Hurt by it all

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Lutheranteach

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I’ve talked the first communion issue ad nauseam, I know, and I apologize to those I’ve bored with it. I guess I just wanting to vent and have no where else to really do so.

I have never been through a tougher year an a spiritual level, and I try to be charitable when discussing this. I guess I’ll just try to keep it short. I’ve felt betrayed and patronized by the DRE and Priest at my son’s parish school. I feel no one is listening to me when it comes to this —*and sometimes it’s even as if I’m being patted on the head and told “there there little protestant. You can’t possibly understand all of this so just go sit down and it will all be all right.” I’m so tired of being told it’s not a big deal. I’m making too much of it. It’s only what I want to make of it. It doesn’t decide anything. That this is next to nothing and I need to save my “fight” for confirmation.

Well, to me it is a big deal. I think I should have some say in it. And no one is even listening to a single concern of mine, or when the do, they’re dismissed as meaningless. This scenario is everything I made clear I did NOT want at the start of this year and they have pushed every button they could to make my wife want this. — Catholic guilt is alive and well…even though she’s so outside of it.

If I let it go on, I feel I’m being shut out of our son’s spiritual life and my own religious traditions will die with me ( I am the adult member of my side of the family).

If I stop it, than I am the bad guy, the anti-Catholic which is such an unfair portrayal as I’ve worked very hard for 20 years to bring things closer. A week ago, I was happy to go to mass and enjoyed so much about it. Now, I can’t drive past a Catholic Church without incredible rage.

It’s very late, I’m making no sense, and I haven’t been able to sleep of take a deep breath for a week. I’ve goy 48 hours to figure this out somehow.
 
I am very sorry you feel this way and I have reviewed the thread about your child’s first communion and so forth. to be far it seems, especially the way you started your thread, that not all the frustration stems from actions on the part of the Catholic parish staff, but also from misunderstandings with your spouse about the child’s future, and until that addressed, neither your Lutheran nor your Catholic pastors will be able to help you go any further with this. As a DRE myself I also want to remind you, which you probably already know, that she cannot make rulings about who may or may not be received into the Church or receive the sacraments, that perogative belongs to the pastor alone.
 
puzzleannie said:
I am very sorry you feel this way and I have reviewed the thread about your child’s first communion and so forth. to be far it seems, especially the way you started your thread, that not all the frustration stems from actions on the part of the Catholic parish staff, but also from misunderstandings with your spouse about the child’s future, and until that addressed, neither your Lutheran nor your Catholic pastors will be able to help you go any further with this. As a DRE myself I also want to remind you, which you probably already know, that she cannot make rulings about who may or may not be received into the Church or receive the sacraments, that perogative belongs to the pastor alone.
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It was totally decided and has changed in the last two to three months. I’m glad to hear you are a DRE because my son’s, and another I know through a ecumenical group are so far apart on things.

DRE A: First communion implies that the parents desire to raise their child in the Catholic Faith and does make the child a practicing Catholic who is expected to follow the rules of the church the best they can understand them and that the parents will aid in this.

DRE B (one at wife’s church): It’s just a right of passage on a spiritual journey and doesn’t imply or commit parents to anything nor does it make someone Catholic. Parents have no obligation.

I think the conflicting info is the root of the problem. Wife hears what she wants to hear and explores no further. I’m a “that doesn’t sound quite right” guy and investigates.

Our DRE says that priest does not have the time or desire to review the files, and takes her recommendations — shocks me a bit.
 
You need to talk to the priest, pronto.

Your child is a Lutheran by baptism. For him to receive First Communion in the Catholic Church is a ‘conversion’, that is that from that time the child is considered Catholic with all the rights and obligations that that entails.

If there is no intention to continue raising him in the Catholic faith then, IMHO, it is totally inappropriate to have him receive First Communion in the Catholic Church but the pastor is the final authority on this. Speak to him ASAP.
 
DRE A is telling you the truth.

DRE B sounds like she needs removing from her position. The priest to if what she says is true.

It is not just a right of passage, getting your driving licence or drinking your first beer are rights of passage, first communion is another step towards becoming a full adult member of the Catholic Church which is completed at Confirmation.

Your wife needs to stop treating both the Catholic Church and the Lutheran faith community in such blatant disrespect and pick which one she wants to be a member of, you cannot truly be both as you are clearly aware, they are both based on certain beliefs, beliefs which if you do not hold you are not a true member.

What she is doing is dishonest and deceitful, she [edited] does not hold the faith of either of these communities but is just pretending because she likes the personal benefits of belonging.

You have my sympathy, this must be terribly frustrating for you, but the key issue is your wife’s [edited]
The first communion issue is just a symptom of this deeper problem which puts her very salvation in jeopardy as well as the salvation of your son. In my experience most children brought up in this situation end up agnostic, indifferent or even turn atheist out of sheer frustration with the whole mess.
 
Advocatus_Fidei said:
DRE A is telling you the truth.

DRE B sounds like she needs removing from her position. The priest to if what she says is true.

It is not just a right of passage, getting your driving licence or drinking your first beer are rights of passage, first communion is another step towards becoming a full adult member of the Catholic Church which is completed at Confirmation.

Your wife needs to stop treating both the Catholic Church and the Lutheran faith community in such blatant disrespect and pick which one she wants to be a member of, you cannot truly be both as you are clearly aware, they are both based on certain beliefs, beliefs which if you do not hold you are not a true member.

What she is doing is dishonest and deceitful, she is an imposter who does not hold the faith of either of these communities but is just pretending because she likes the personal benefits of belonging.

You have my sympathy, this must be terribly frustrating for you, but the key issue is your wife’s egotism which does not allow her to have faith in God but instead she worships herself and the god she has made in her own mind, which leads her to treat both our communities, catholic and lutheran, with contempt while using them to fulfil her personal needs.

It has nothign to do with catholic guilt or anything like that.

The first communion issue is just a symptom of this deeper problem which puts her very salvation in jeopardy as well as the salvation of your son. In my experience most children brought up in this situation end up agnostic, indifferent or even turn atheist out of sheer frustration with the whole mess.
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Lutheranteach said:
DRE A: First communion implies that the parents desire to raise their child in the Catholic Faith and does make the child a practicing Catholic who is expected to follow the rules of the church the best they can understand them and that the parents will aid in this.

DRE B (one at wife’s church): It’s just a right of passage on a spiritual journey and doesn’t imply or commit parents to anything nor does it make someone Catholic. Parents have no obligation.
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DRE B is so lying.

I do agree with the other posters though. You and your wife need to sit down and decide together exactly what you both want for your child. I’m not sure why he is going to parish school if he is supposed to be being raised Lutheran. Why isn’t he in a Lutheran Church school - especially on Sunday mornings. You guys as parents need to pick one religion and stick with it.

I’m an adult child of parents that wanted to let me decide what I wanted to be. That left me with a very difficult road to follow as an adult. Do your kiddo a favor and pick one religion and stick with it.

And if he is ready for First Holy Communion and wants to follow through, let him. Really this should not be about your ego (“my own religious traditions will die with me”), but about what your child wants spiritually.

If you feel he isn’t ready (and he certainly isn’t ready for First Communion in the Lutheran chruch since he has not been educated in that faith) then it is time to put a stop to all this until you, your wife and he makes a joint decision.
 
Lutheranteach said:
It was totally decided and has changed in the last two to three months. I’m glad to hear you are a DRE because my son’s, and another I know through a ecumenical group are so far apart on things.

DRE A: First communion implies that the parents desire to raise their child in the Catholic Faith and does make the child a practicing Catholic who is expected to follow the rules of the church the best they can understand them and that the parents will aid in this.

DRE B (one at wife’s church): It’s just a right of passage on a spiritual journey and doesn’t imply or commit parents to anything nor does it make someone Catholic. Parents have no obligation.

I think the conflicting info is the root of the problem. Wife hears what she wants to hear and explores no further. I’m a “that doesn’t sound quite right” guy and investigates.

Our DRE says that priest does not have the time or desire to review the files, and takes her recommendations — shocks me a bit.
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I’m just a regular every day Joe here, but to me as a Catholic information A) sounds more correct that B)… B) comes of as merely an attempt to appease people, that isn’t what the faith is about. First communion is important, indeed comunion it’s self is critically important, it’s the most powerful affirmation of faith we can make. B) loses that completely
 
People never believe me when I tell them that it is an extremely bad idea for a person with real religious convictions to marry someone with different religious convictions. Logically, this means that beyond the teenage years, its also a bad idea to DATE someone of another faith. Prevention is the only cure for tragic love!

You have my sympathies and I hope more people look further ahead based on your difficult experience.
 
Please phone the parish to make an appointment with the pastor asap. If he and you cannot agree to a time to meet, have your notes ready and be prepared to talk with him in detail over the phone. Thank you for being serious in the faith. Pray for your wife.
 
I’m sorry that you are so frustrated. I am sorry you are getting such bad information. I’m sorry your wife is still so stubborn.

With such little time left, I don’t know if you can contact someone at the diocese and rat out these incompetent people at the parish. But, I would sure try.

Just put your foot down and say ‘no’ to FHC this weekend. Look, a kid can receive FHC anytime after he’s deemed ready.

The parade of communicants this coming weekend isn’t the only opportunity your son would have to receive FHC. If and when you decide as a family that he will be raised Catholic, he can receive FHC at any time, at any Mass. You just have to talk to the priest about it to ensure he agrees that your son is ready.

So, it’s not like it’s this weekend or never. It could be next weekend, next month, next year.

So, put your foot down, say no, and then contact your diocese and let them know what the DRE is up to.
 
It appears it’s too late to really stop it, but I did place this note in his file when I met again with the DRE:

To whom it may concern:

Our son X will be receiving his first communion on 5/1/10. I have reservations about this and have made them known to Mrs Y, the DRE of St. —*parish school. It should be known that I, the father of the child is Lutheran with no intention of converting and no intention of raising X exclusively as a Catholic. X was baptized in the Lutheran faith. My wife, the boy’s mother is a Catholic but was married in the Lutheran Church without dispensation. She routinely takes communion in both the Lutheran and Catholic Church. She is full agreement that X will not be raised solely in the Catholic faith. X will receive communion in the Lutheran Church when he reaches 5th grade as is customary in this area. We have made this all well known to Mrs. Y and she has indicated on multiple occasions that this is not a problem and that there is no obligation connected with X receiving first communion.

Mrs. Y has repeatedly assured me that receiving first holy communion in the Catholic Church does not make X Catholic, and I have made it clear that neither my wife or I am looking for X to become Catholic at this time.

I asked her to sign it, which she did, and placed it in his file, I also had her make a copy of it which I kept. I am thinking of making another copy and sending to the diocese office as the priest always seems to be too busy to meet with me.

And before you beat up my lovely bride too much, I feel for her. She’s a protestant who hasn’t come to terms with it yet. (I believe that fully). I show her much charity as I can only imagine how difficult it is to separate from something that has made up so much of her life and identity for so long. And, the number of cafeteria Catholics make it hard. She has really convinced herself that it’s okay to hold the positions she holds and still be Catholic, and it’s hard to prove her wrong when so many Catholics are coloring outside the lines as it were.

As he takes FHC X will be wearing a Lutheran Rose lapel pin.
 
manualman said:
People never believe me when I tell them that it is an extremely bad idea for a person with real religious convictions to marry someone with different religious convictions. Logically, this means that beyond the teenage years, its also a bad idea to DATE someone of another faith. Prevention is the only cure for tragic love!

You have my sympathies and I hope more people look further ahead based on your difficult experience.
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I disagree vehemently with that position. I put the majority of this situation in the lap of the DRE and her talent for pushing my wife’s nostalgia buttons.
 
Lutheranteach said:
I disagree vehemently with that position. I put the majority of this situation in the lap of the DRE and her talent for pushing my wife’s nostalgia buttons.
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I know it probably cuts close to home, but I hope you can see it perhaps from a different perspective. What your wife is doing is very highly problematic in terms of the faith. In fact by concelebrating the way she is she is sinning, fairly gravely. More over, in terms of childeren such arrangments become very complicated (as it has in your case)… Honestly I would say if your greatest issues are these, with the blessed sacrament then you’ll be lucky. I know of many such families where the childeren came out the other end out right Athiests. God prayed that we might be one, so the world would know the truth of the Gospel. What does preaching disunity do?

You may feel you can’t “stop it” right now, but this current course isn’t a good one. I’m sorry if this sounds harsh, it most certainly isn’t my intention. But these are most certainly the facts, most definently from a Catholic perspective… I would be hard pressed to believe the situation is any better from a Lutheran one.
 
To the OP:

Since the parish officials have been unresponsive, why not take this matter up with the Chancery? You are well within your rights to do so, especially since the integrity of the Sacrament of the Holy Eucharist will be compromised (as I see it) if your son is allowed to receive First Holy Communion.

It is up to the bishop to enforce the guidelines regulating the liturgy and the discipline of the sacraments. He needs to know about this.
 
Lutheranteach said:
I disagree vehemently with that position. I put the majority of this situation in the lap of the DRE and her talent for pushing my wife’s nostalgia buttons.
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Well, OK. I’ll grant you that THIS particular situation wouldn’t have happened in a world where everyone is well formed in the faith and stands on principle rather than convenience. Please send directions when you find such a place.

I don’t mean to pour salt on the wound, really I don’t. But ask yourself this. If your wife were a more convinced catholic (and you were unchanged), would this situation be easier or harder?
 
Lutheranteach said:
I disagree vehemently with that position. I put the majority of this situation in the lap of the DRE and her talent for pushing my wife’s nostalgia buttons.
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I would encourage you to be VERY careful that your anger does not show through to your son. That he does not see any harshness. The most beautiful thing that he can see is your love for your faith AND your neighbor. Those kinds of seeds will come back to you every time.

I know its hurtful to you but I just wanted to caution you. I assume you are gently teaching him the differences between Catholic and Lutheran communion? Knowledge is always good.

No matter how you raise him…he may change later on in life…but he may come back to his roots. I did. If he sees you in the light above…he may never feel a need to leave.

God Bless!
 
Phemie said:
Your child is a Lutheran by baptism. For him to receive First Communion in the Catholic Church is a ‘conversion’, that is that from that time the child is considered Catholic with all the rights and obligations that that entails.
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Baptism makes one a member of the mystical Body of Christ (the Catholic Church) and the child is technically Catholic (although not formally) until such time as that child attains the use of reason and either continues in the Catholic faith or falls away from it by being taught (in this case) Lutheranism.
 
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