Husband Refuses to Work

[Suse_B]

Thank you, crenfro. My therapist recommended Al-Anon a few months ago, and I have been going. She told me that it is helpful not only to those affected by alcoholism, but by abusive anger as well; many of the characteristics and effects on others are similar. It has been very helpful to me - very eye opening. I’ve realized many things…such as I’ve been living in denial and secrecy for years, I’ve been carrying a tremendous amount of anger and bitterness, that I can’t control or “fix” my husband’s behavior, and that I can still find my own happiness and be my own person.

I don’t mean to come across as criticizing my husband - I know he struggles with his own issues - whether it is depression or a personality disorder of some sort (which is what my therapist suspects), but whether he chooses to address his behavior is his choice. I cannot make it for him or make him do it. I can talk to him about it and provide the tools / resources, but ultimately it’s up to him. I can only make my own choice as to whether I want to be with him or not.

This whole string started months ago at the urging of my therapist, when I first started seeing her. You see, I really don’t mean for this to be a bashing of my husband. I was living in such denial that I really didn’t know whether the behavior was normal or not. Every time over the years I tried to discuss with him he would tell me I was overreacting, or that I was being mean to him, etc. I really thought it was me and that it was my fault. She urged me to start talking to others about the facts - not feelings - and get feedback from others. I had never really talked to anyone about this.

It’s not only that he has been unemployed for 13 years, he has been verbally abusive to both me and my son for years (we’ve both experienced phsychological trauma . e.g. one night my son was too tired to walk upstairs and go to bed and my husband screamed at him and said “You’re Mom’s going to take you out to the curb with the rest of the garbage!” My son was crying and I kept saying no that I would never do that and he just kept screaming that I was going to and my son was an “idiot” and that he was “garbage”.). He has been very controlling - e.g. I can only wear certain colors of nail polish, I have to close the window blinds a certain way, if I park the car in the garage “an inch too far to the left” or right he tells me, I have to make his sandwiches and cut them a certain way, etc. He is very afraid of people outside our families finding out we’re separated or that he has been diagnosed with depression and has made two references to family homicide (reminded me of other cases) if I tell anyone. Other times he has been perfectly charming, rational, loving, and caring.

I still struggle with needing validation from others re: “is this normal family/marital conflict or is this abnormal?” That’s why I keep throwing things out there for feedback, and why I haven’t filed for a civil divorce.

 

[flyingfish]

Thank you, crenfro. My therapist recommended Al-Anon a few months ago, and I have been going. She told me that it is helpful not only to those affected by alcoholism, but by abusive anger as well; many of the characteristics and effects on others are similar. It has been very helpful to me - very eye opening. I’ve realized many things…such as I’ve been living in denial and secrecy for years, I’ve been carrying a tremendous amount of anger and bitterness, that I can’t control or “fix” my husband’s behavior, and that I can still find my own happiness and be my own person.

I don’t mean to come across as criticizing my husband - I know he struggles with his own issues - whether it is depression or a personality disorder of some sort (which is what my therapist suspects), but whether he chooses to address his behavior is his choice. I cannot make it for him or make him do it. I can talk to him about it and provide the tools / resources, but ultimately it’s up to him. I can only make my own choice as to whether I want to be with him or not.

This whole string started months ago at the urging of my therapist, when I first started seeing her. You see, I really don’t mean for this to be a bashing of my husband. I was living in such denial that I really didn’t know whether the behavior was normal or not. Every time over the years I tried to discuss with him he would tell me I was overreacting, or that I was being mean to him, etc. I really thought it was me and that it was my fault. She urged me to start talking to others about the facts - not feelings - and get feedback from others. I had never really talked to anyone about this.

It’s not only that he has been unemployed for 13 years, he has been verbally abusive to both me and my son for years (we’ve both experienced phsychological trauma . e.g. one night my son was too tired to walk upstairs and go to bed and my husband screamed at him and said “You’re Mom’s going to take you out to the curb with the rest of the garbage!” My son was crying and I kept saying no that I would never do that and he just kept screaming that I was going to and my son was an “idiot” and that he was “garbage”.). He has been very controlling - e.g. I can only wear certain colors of nail polish, I have to close the window blinds a certain way, if I park the car in the garage “an inch too far to the left” or right he tells me, I have to make his sandwiches and cut them a certain way, etc. **He is very afraid of people outside our families finding out we’re separated or that he has been diagnosed with depression and has made two references to family homicide (reminded me of other cases) if I tell anyone. Other times he has been perfectly charming, rational, loving, and caring. **

I still struggle with needing validation from others re: “is this normal family/marital conflict or is this abnormal?” That’s why I keep throwing things out there for feedback, and why I haven’t filed for a civil divorce.

Wow, this SOB threatened to kill you and your son and gave examples of family homicides…

This goes so far beyond him refusing to get a job. Have you been seeing a therapist about the issue? You need to talk to a professional about what to do in such a situation. Maybe you need to go to the police and report his threats. I don’t know. I say you should see a therapist because they would be able to better assess his reaction. You need to make sure he doesn’t come to your house though, your son needs to be free of him.

Even if he gets a job you must not take him back, ever. The kind of behavior you described about him abusing your son and threatening to murder you… ** at best** he will wreck your son’s mental health.

 

[crenfro]

he has been verbally abusive to both me and my son for years (we’ve both experienced phsychological trauma . e.g. one night my son was too tired to walk upstairs and go to bed and my husband screamed at him and said “You’re Mom’s going to take you out to the curb with the rest of the garbage!” My son was crying and I kept saying no that I would never do that and he just kept screaming that I was going to and my son was an “idiot” and that he was “garbage”.). He has been very controlling - e.g. I can only wear certain colors of nail polish, I have to close the window blinds a certain way, if I park the car in the garage “an inch too far to the left” or right he tells me, I have to make his sandwiches and cut them a certain way, etc. He is very afraid of people outside our families finding out we’re separated or that he has been diagnosed with depression and

has made two references to family homicide (reminded me of other cases) if I tell anyone.

I hope you have a plan B and a plan C (and D and E if necessary) if you think he’s ever going to make good on this sort of talk.

Do you ever wonder if God’s trying to make your family healthier by having this crisis? Just a thought…

I like what fr. Corapi says about God allowing evil in order to bring about a greater good. You and your family will get through this, one way or another, and if you remain in God’s will during this it will all be for the better. And yes I know it’s easy to say that when you’re on the other side of a crisis.

Thanks for fighting the good fight. I’ll keep you in my prayers.

 

[Suse_B]

Wow, this SOB threatened to kill you and your son and gave examples of family homicides…

This goes so far beyond him refusing to get a job. Have you been seeing a therapist about the issue? You need to talk to a professional about what to do in such a situation. Maybe you need to go to the police and report his threats. I don’t know. I say you should see a therapist because they would be able to better assess his reaction. You need to make sure he doesn’t come to your house though, your son needs to be free of him.

Even if he gets a job you must not take him back, ever. The kind of behavior you described about him abusing your son and threatening to murder you… ** at best** he will wreck your son’s mental health.

Yes, I’ve talked with both my therapist, my son’s therapist, and my attorney about this. All agree this is a veiled threat. My therapist has told me she has been concerned for my safety since I first came to her, based on what I’ve d/w her. I really don’t think he would carry it out, but my therapist says even if he doesn’t, it’s a sign of his emotional maturity and it’s not normal to make reference to homicide to your spouse. My attorney (who btw is on the board of a local women’s domestic violence shelter) says unfortunatley the courts are reactive, not preventative, and there’s nothing legally I can do at this point.

I did confront him the first time he made the reference, based on advice from my therapist, and he made all kinds of excuses about how he would never “let that happen” (interesting choice of words instead of saying “I would never do that.”), it was a bad example, and then acused me of being unchristian-like for interpreting it as a threat.

 

[flyingfish]

Yes, I’ve talked with both my therapist, my son’s therapist, and my attorney about this. All agree this is a veiled threat. My therapist has told me she has been concerned for my safety since I first came to her, based on what I’ve d/w her. I really don’t think he would carry it out, but my therapist says even if he doesn’t, it’s a sign of his emotional maturity and it’s not normal to make reference to homicide to your spouse. My attorney (who btw is on the board of a local women’s domestic violence shelter) says unfortunatley the courts are reactive, not preventative, and there’s nothing legally I can do at this point.

Would it be possible for you to get a restraining order against him based on the threats? Maybe you should look into that. But I don’t want to give you this advice, because I don’t know how he would react. Wouldn’t want to set him off I guess.

Is it possible for you to get a permit to carry a handgun so that you could protect yourself from him in the event he turns violent?

What does your therapist say you should do? You said earlier that your husband still had access to your money, what does she think about that?

 

[Suse_B]

I hope you have a plan B and a plan C (and D and E if necessary) if you think he’s ever going to make good on this sort of talk.

Do you ever wonder if God’s trying to make your family healthier by having this crisis? Just a thought…

I like what fr. Corapi says about God allowing evil in order to bring about a greater good. You and your family will get through this, one way or another, and if you remain in God’s will during this it will all be for the better. And yes I know it’s easy to say that when you’re on the other side of a crisis.

Thanks for fighting the good fight. I’ll keep you in my prayers.

I can say with certainty that I am emotionally and mentally healthier now than I was before I asked my husband to move out, and according to two healthcare professionals who have been treating my son he is too (although he does still have his rough days, which is to be expected). I don’t know about my husband; he went to a therapist 4 times and then quit. He hasn’t gone since the end of March. He keeps saying he will, but ultimately has not.

My priest has counseled me to do 3 things-- Take care of my son, continue to grow in holiness, and pray about a timeline.

I can also say that I feel God’s presence through all of this. And, that while I was living with my husband and putting up with / denying / keeping things secret I did not feel His presence as strongly as I do now. And, that when thoughts of “I should just let my husband come back, believe the promises he’s making to me, and hope for the best” I feel a resounding “No”. So, I have surrendered all of this to God and trust that “all things work together for good for those who love the Lord.” I really don’t know where this will lead, but I do know God is giving me the fortitude to stand firm.

Thank you for your prayers!

 

[Suse_B]

Would it be possible for you to get a restraining order against him based on the threats? Maybe you should look into that. But I don’t want to give you this advice, because I don’t know how he would react. Wouldn’t want to set him off I guess.

Is it possible for you to get a permit to carry a handgun so that you could protect yourself from him in the event he turns violent?

What does your therapist say you should do? You said earlier that your husband still had access to your money, what does she think about that?

What I’m learning is that there are disconnects between what is best from an emotional / relationship standpoint and what is permissible legally. I cannot get a restraining order based on the threats; he would have to actually become physically violent with me in order for me to get a temporary restraining order and then he would have the chance to challenge it two weeks later. So much for protection of women in our state.

My therapist recommends I get an alarm system put in place, or at least be ready on the fly to have it put in the day I file for divorce (assuming that’s where this ultimately leads). Legally, I can’t keep him out of the house, and if I put in an alarm system and don’t give him the code I would be violating his legal rights. But, I can get one of those hand-held panic buttons to be able to use if need be. I just keep thinking how surreal this is and hoping that I’m just being overly cautious and paranoid.

Most of my $$ is in retirement accounts (a pretty big nest egg, I thank God for that blessing), and I’ve changed the pin so he can’t access. The rest I’m not concerned about. And again, I can’t legally bar him from our joint checking or money market accounts.

 

[flyingfish]

What I’m learning is that there are disconnects between what is best from an emotional / relationship standpoint and what is permissible legally. I cannot get a restraining order based on the threats; he would have to actually become physically violent with me in order for me to get a temporary restraining order and then he would have the chance to challenge it two weeks later. So much for protection of women in our state.

My therapist recommends I get an alarm system put in place, or at least be ready on the fly to have it put in the day I file for divorce (assuming that’s where this ultimately leads). Legally, I can’t keep him out of the house, and if I put in an alarm system and don’t give him the code I would be violating his legal rights. But, I can get one of those hand-held panic buttons to be able to use if need be. I just keep thinking how surreal this is and hoping that I’m just being overly cautious and paranoid.

Most of my $$ is in retirement accounts (a pretty big nest egg, I thank God for that blessing), and I’ve changed the pin so he can’t access. The rest I’m not concerned about. And again, I can’t legally bar him from our joint checking or money market accounts.

The panic button may be a good idea, and a tazer, pepper spray, handgun, anything that would help you to protect yourself and your son.

I don’t think that is being paranoid. This is not just a lazy husband you have on your hands, it’s someone who has threatened to murder you and your child on more than one occasion. This kind of thing is not normal.

If your therapist agrees, it might be a good idea to tell the police about it. Even if they can’t do anything legally, it’s good for them to have his threats on record.

 

[SJG1759]

The panic button may be a good idea, and a tazer, pepper spray, handgun, anything that would help you to protect yourself and your son.

I don’t think that is being paranoid. This is not just a lazy husband you have on your hands, it’s someone who has threatened to murder you and your child on more than one occasion. This kind of thing is not normal.

If your therapist agrees, it might be a good idea to tell the police about it. Even if they can’t do anything legally, it’s good for them to have his threats on record.

I agree with flyingfish; this is a very dangerous situation and you need to protect yourself and your son!

This reminds me of something one of the interventionists on the TV show Intervention says.

“Would you let a friend who acts like this near your child? Would you let a neighbor who acts like this near your child? Would you let a stranger who acts like this near your child? Would you let an enemy who acts like this near your child? Of course not! Fathers are supposed to be more safe, more trustworthy, and more responsible than friends, neighbors, strangers and enemies, and you’ve given him license to be less safe, less trustworthy, and less responsible than those people!”

Do whatever you can to get this man away from you and your son! I’ll keep praying for you.

 

[gmarie21]

Most of my $$ is in retirement accounts (a pretty big nest egg, I thank God for that blessing), and I’ve changed the pin so he can’t access. The rest I’m not concerned about. And again, I can’t legally bar him from our joint checking or money market accounts.

but can you incrimentally take from the joint and put into an account solely in your name? My husband’s ex did this, then again, he didn’t get upset by her doing this.

 

[Suse_B]

Thank you for all of your (name removed by moderator)ut and prayers. I like the pepper spray idea…that’s defintely something I’m comfortable doing.

My attorney says I can take small amounts out of our joint account and transfer to my own account, but I still need to have my paycheck go into the joint and can’t take out “too much” - it can’t appear that I’m “cutting him off” financially.

The Intervention comment rings so true. There were many days over the summer when my husband had my son in his care all day and he didn’t feed him breakfast or lunch. He said my son “had served himself snacks” so didn’t need any meals. He then would send him out in the heat for late afternoon football practice…with no meal all day. I say to myself if I had a sitter do that I would fire her on the spot. I’m still struggling on many issues to be brave enough to put a stop to this. I’ve d/w my husband many many times over the last few months how this is unacceptable. He just has the opinion that if my son has had snacks and therefore “isn’t hungry” he’s not “going to waste his time preparing food that’s not going to be eaten.” My son is back in school, thank goodness, so I’m in control of him getting breakfast and packing a good lunch daily.