How will sedevacantists "know" when a "real" Pope is elected?

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Doug C.:
So how will the “real” Pope be elected if there are no valid Cardinals to do so?

God Bless,
Doug
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I’ve been asking that for days with no good answer. Good luck to you
 
As the person who asked this question in the first place, I am frustrated by the real lack of an answer. I don’t want to know why sedevacantists think the gates of hell have prevailed and there is no pope. I do not want to see the phrase “salvation outside of the Church” because that’s not the purpose of this thread.

Don’t try and convince me your position is correct - it’s a no win situation for you. But… you do have a chance to let me in on how you’ll recognize when the seat is properly filled. Telling me God will provide and you’ll know isn’t enough. My answer to that is that God has provided and I know right now.

Perhaps if I understand how a “proper” pope by your standards will be put in place, I can better understand why you don’t recognize JPII.

Kris
 
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Pax:
Karl,

Thanks once again for your (name removed by moderator)ut. It’s obvious why you are the founder of Catholic Answers. Since I’m not a sedevancantist I cannot recommend you to the position of Pope. However, if I were a sedevacantist I just might support your ascension to the chair. As a sedevacantist I would, however, have one condition before I would support you. You would have to take the Pontifical name of “Pope Karl the Clarifier.” 😃
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Hmmm. Maybe there is something to be said for sedevacantism. I guess it’s the religious equivalent of personal monarchism, which is the idea that the country ought to be ruled by a monarch and I just happen to be the guy. 😉
 
Try this website for a start as to why sedevacantists don’t recognize JP2 to be their Pontiff.

cathinsight.com/statusjpii.htm

As we have said already regarding who we would recognize as our Pope: a man who professes an unambiguous belief of ALL the truths the Holy Catholic Church teaches would be a start!!!
 
To Kwitz,

Why do you find it so difficult to believe that I am happy to leave the answer in God’s hands?
I would have thought that this is the best and safest thing to do.
My Faith in Him is strong enough to believe that He will fix it and is the only One who can. In the meantime I know he expects me to avoid false teaching and stick to “what has been handed down.”

Look at the mess your church is in as a result of it being taken and put in the hands of men!
I have N.O friends who hardly agree on anything.
One is “Charismatic” one spends half her life promoting “The Little Pebble” One campaigns for “Women for the Priesthood” another campaigns against “Women for the Priesthood”
Most practise birth control while two others argue in opposition to it. Where is YOUR unity?
I also know people who attend only the “Conservative N.O” and other who think it is too “pompous.”
Others I know attend only the SSPV.
Then there are those who attend the SSPX.

And you think that a mere person can fix all this?
If one can, then why hasn’t he/she done so by now?
Pur- leez. Get Real!
 
Please be aware that if we do not respond to any further posts it is most likely becasue your Forum moderators have censored us. Another sedevacantist member just contacted me and told me that several posts which she took great trouble to present were not allowed on and her account was disabled. Shame on you!

I can only assume from this that we are obviously
“too hot” for this N.O Forum to handle.
This alone should make some of you think!

I have had three messages from people on this forum wanting to know more about sedevacantism.
I will contact you at your email addresses.
Thank you and goodnight!
 
I’ve got a curious question for the Sedes: Has there ever been precedent for the current claim of mass schism and heresy (not apostasy, kindly use the correct theological term) and a lack of pope for so long with false popes reining from the Vatican? If you feel that you’ll be censored, feel free to email me from my site (link in sig) or PM me here.
 
Queen of Sheeba:
Please be aware that if we do not respond to any further posts it is most likely becasue your Forum moderators have censored us…
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Thank God for small favors.
I have had three messages from people on this forum wanting to know more about sedevacantism.
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There’s no accounting for taste, I guess.
 
Queen of Sheeba:
Please be aware that if we do not respond to any further posts it is most likely becasue your Forum moderators have censored us…
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Thank God for small favors.
Queen of Sheeba:
I can only assume from this that we are obviously “too hot” for this N.O Forum to handle.
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No one has an unlimited tolerance for nonsense.
I have had three messages from people on this forum wanting to know more about sedevacantism.
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There’s no accounting for taste, I guess.
 
Queen of Sheeba:
To Kwitz,

Why do you find it so difficult to believe that I am happy to leave the answer in God’s hands?
I would have thought that this is the best and safest thing to do.
My Faith in Him is strong enough to believe that He will fix it and is the only One who can. In the meantime I know he expects me to avoid false teaching and stick to “what has been handed down.”

Look at the mess your church is in as a result of it being taken and put in the hands of men!
I have N.O friends who hardly agree on anything.
One is “Charismatic” one spends half her life promoting “The Little Pebble” One campaigns for “Women for the Priesthood” another campaigns against “Women for the Priesthood”
Most practise birth control while two others argue in opposition to it. Where is YOUR unity?
I also know people who attend only the “Conservative N.O” and other who think it is too “pompous.”
Others I know attend only the SSPV.
Then there are those who attend the SSPX.

And you think that a mere person can fix all this?
If one can, then why hasn’t he/she done so by now?
Pur- leez. Get Real!
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Queen of Sheeba please tell me what is so different from what you are saying about our current state of affairs from that of past times. We have always had different groups within the Church pushing the limits or testing Church doctrine. The Church has sustained through this. On one hand you say you trust the Holy Spirit to protect the faithful but on the other you are implying that the Holy Spirit must have left the VAT II Council and let a false Pope to be elected. Either it is true that Jesus Christ sent the Holy Spirit to protect the Church from the these things you are espousing or it’s not - which is it?
 
QUOTE=OhioBob]Thank God for small favors.
You’re just down right rude, Bob.** You need to take lessons in civility. **
No one has an unlimited tolerance for nonsense.

**I beg to differ. Your church has an unlimited tolerance for nonsense: every pagan, schismatic and heretical group under the sun has been welcomed into it’s bosom. But, for people who refuse to relinquish The Faith of our Fathers, it has no tolerance. **
There’s no accounting for taste, I guess.

**I’ll be praying for those people to come to the fullness of the truth. And I’ll be praying for you too, Bob. **
 
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choicenctr:
Queen of Sheeba please tell me what is so different from what you are saying about our current state of affairs from that of past times. We have always had different groups within the Church pushing the limits or testing Church doctrine. The Church has sustained through this. On one hand you say you trust the Holy Spirit to protect the faithful but on the other you are implying that the Holy Spirit must have left the VAT II Council and let a false Pope to be elected. Either it is true that Jesus Christ sent the Holy Spirit to protect the Church from the these things you are espousing or it’s not - which is it?
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Thank you choicectr for putting into better words what I’ve been trying to understand. I truly see it as the either or situation you present.

QueenofSheba - I do understand how you can say “trust in God” what I fail to understand is how you believe He failed us and his Church.
 
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OhioBob:
So did the reformers.

Please excuse my lack of charity but I guess I can’t figure out why sedevacantists go through this exercise on the Catholic Answers forum. You certainly have a right to your opinion, however, I think you shouldn’t be surprised if those opinions raise some ire.
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It is very easy to see why sedevacantists would be on this forum that thread “Would I be welcome here” had 6086 views before it was closed - more than any other thread on this board. I for one am very disappointed that the majority of sedevacantists have now been banned from posting here. It is not hard to see that there are alot of disgruntled Catholics here (As I am one). To think this “Ship” is just sailing merrily about on course is crazy. I have checked out the web sites that have been posted and am very surprised to learn of this huge “underground movement”. I, like apparently many others want to know what is going on!

By the way I’m starting to become a little leary of what I post here for fear of being banned:(
 
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CindyJ:
You’re just down right rude, Bob
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I have my moments, thanks. 👍

I guess repeatedly having the Holy Father accused of heresy by people who place their own judgement and interpretation above that of the Church tends to bring out my best. :cool:
 
Queen of Sheeba:
To Lamb and Ham,

I find it truly amazing that you cannot see contradiction in that example. however I will take it further and expand in the hope that you can.

In Unitatis Redintergratio (UR) #3, …LONG QUOTE… (UR#3)

Based on the above, however, it is impossible to understand how “the life of grace” and the three theological virtues (faith, hope, and charity) could have been conserved in heretical and schismatic communities-rebels against the authority of the one legitimate Church of Christ-since here they are referred to as “communities,” that is, foreign organisms opposed to the one Church of Christ, and not as individuals. Moreover, one would like to know what possibilities for “sanctification” and what “truths” are contained in the doctrines and manner of life of the heretical and schismatic communities who oppose the Roman Pontiff and all that is Catholic.
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Protestant and schismatic churchs administer the sacrament of baptism which confers sanctifying grace on the recipient. So, I would say there is some limited participation in “sanctification” and “truth.” Unless, of course you deny that this sacrament is valid OR that protestant churchs administer it. Also on the list of things that many protestant churchs teach:

Christ is God.

Christ is Man.

Christ died on the cross.

Christ died for our sins.

Some protestant churchs even teach the real presence of Christ in the Eucharist (granted in the error of consubstantiation).

So, tell me…
  1. Are these statements untrue?
OR
  1. Are there no protestant churchs that teach these things to be true?
It has to be 1 or 2 or you have to admit that churchs outside the One True Church actually teach some Truth.
 
To Ralph… <<<So there can be salvation for those outside the Catholic Church…Heresy or fuller understanding of the Truth?>>>>

Actually what it means is those who die in the State of Grace are united to the Church through desire, so the teaching No Salvation Outside the Church stands, it is dogma, de fide teaching, to deny this fact puts one outside the Church.
 
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myrna:
Actually what it means is those who die in the State of Grace are united to the Church through desire, so the teaching No Salvation Outside the Church stands, it is dogma, de fide teaching, to deny this fact puts one outside the Church.
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Right on! …And Vatican II, as well as the current magisterium affirms this teaching.
 
The restoration of the Tridentine Mass and cessation of the NOM would be a start.

The Mass is the Mass is the Mass. We Catholics have had only one Mass since the Last Supper. Many Rites, Many Liturgues, one Mass.

Revocation of the V2 documents that are heretical and ambigious, and unable to be reconciled with Tradition.
It is an ontological impossibility for an Ecumenical Council to approve heretical texts. All Ecumenical Councils, by their nature, are infallible.

That is just a start.
That “start” signifies the end- of Catholic Faith - and the beginning of Protestantism.

Other people can add to that.
Sure they can. Errors proliferate once Doctrinal Sanity is abandoned.

But if you are really interested why not visit the sedevacantist sites.
Preservation of sanity.

Why reinvent the wheel here
I agree. Let thre sedes have their sites. Embrace diversity.
 
The sedevacantists, who do not presume to elect popes, realize that a bona fide pope would not only be traditional in faith, but would also be accepted by all genuine traditional Catholics, not just a handful of them.

We Catholics (all of whom are “traditional” in that “traditional"in reference to"Catholic” is an unnecessary modifier/qualifier) do accept him as Pope.

That makes us the real Trads.

Have a nice day.
 
Cite for Cathoics any official Magisterial Document teaching a sucession of heretics can ascend to the Papacy and teach heresy.

Cite for Catholic the MAgisterial Document Teachin an Ecumenical Council can teach Heresy.

You folks reject Vatican I - please reread it - so it is no surprise you rejct Vat Two.
 
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