographed and/or videotaped. Many parishes hire a professional photographer for first Holy Communion and Confirmation, to avoid parents getting up during the Mass. It’s really not that big of a deal for a Mass to be photographed when it’s a special occasion, and when someone’s kid is serving for the first time, that’s kind of special. I wouldn’t judge. You’re not supposed to be looking at other people. You’re supposed to be praying. If it’s about the glory of God, then why not focus on that yourself?

We warn parents during Baptismal prep classes that if they want the event photographed they are to warn the person not to come forward of the first pew and to be discrete. I don’t know what your experience has been but I’ve seen relatives with cameras who would have gladly pushed Father out of the way if that meant they got a clearer shot of baby. Or first communicant. For some reason when kids are involved some relatives loose all sense of decorum and propriety.

 

[EasterJoy]

Not every parish has ushers. It’s been years since I’ve seen “ushers” do anything other than take up the collection. Certainly haven’t been in a parish in decades that has someone that would find you a place to sit or do anything like that.

At our parish, ushers are attentive that people with mobility problems are given a chance to be seated in front, where Father can bring them Holy Communion in their seats, or that Father (or the extraordinary ministers of Holy Communion) knows where they are and comes to them. They actually do “ushering” things. If someone who could barely walk wanted to sit in front, the ushers would ask someone already there to move in order to accommodate them. (In our parish, there would be someone happy to do this.) The ushers also get there early and rope off or mark the area when some of the pews are reserved for some reason. (For instance, when there is a baptism, the family can reserve pews near the font.)

At a wedding, the groomsmen usually handle this. At a funeral, the funeral home usually supplies at least one and usually two people to take care of this. At a parish, if some section of the church is reserved, then it is roped off before anyone gets there. Otherwise, anyone can sit anywhere they want.

 

[Anglewannabe]

I do have to say if I was at a funeral for a loved one and some altar servers parents took the front row? It wouldn’t be pretty. If they are really doing that, trust me, someone will rant at them soon. Especially at a funeral or wedding. And to be frank, they’ll kind of deserve it.

This got me thinking of the other side of the coin. If I was responsible for the planning of a funeral or wedding, if the behaviour of the alter server or the alter server’s family was that important to me, I would find my own alter servers. When I was a kid, I was an alter server at few funerals where I didn’t know the people and I was asked at the last minute. Obviously, since no one knows exactly when the death will occur, one can not plan a funeral.

However, now that I am an adult, if ever I had to plan a funeral and some kids I never met before showed up to be alter servers, I would be so grateful these kids helped out, I think I would overlook if their family took the front row.

To be honest, any funeral of a loved one I ever attended I just took the most convenient seat (even when I was in the procession). It never occured to me to notice who was in the front seat. I don’t even know if the spouse of the deceased was in the front seat:shrug:

 

[Norseman82]

If it is ever your wedding or funeral, of course now you have carte blanche to kindly, firmly request that they move because those seats are reserved for the family.

If I requested people to move to another pew at my own funeral, I assure you their having to move would not be the top thing people would remember about that funeral…

 

[kptrs]

I really don’t know what the right way to handle this is. I guess I’m still just kind of dumbfounded that the family of this server actually thinks it’s okay to sit in the very front pew at a wedding or funeral of someone they don’t know. I mean…we’re talking common sense here. If someone decides to leave the Church over someone telling them to exercise simple basic, uh…good manners…I’m at a loss.

Unsubscribing

 

[PatrickKen]

I am glad they didn’t do that at either of my parents funerals. I would just say Catholic tradition usually allows for the family to sit at the front for weddings and funerals. I’m surprised that the funeral director wouldn’t move them. But they wouldn’t have done it to me

 

[Norseman82]

OTOH, I think it’s a positive thing that the server family is sitting close and watching the server. Mom can correct him when needed (after mass of course), i.e., when father has to wait too long for his prompts to be answered, or server is fidgety and not acting appropriately. My mom was always eagle eyed when my brother served and would let him know when he messed up on the ride home from church.

I don’t know if it is typical of parents to correct their kids’ performance of duties as an altar server (I don’t ever recall my mother doing that to me, and if there was any mother who would be prone to do so, it would be her, GRHS), should that not be the job of the priest / sacristan / senior altar server? When I lector, I see a lot of the “behind the scenes” that happens in the sacristy before and after Mass as well as what happens on the altar that may not be obvious to the congregation. One time I remember the altar servers - one on each side of the altar - going back and forth over how many times to ring the bells, using sign language - it reminded me of the Dave Allen “Did You Fart?” skit.

Now, maybe it’s different today - my mother could trust the sacristan / principal / clergy to do the correction and leave it at that, whereas today many parishes do not have that liturgical infrastructure?

ETA: By the way, Janet, awesome signature! My sentiments exactly!

 

[YADA]

I’ve trained altar servers. If we were to do training with parents present and tell them that it is not OK to sit in the section usually reserved for families at funerals and weddings, particularly if there was gossip about one particular family doing that, everyone would see that as calling out the “offending party” in front of everyone. No one would be fooled by that.

This is not a widespread problem. It does not belong in the limited time available for altar server training. It is easily solved in a “tactful, official, non-personal, and professional” way by just having the ushers take care of the issue if it ever comes up again, handling as if it had never happened before and was an innocent mistake and an isolated incident.

Besides, it may never happen again. (For instance, the server might tip them off.)

The servers in our parish are given an instruction manual - several printed sheets - usually before their training - but certainly when they are trained.

In addition to the basic instructions of duties they perform during the Mass - other items addressed are the time to arrive before Mass, proper attire, schedules, what do to about finding a substitute, etc … I think most parents read through it - This would be a perfect place to address where other family members should and should not sit when the youngster is serving.

Per the OP this occurred at a Funeral and or Nuptial Mass - those are outside the normal parish Weekend Mass schedule - Thus this would be a perfect place to address where other family members should and should not sit when the youngster is serving. Also - when the young person is recruited - since it is outside the normal setting - a written reminder could be emailed or sent home with the student … a verbal reminder could be made if the arrangements are made via phone call … One would expect that is done with the parent … as its the parent who would have to agree to the child serving and make sure they are present for serving.

If this is done in every case - as a practical matter - then there is no singling out a family or server, there is no question of animosity or preferential treatment

 

[mommy_k]

I decided what I will do, not do, or already did… a few days ago.

Thank you for your advice and feedback.

 

[StudentMI]

This got me thinking of the other side of the coin. If I was responsible for the planning of a funeral or wedding, if the behaviour of the alter server or the alter server’s family was that important to me, I would find my own alter servers. When I was a kid, I was an alter server at few funerals where I didn’t know the people and I was asked at the last minute. Obviously, since no one knows exactly when the death will occur, one can not plan a funeral.

However, now that I am an adult, if ever I had to plan a funeral and some kids I never met before showed up to be alter servers, I would be so grateful these kids helped out, I think I would overlook if their family took the front row.

To be honest, any funeral of a loved one I ever attended I just took the most convenient seat (even when I was in the procession). It never occured to me to notice who was in the front seat. I don’t even know if the spouse of the deceased was in the front seat:shrug:

I do understand your point. But I am a convert. My mom is a nominal Catholic, she was raised as one and in her own way never stopped practicing. It’s a very long story full of a lot of pain so I ask anyone reading this not to judge. She spoke with a very wise priest when she was very sick and he understood and literally changed her life by talking and praying with her… My father is a Lutheran but has become open to Catholicism and my sister is going to marry a cradle Catholic in the Church. Long way to say, I have no idea how to get “my own altar servers.”

And, long way to say, if my father or my sister (especially my sister) saw some altar servers parents taking the front seat at my mom’s funeral… Wow. That would be Mortal Kombat ugly. Flawless victory. And like I said, they would deserve it. Some kid’s parents take the front seat before the casket of a deceased human being they’re not related to or likely knew just to see their little snot be a good Catholic kid? Nope. No excuses. They were entirely inappropriate and insensitive to a grieving family. I wouldn’t blame the priest if he kicked the kid out of the altar servers or made it so he only served at Masses where his parents weren’t allowed.

My uncle or cousin in the front row? I would understand and grieve with them. Some brats parents? Get out.

 

[runningdude]

…
My good friend asked me to say something as they think I can do it in a nice way. Eek…I don’t know.

What do you think…myob, or tell them?

If you are an usher, you could politely inform the family that the first few rows are reserved for family. If you are not an usher, you could perhaps suggest this to an official usher. Otherwise, I do not see how it is your place to intervene.

 

[EasterJoy]

I decided what I will do, not do, or already did… a few days ago.

Thank you for your advice and feedback.

You are apparently not going to share what that was?

That’s OK. Hope it went well, whatever it was!!

 

[ConfusedLucy]

I hope it’s gone ok. These situations can be a bit of a minefield.

 

[SuperHappy]

Not every parish has ushers. It’s been years since I’ve seen “ushers” do anything other than take up the collection. Certainly haven’t been in a parish in decades that has someone that would find you a place to sit or do anything like that.

Not every parish has ushers but ours does and because of the church being rater large, they will direct people who are already seated to move in and make space for people who are coming in. Our ushers would have directed the offending family to move out of the reserved seats.

 

[SuperHappy]

To clarify: I think the meaning was not leaving the church, but leaving the Church.

Yes, when the evil one has been working on someone, that much can be the straw that breaks the camel’s back. That is not to say that no one ought to be corrected, but that we need to realize that there can be grave consequences when we correct those not under our jurisdiction. When someone confronts you with their intention to do something seriously wrong, looking for your approval, that is one thing. When they are doing something that is not so serious and aren’t looking for your opinion, though, you need to think twice before you offer your point of view. The same goes for out-of-parish visitors telling parish staff what needs to be done. Unless the topic is “this is how this parish treats visitors, and it isn’t good,” usually the pastor and staff have enough (name removed by moderator)ut from their own parishioners to keep them busy.

The meaning was indeed that people leave The Church completely when they are hurt or offended by the gossip or rudeness of others, especially people inserting themselves into situations such as this.