I am an atheist thread 3

[1234]

Small decisions or claims can be met with a small amount of evidence. Terribly important decisions or claims need a much larger amount of evidence, for me

Excellent point, A.

 

[Socrates4Jesus]

1234:

Certainly your great confidence in the non-existence of God must be based on some irrefutable evidence. Don’t leave me hanging! Please tell me what it is that i might share the same faith in the truth that you yourself have.

 

[_A]

Pure Atheists
I am a pure atheist.

I don’t even know what a ‘pure atheist’ means. Is it just a poetic usage here?

I am against any form of dalliance with believers of any kind.

I don’t mind dallying with some kinds of believers.

Atheism cannot be reconciled in my mind with any weird beliefs in any form of the supernatural.

That sounds right to me, but I am reluctant to use absolutes very often.

My creed is simple:

I have no creed.

I don’t believe in God

Safe to say about all atheists.

I don’t believe in Gods

OK…

I don’t believe in Goddesses

Seems a little redundant, but OK…

I don’t believe in a human soul

Right here you are demonstrating your confusion. The term ‘atheist’ refers to a lack of belief in a god or gods, nothing more. I think it is quite true that most atheists (myself included) would agree with this statement. That doesn’t mean that it defines atheism.

I don’t believe in disembodied spirits

Has nothing to do with atheists. I don’t believe in them, but that again does not mean that all atheists are like me. Even if they were, it still is not a characteristic of atheism.

I don’t believe in reincarnation or any afterlife

As I understand it there are atheist buddists who do, but the important thing to remember is that atheism is ONLY the lack of belief in a god or gods.

I don’t believe that man is anything other than an animal with a high degree of self awareness

It is not implicit in atheism (but I personally agree with this statement)

I don’t believe in fate

I don’t believe in destiny

I don’t believe there is a meaning of life

All these say nothing about atheists, but again, I agree.

I don’t believe that irrational beliefs are ever right

Irrational beliefs could be right…so I guess I disagree here.

I don’t believe that religion and superstition should go unchallenged

Nothing about atheists there either. By the way, do you believe that religion and superstition should go unchallenged?

As a pure atheist I want to keep my creed pure.

I have no creed

I have no time for any form of superstition, I will not refrain from mocking it whenever I come across it.

I limit my mocking to appropriate times. Humour has it’s place (for me)

Do you disagree on any of these. There are numerous organizations that are atheists and about 1/2 declaree a creed the other half declare there is no creed.

I can see how this could be confusing. There may be an organization which calls itself atheist and has a creed, but there is no need for atheists to be organized at all.

This is one I found that in my opinion woild pretty well wrap up atheism in it’s true sense

You may have met a few atheists who fit that list quite well, but remember that the only thing linking all atheists is their lack of belief in a god or gods.

 

[_A]

1234:
Actually the creator USED to care about what you ate on Friday, that is not eating meat!! You could go to hell for that! THEN the Vatican II council came along and decided that you didn’t have to go to hell for eating meat on Friday–I wonder if all the people sent to hell for eating meat were let out?

I added the emphasis.

What an excellent question! Does anyone here know?

 

[_A]

1234;3272282:

How about a dead guy who got up and walked? It’s the most well documented historical fact in ancient history, 1234.

Why are there so many people (all non-christians) who don’t believe this particular story?

 

[_A]

Now let him show the evidence I (personally) am a liar or dishonest.

Since he is ignoring you, this is quite unlikely.

 

[_A]

Agreed. Then faith, in this case, might not be based on feelings but on objective evidence. We might cite many other examples of where a person has faith in something or someone based on evidence other than her feelings.

Do you agree?

No, I think it is just misusing the word ‘faith’. Trying to confuse it with the idea of belief. If you drop a pencil, you believe that it will fall DOWN. That is not faith. It is instead a large collection of experiences leading to a valid prediction (in my case) and a passing knowledge of the formulas which describe the effect.
Faith is ‘action based on belief’, not belief itself. Faith finds all it’s roots in feeling (like trust) not on empirical evidence.

 

[Socrates4Jesus]

I’m an agnostic, not an atheist.
… As an agnostic:

**I **don’t know. No one knows. It is unknowable.

but I have a real debate with those who try to force their religions down other peoples’ throats; who use their religion to defile our Constitutions and our Bill of Rights, which I do believe in, as one of the only bastions in this world against tyranny.

Sorry for the confusion, 1234.

 

[c659smith]

c659smith;3272358:

Very well, but i’m much more interested in your reasons for not believing in God. Will you tell me what you believe is the strongest evidence that He, She or It does not exist?

I do know that credible evidence exists for the existence of God. That is why I replied to the answer of evidence previously posted by as I did from post of 1234

Post by 1234 immediately below and in quotations

" There has been a lot of sociological research about how unreliable an oral history is. This can be verified by sitting 12 people in a circle and having the first whisper a story to the second, the second to the third, and so on and then listening to the final story that #12 tells–usually very different from #1’s story in many respects".

My response to this post was immediately below in quotations

"But it is apparent that many of the Apostles of the New Testament do not differ in the facts of these miracles and only differ in the paticular message they want the reader to understand.

Mark, Matthew, Luke, Paul, Peter, John

this is what makes evidence credible".

That the Apostles account of what occurred to do not differ from eachother

 

[_A]

I see. Your introductory statement might have been better phrased:

I don’t know whether or not there is God
I don’t know whether or not there are Gods
I don’t know whether or not there are Goddesses
I don’t know whether or not there is a human soul
I don’t know whether or not there are disembodied spirits
I don’t know whether or not there is reincarnation or any afterlife
I don’t know whether or not there is man is anything other than an animal with a high degree of self awareness
I don’t know whether or not there is fate
I don’t know whether or not there is destiny
I don’t know whether or not there is a meaning of life
I don’t know whether or not irrational beliefs are ever right
I don’t know whether or not there is religion and superstition should go unchallenged

If you had phrased your post more precisely, i would have know whether to ask you any questions, for you claim to know nothing of these things!

Since you know nothing, does that mean you are willing to ask questions to see what others do know, or are you content to remain ignorant?

S4J, I think you have confused this poster with smith.

 

[Socrates4Jesus]

No, I think it is just misusing the word ‘faith’. Trying to confuse it with the idea of belief. If you drop a pencil, you believe that it will fall DOWN. That is not faith. It is instead a large collection of experiences leading to a valid prediction (in my case) and a passing knowledge of the formulas which describe the effect.
Faith is ‘action based on belief’, not belief itself. Faith finds all it’s roots in feeling (like trust) not on empirical evidence.

Very well, then, i have no faith! I believe in Jesus. Now, the word believe has three meanings:

1. 
   *]To think something might be true
   *]To know something is without a doubt true
   *]To put one’s trust in the truth that he knows with certainty is true
   Judging by the conversations we have shared, A, which of the three do you think describes my belief in Jesus?

 

[_A]

Socrates4Jesus;3272373:

I do know that credible evidence exists for the existence of God. That is why I replied to the answer of evidence previously posted by as I did from post of 1234

Post by 1234 immediately below and in quotations

" There has been a lot of sociological research about how unreliable an oral history is. This can be verified by sitting 12 people in a circle and having the first whisper a story to the second, the second to the third, and so on and then listening to the final story that #12 tells–usually very different from #1’s story in many respects".

My response to this post was immediately below in quotations

"But it is apparent that many of the Apostles of the New Testament do not differ in the facts of these miracles and only differ in the paticular message they want the reader to understand.

Mark, Matthew, Luke, Paul, Peter, John

this is what makes evidence credible".

That the Apostles account of what occurred to not differ from eachother

Hey smith, did you take that logic quiz I posted earlier? Using the bible to prove the authenticity of the bible is circular reasoning.
Tight circle, too.

 

[Socrates4Jesus]

S4J, I think you have confused this poster with smith.

That i have. Thanks for pointing that out.

 

[_A]

The logical fallacies quiz is here.
emse.fr/~yukna/gmat/Logicalfallacies.html
Anyone care to try it?

 

[c659smith]

No, I think it is just misusing the word ‘faith’. Trying to confuse it with the idea of belief. If you drop a pencil, you believe that it will fall DOWN. That is not faith. It is instead a large collection of experiences leading to a valid prediction (in my case) and a passing knowledge of the formulas which describe the effect.
Faith is ‘action based on belief’, not belief itself. Faith finds all it’s roots in feeling (like trust) not on empirical evidence.

What is empirical evidence?

Scientifically-based research from fields such as psychology, sociology, economics, and neuroscience, and especially from research in educational settings

How is empirical evidence not used here.

 

[Socrates4Jesus]

…

Hmmm, i’m not doing a good job at replying today!

 

[Socrates4Jesus]

I do know that credible evidence exists for the existence of God. That is why I replied to the answer of evidence previously posted by as I did from post of 1234
…

Do you know that credible evidence exists for the non-existence of God?

 

[c659smith]

Very well, then, i have no faith! I believe in Jesus. Now, the word believe has three meanings:

1. 
   *]To think something might be true
   *]To know something is without a doubt true
   *]To put one’s trust in the truth that he knows with certainty is true
   Judging by the conversations we have shared, A, which of the three do you think describes my belief in Jesus?

1. 
   From your writtings thus far I would put you in the 2 category.
   
   I n regards to myself it is a 3

 

[c659smith]

Do you know that credible evidence exists for the non-existence of God?

Based upon the rules of evidence that we use today I have seen no credible evidence that God does not exist.

This is my sole contention within this forum and due to this probably not liked at times within this forum and I have been called a liar and dishonest because I ask for such evidence or evidence’s definition.

 

[c659smith]

Based upon the rules of evidence that we use today I have seen no credible evidence that God does not exist.

This is my sole contention within this forum and due to this probably not liked at times within this forum and I have been called a liar and dishonest because I ask for such evidence or evidence’s definition.

My theory through conversations within this forum and I may be wrong that Atheism is a non belief in any god.

That evidence other than an Atheist actualy having his own 5 senses personally affected by God or personally knowing in advance and witnessing a miracle by God is suspect. That to use any other evidence but this is fruitless.