How would you go about "growing" a small EC parish?

[Draper]

I would like to get some ideas on how to “grow” a small Byzantine Catholic parish? For the 15 years that I have been attending (part time) there has been almost no local outreach, no evangelization and very little external fundraising.

The results are predictable. A shrinking weekly census and collection, an aging congregation and money concerns. The current pastor has no interest in anyone’s ideas but his own. He’ll either curtly dismiss them on the spot (in front of others) or ignore them altogether – especially if they are submitted in writing.

The pastor is extremely self-centered, arrogant and coarse. Many parishioners’ responses have been to “pull back” and “lay low.” They take him less and less seriously and this in turn frustrates him. It has really been a horrific process to experience. There really doesn’t seem to be a way to get through to him – in part I suspect, due to his Easter European heritage.

In his defense though, he predecessor wasn’t any more effective at leading the parish. I have read several stories on-line about small EC parishes that were simply shuttered at some point and that terrifies me. The real estate our church sits on is worth $$$ and many feel that our parish might just be closed so that the land could be sold.

Does anyone have any success stories they can share of another parish in this sort of situation that finally found the key to thriving? Thank you.

 

[ByzCath08]

I would like to get some ideas on how to “grow” a small Byzantine Catholic parish? For the 15 years that I have been attending (part time) there has been almost no local outreach, no evangelization and very little external fundraising.

The results are predictable. A shrinking weekly census and collection, an aging congregation and money concerns. The current pastor has no interest in anyone’s ideas but his own. He’ll either curtly dismiss them on the spot (in front of others) or ignore them altogether – especially if they are submitted in writing.

The pastor is extremely self-centered, arrogant and coarse. Many parishioners’ responses have been to “pull back” and “lay low.” They take him less and less seriously and this in turn frustrates him. It has really been a horrific process to experience. There really doesn’t seem to be a way to get through to him – in part I suspect, due to his Easter European heritage.

In his defense though, he predecessor wasn’t any more effective at leading the parish. I have read several stories on-line about small EC parishes that were simply shuttered at some point and that terrifies me. The real estate our church sits on is worth $$$ and many feel that our parish might just be closed so that the land could be sold.

Does anyone have any success stories they can share of another parish in this sort of situation that finally found the key to thriving? Thank you.

How many people have you invited to come and see the Divine Liturgy? If they won’t evangelize, it has to start with you.

My parish has grown as more and more families have been invited to come and see. We have the benefit of having a wonderful pastor who has started several outreach opportunities throughout the city.

 

[Draper]

How many people have you invited to come and see the Divine Liturgy? If they won’t evangelize, it has to start with you.

My parish has grown as more and more families have been invited to come and see. We have the benefit of having a wonderful pastor who has started several outreach opportunities throughout the city.

Thanks for the (name removed by moderator)ut. I think it has to begin with the pastor. Unless the pastor is a good leader (as yours sounds to be), all other efforts will fail.

I would really like to hear about the outreach started by your pastor?

 

[Elizium23]

Draper, is this going to be another thread where you solicit advice and then dump on anyone making concrete suggestions? You’ve certainly dumped enough on your pastor already.

 

[pianistclare]

Well, there’s a fine line.
Parishes who actively try to “grow” are often accused of pandering, watering down liturgy to fill the pews, being interested only in $$$, you get the picture.

Perhaps that’s what he feels. That “growing a parish” is not nearly important as preserving a solid and faithful parish community.

I agree, that if you want more people to come…you should invite people yourself.
People attend RCIA because some Catholic answered their questions well, after all.
Next time you’re in a position to talk about the church you attend, speak highly about it, and your pastor. Curious folks who are seeking, will respond.

 

[Draper]

Well, there’s a fine line.
Parishes who actively try to “grow” are often accused of pandering, watering down liturgy to fill the pews, being interested only in $$$, you get the picture.

Perhaps that’s what he feels. That “growing a parish” is not nearly important as preserving a solid and faithful parish community.

I agree, that if you want more people to come…you should invite people yourself.
People attend RCIA because some Catholic answered their questions well, after all.
Next time you’re in a position to talk about the church you attend, speak highly about it, and your pastor. Curious folks who are seeking, will respond.

No, I don’t buy that. All Catholic parishes should be trying to bring the Gospel of Jesus Christ through His Church to as many people as possible. “Pandering” and “watering down liturgy” are entirely different matters. You offer them as what I call “stoppers.”

Inferring that a parish cannot be grown without “preserving a solid and faithful parish community” is also a stopper. So is offering “you should invite people yourself” as the only suggestion on how to grow a parish.

The parish has long been in decay with regard to its weekly census. When the current pastor began a few years ago, there was a temporary surge in attendance during his “honeymoon period.” He began talking about adding on to the church and creating more parking spaces (neither were needed) – but he did little to evangelize. That surge lasted about six months and now things are as low as I can recall in my 15 years there.

In all sincerity, exactly who should I invite? If someone asked me about the parish I would certainly paint the most flattering portrait I could. However most of my friends are either devout Latin Rite Catholics or they’re semi-pagans with no interest in organized religion.

Successful efforts to evangelize and grow a parish need to be team efforts from the parish, led by the pastor. I’m just looking for some ideas from people who have experienced success in this area.

 

[Draper]

FWIW, I have been studying my eparchy in the hopes of finding a parish that is obviously good at evagelizing and building its base of faithful. I want to do this so I can study what they have done. I have yet to find a single example.

I could fill a chalkboard with ideas gleaned elsewhere, but the reason for this thread is to see what other parishes have done that have actually worked.

 

[ByzCathCantor]

FWIW, I have been studying my eparchy in the hopes of finding a parish that is obviously good at evagelizing and building its base of faithful. I want to do this so I can study what they have done. I have yet to find a single example.

I could fill a chalkboard with ideas gleaned elsewhere, but the reason for this thread is to see what other parishes have done that have actually worked.

Draper, from some of your comments on another thread, I take it you may have encountered some things at your Eastern Catholic parish that may hinder evangelization. You’ve alluded to anti-Latin Catholic sentiment. Is that the case?

 

[Draper]

Draper, from some of your comments on another thread, I take it you may have encountered some things at your Eastern Catholic parish that may hinder evangelization. You’ve alluded to anti-Latin Catholic sentiment. Is that the case?

When I began at the parish 15 years ago, conversation was dominated by negative comments about “liberalism” (if anything was bad, it was termed to be “liberal” rather than dissenting) and attacks on the OF Mass.

That situation has actually improved. Partly because the surrounding diocese has changed due to new leadership (providing a lot more options for “traditional” Catholics) and because some have realized that such negative banter turns-off visitors.

One thing my EC parish does not suffer from is a history of “latinizations” or a long struggle with other elements of the Church – the parish began in the 1980s in the Western US.

What hasn’t improved is the excuse making. I watched 3 people discuss ways in which to attract more people to our parish last Sunday. It was interesting to me so I listened. Another person joined the conversation, clearly became annoyed and began talking about the parish’s new hanging candle lamps. The original 3 almost immediately dispersed after that.

The person was annoyed not because of what was being talked about (it was a gentle, positive conversation) but because it did reinforce the parish’s need to “do something” about its membership. He offered something (the lamps) from what the parish does focus on (material goods) as an equivalency or excuse.

To answer your question, other than the pastor and maybe a small handful of people, I think the parish is more open to attracting new members than ever.

 

[Zabdi_Premjit]

I would like to get some ideas on how to “grow” a small Byzantine Catholic parish?

Pregnancies and adoptions.

Pray a lot. Live the faith. Expose others to the church. Invite neighbours, coworkers, etc. Find ways to casually mention something unique about you faith in conversations - not aggressively, but in passing. Perhaps it will pique someone’s interest and they will ask about it.’

Best way may be inviting the local community or organisations with an interest in religious things to events at the parish, but that might be hard if the priest is against it. Maybe parishioners can organise independent events? For example, and akathist and potluck with discussion, or a canon and a relevant film.

Just throwing thoughts out there.

 

[Draper]

Pregnancies and adoptions.

Pray a lot. Live the faith. Expose others to the church. Invite neighbours, coworkers, etc. Find ways to casually mention something unique about you faith in conversations - not aggressively, but in passing. Perhaps it will pique someone’s interest and they will ask about it.’

Best way may be inviting the local community or organisations with an interest in religious things to events at the parish, but that might be hard if the priest is against it. Maybe parishioners can organise independent events? For example, and akathist and potluck with discussion, or a canon and a relevant film.

Just throwing thoughts out there.

I think inviting other organizations to the parish for a Divine Liturgy is a good idea. Groups like the nearby Newman Center, or the local KofC chapter and others.

Thanks for the thoughts.

 

[Phillip_Rolfes]

I suggest checking out the books Rebuilt and Tools for Rebuilding, as well as Matthew Kelly’s book The Four Signs of a Dynamic Catholic. These three books are great resources not only for creating outreach-type initiatives in the parish, but also engaging folks already involved in the parish.

A caveat however, I don’t believe many large-scale initiatives will gain much traction without the support of the parish priest. So that takes you back to simply inviting friends, family, co-workers, etc. to Divine Liturgy with you.

 

[Draper]

I suggest checking out the books Rebuilt and Tools for Rebuilding, as well as Matthew Kelly’s book The Four Signs of a Dynamic Catholic. These three books are great resources not only for creating outreach-type initiatives in the parish, but also engaging folks already involved in the parish.

A caveat however, I don’t believe many large-scale initiatives will gain much traction without the support of the parish priest. So that takes you back to simply inviting friends, family, co-workers, etc. to Divine Liturgy with you.

Thanks much for the book recommendations.

I agree – if the pastor isn’t on-board and leading, large-scale initiatives are destined to fail.

 

[Peter_J]

I would like to get some ideas on how to “grow” a small Byzantine Catholic parish? For the 15 years that I have been attending (part time) there has been almost no local outreach, no evangelization and very little external fundraising.

The results are predictable. A shrinking weekly census and collection, an aging congregation and money concerns. The current pastor has no interest in anyone’s ideas but his own. He’ll either curtly dismiss them on the spot (in front of others) or ignore them altogether – especially if they are submitted in writing.

The pastor is extremely self-centered, arrogant and coarse. Many parishioners’ responses have been to “pull back” and “lay low.” They take him less and less seriously and this in turn frustrates him. It has really been a horrific process to experience. There really doesn’t seem to be a way to get through to him – in part I suspect, due to his Easter European heritage.

In his defense though, he predecessor wasn’t any more effective at leading the parish. I have read several stories on-line about small EC parishes that were simply shuttered at some point and that terrifies me. The real estate our church sits on is worth $$$ and many feel that our parish might just be closed so that the land could be sold.

Does anyone have any success stories they can share of another parish in this sort of situation that finally found the key to thriving? Thank you.

Hi Draper. First let me say thank you for this thread, and I appreciate what you’re trying to do.

Now the question I would ask is, Does your parish have an annual bazaar, an annual parish picnic, or anything of that sort?

Incidentally, it was fifteen years ago this summer that I first attended a Greek Catholic parish. (Granted it was a couple years after that that I made it weekly.)

 

[Draper]

Hi Draper. First let me say thank you for this thread, and I appreciate what you’re trying to do.

Now the question I would ask is, Does your parish have an annual bazaar, an annual parish picnic, or anything of that sort?

Incidentally, it was fifteen years ago this summer that I first attended a Greek Catholic parish. (Granted it was a couple years after that that I made it weekly.)

No, it does not.

A few weeks ago I was in the center of downtown in the small city where I live – in the plaza which can be rented by anyone. The local Greek Orthodox Parish was putting on their annual “Greek Festival” which impressed me enough to take some photos. There were a lot of people having a good time – it was open to the public. Lots of people were being exposed to their parish and they were selling a lot of food, drink and crafts.

I emailed the photos to the pastor, our deacon and a few “parish elders” with some very careful wording – just an example of what other parishes are doing.

• The pastor did not acknowledge the email as expected.
• The deacon publicly acknowledged it to everyone on distribution for the email but noted that we might have trouble doing what the GO’s do (even though we have more parishioners.) An honest reply.
• One elder said we could never do anything like that because we lack the ethnic commonality of the Greeks. (There seemed to be people of all ethnicities in attendance.) Then he shifted the conversation to recent purchases of material goods at our parish and “spiritual improvements.” The shifting of the conversation is very common in this parish whenever parish evangelization/outreach/fundraising is brought up. The “spiritual improvements” comment was downright insulting given its lack of basis in fact.
• Two other “elders” replied in private thanking me for the report and agreeing that we should establish some sort of annual event ourselves.

 

[Peter_J]

Then he shifted the conversation to recent purchases of material goods at our parish and “spiritual improvements.” ****

That sounds familiar. For example, most Catholic parishes in my area have no coffee hour after mass (Btw does your church have one?), and I think the underlying reason is a church-isn’t-for-socializing mentality.

I don’t know if that’s a prevalent attitude at your parish, but **if **it is perhaps you might start with a slightly different approach: suggesting an annual day-of-recollection, lenten retreat, or something of that sort. Of course, like you said in your last post, you’ll want very careful wording, drawing on your past experiences with them to hit on something that at least a few of the elders might throw their support behind.

 

[Draper]

That sounds familiar. For example, most Catholic parishes in my area have no coffee hour after mass (Btw does your church have one?), and I think the underlying reason is a church-isn’t-for-socializing mentality.

I don’t know if that’s a prevalent attitude at your parish, but **if **it is perhaps you might start with a slightly different approach: suggesting an annual day-of-recollection, lenten retreat, or something of that sort. Of course, like you said in your last post, you’ll want very careful wording, drawing on your past experiences with them to hit on something that at least a few of the elders might throw their support behind.

Yes, my Eastern parish does have a coffee social following Sunday Divine Liturgy. It is a legacy from our founding pastor who felt fellowship was very important. He was absolutely right. Sadly our weekly coffee social is now eroding under the current pastor.

My Latin Rite parish has a coffee social after 1 of 7 Sunday Masses and even that one gets cancelled now and then. I think the reason it doesn’t have more is because of how people have been treated over the years. They have been treated poorly and they attend Mass to satisfy their obligation. Then they want to be gone as soon as Mass is over.

Many parishioners also don’t want anything to do with the entrenched laity who spend their days defending their turf.

I think a “day-of-recollection, lenten retreat”,etc. would largely be a waste of time until the parish receives adequate leadership.

 

[babochka]

FWIW, I have been studying my eparchy in the hopes of finding a parish that is obviously good at evagelizing and building its base of faithful. I want to do this so I can study what they have done. I have yet to find a single example.

Can you share with us what sucess would look like to you?

My parish, for example, has quadrupled attendance in 10 years. To the outsider, that would not look like success, however. To us, who know what it was like before, it is tremendous. We have gone from an attendance of 8-10 little old ladies and a few old men, to a vibrant parish of 23 families, with attendance of 60-80 every Sunday. We also have extremely committed families. This is tremendous growth, but we have a long way to go. We are not self-sustaining and we rely on the generosity of our bishop and outsiders to make our bills. We have no rectory and our priest has to work a 2nd full-time job to support his family. We would have to double in size before we could really be self-supporting, but one cannot expect these things to happen overnight. It isn’t like you hold an event, and all of a sudden your pews are full of contributing parishoners.

So, how have we more than quadrupled attendance in 10 years? We have a few events, but honestly, they are extremely difficult for our parish to put on. We simply don’t have the manpower. Our pastor is working 2 jobs, and most of us are either quite elderly or have several young children. We finally have some teenagers and we hope to be able to put them to work in the near future. We are also a commuter parish, as most in the eparchy are. We come from all over the city to be able to attend the parish that we love and spend time with our church family, but this situation makes it difficult to have an active parish life during the week.

Everybody in our parish has a story, how they came to visit, and what made them stay. For me, it is my childhood parish. I came back for a visit after more than 15 years, because I missed it. The more I just visited, the more I missed it. Finally, I told my husband that I really wanted to be there full-time, because the parish was in dire straits, and if everybody just visited, rather than making a committement to the parish, it would not be there for me to visit.

Other familes visit for various reasons, and stay for various reasons. Probably 1/3 of our parish are converts to Catholicism and a good number of those have been baptized and/or chrismated in our parish. Most of the families in our parish are quite large, and we are very family-friendly. Nobody is going to look at you with anything but sympathy if your kids act up sometimes. For the most part, people visit because they know somebody who goes there, because somebody has made a personal connection with them and invited them. Sometimes, a connection is made and those people stay. We have one parishioner who is there because he reached out for a priest in a time of crisis, and our priest took the time to listen. He’s one of the few who lives in the neighborhood.

We have always had a coffee hour after the liturgy, but for nearly 6 years now, we have had a full-blown lunch. Father refers to it as our own miracle, that we have managed to keep it up for so long. We have an entirely volunteer sign-up sheet to take a week to feed the parish after liturgy. Usually we plan to feed 50 -60. I cook about every 6 weeks. Not everyone participates, and sometimes single people join together a few times a year to contribute. This is something that seems to appeal to visitors.

I wish we were able to do bible studies and outreach and various activities, and so does our pastor, but we are limited in the scope of what we can do by our size and the availability of our families and priest I think we’ve done pretty well with what we have.

While reaching out to other Catholic parishes is important, it is not evangelization and should not be a significant way in which our parishes attract people. Our pastor says Mass at a parish near his home a twice a week, and also hears confessions there. His kids go to school there, so they are quite involved in that community as well. We regularly get visitors from that parish. For several years, the 8th grade class from a local Catholic school has come for a tour of our church. We occasionally get RCIA classes and somebody in the parish regularly invites all RCIA groups in the area. When I returned to the parish after a long absence, I did so by brinigng my high school religious education class from the parish that I had been attending.

We get visitors “off the street” pretty regularly, often looking for the parish down the street. They are the least likely to return. Sometimes, they don’t even stay for the whole liturgy. I think they are worried that they aren’t really in a Catholic Church, or maybe it just is too long for them. We try to reassure them, but if they’ve never heard of the Byzantine rite before they come, our picture of the Pope on the wall seems unable to convince them.

Mostly, though the question is this: Once we get people through the door, how do we keep them? They have to find Christ in us. They have to encounter a people, starting with the priest, but flowing to the entire parish, that is honestly seeking to find Christ and to live a life of holiness. We have to reach out to one another with the very love of Christ, to bring him to each other in the way we worship and the way we love. That is our purpose for existing. Without that, all of our efforts at outreach, no matter how grand or humble, are in vain.

 

[babochka]

Thanks for the (name removed by moderator)ut. I think it has to begin with the pastor. Unless the pastor is a good leader (as yours sounds to be), all other efforts will fail.

If you’re pretty sure all efforts will fail because of the failings of your pastor, what is the point of this thread?

 

[Draper]

If you’re pretty sure all efforts will fail because of the failings of your pastor, what is the point of this thread?

It’s something I have concluded after I started this thread. So in that sense, this thread was worthwhile.