I am an atheist thread 3

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lkddav said:
I just asked off the top of my head actually. 🙂 The word day is used 123 times in genesis… Every time it is used it means a 24 hour day. If the author of genesis wanted it to be any thing other than a 24 hour period he would have said so. There is nothing in genesis that would make anyone believe it meant anything other than a 24 hour period.
I wasn’t going at genesis by the way. I just thought it would be good evidence. People have threw in the “god days”, “era” and so forth because genesis is silly and doesn’t fit in with reality.
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Point out some times the word is used and I will do my best to explain. Besides, there is also the translation issues to consider. I don’t know Hebrew or Greek so if someone else here can help me on this one that’d be great… I do know translating languages is tricky so keep that in mind.

Also, would you mind being a little more respectful please? Calling my beliefs silly isn’t the way to get good communication going. You obvisously don’t agree. I get that. You can say the same thing in a nicer way though. I don’t think I’ve ever disrespected you for not believing. If I have, then show me and I’ll apologize. Till then though can you please choose your words more carefully?

Thank you.
 
psyche23 said:
Point out some times the word is used and I will do my best to explain. Besides, there is also the translation issues to consider. I don’t know Hebrew or Greek so if someone else here can help me on this one that’d be great… I do know translating languages is tricky so keep that in mind.

Also, would you mind being a little more respectful please? Calling my beliefs silly isn’t the way to get good communication going. You obvisously don’t agree. I get that. You can say the same thing in a nicer way though. I don’t think I’ve ever disrespected you for not believing. If I have, then show me and I’ll apologize. Till then though can you please choose your words more carefully?

Thank you.
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I’ll give you credit though. You could have said worse. So for that, thanks. Just keep in mind we’re not here to hassle you and I hope you’re thinking is along those same lines.
 
lkddav said:
I just asked off the top of my head actually. 🙂 The word day is used 123 times in genesis… Every time it is used it means a 24 hour day. If the author of genesis wanted it to be any thing other than a 24 hour period he would have said so. There is nothing in genesis that would make anyone believe it meant anything other than a 24 hour period.
I wasn’t going at genesis by the way. I just thought it would be good evidence. People have threw in the “god days”, “era” and so forth because genesis is silly and doesn’t fit in with reality.
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Something to keep in mind also is that fairly recently a genetic study was done to track peoples ancestries. The scientists coded DNA from people all over the world. I can’t remember which line they traced (either the female line or the male) but it was one of those two). Anyway, the scientists located a single person (I think it was male) who is the origion of all races. I’ll see if I can’t locate that source for you, but in any case. here’s an example of the Catholic Church and Bible stating something seemingly ridiculous to secular society, and then comes to find scientific evidence to back it up…

Just food for thought.
 
psyche23 said:
Something to keep in mind also is that fairly recently a genetic study was done to track peoples ancestries. The scientists coded DNA from people all over the world. I can’t remember which line they traced (either the female line or the male) but it was one of those two). Anyway, the scientists located a single person (I think it was male) who is the origion of all races. I’ll see if I can’t locate that source for you, but in any case. here’s an example of the Catholic Church and Bible stating something seemingly ridiculous to secular society, and then comes to find scientific evidence to back it up…

Just food for thought.
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Hi Psyche

You are right, i am sorry. I have cut wood all day and i am very tired. The vodka is kicking in, and the girlfriend is wanting some and my two cats are fighting like he–. So i do apologize.
I will answer you tomorrow… bye now les
 
lkddav said:
Hi Psyche

You are right, i am sorry. I have cut wood all day and i am very tired. The vodka is kicking in, and the girlfriend is wanting some and my two cats are fighting like he–. So i do apologize.
I will answer you tomorrow… bye now les
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No worries. I’ll probably end here fairly soon myself.
 
lkddav said:
I just asked off the top of my head actually. 🙂 The word day is used 123 times in genesis… Every time it is used it means a 24 hour day. If the author of genesis wanted it to be any thing other than a 24 hour period he would have said so. There is nothing in genesis that would make anyone believe it meant anything other than a 24 hour period.
I wasn’t going at genesis by the way. I just thought it would be good evidence. People have threw in the “god days”, “era” and so forth because genesis is silly and doesn’t fit in with reality.
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This kind of comment demonstrates that you have a lot to learn about scripture and the writing of Genesis. I would suggest you do some research to improve your understanding.
 
psyche23 said:
Something to keep in mind also is that fairly recently a genetic study was done to track peoples ancestries. The scientists coded DNA from people all over the world. I can’t remember which line they traced (either the female line or the male) but it was one of those two). Anyway, the scientists located a single person (I think it was male) who is the origion of all races. I’ll see if I can’t locate that source for you, but in any case. here’s an example of the Catholic Church and Bible stating something seemingly ridiculous to secular society, and then comes to find scientific evidence to back it up…

Just food for thought.
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I believe that you are referring to the early female hominid nicknamed “Lucy” and mitochondrial DNA.
 
Pax said:
This kind of comment demonstrates that you have a lot to learn about scripture and the writing of Genesis. I would suggest you do some research to improve your understanding.
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I’d like to hear what your take is on it anyway. I mean I don’t doubt Catholic teaching in any way, but I’m always anxious to learn more.
 
Pax said:
I believe that you are referring to the early female hominid nicknamed “Lucy” and mitochondrial DNA.
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I don’t think so. The name sounds familiar, but I thought that was a different study… I’ll have to check that website I posted and make sure I got the right one…
 
Actually, I’m finding quite a few sites online on this, but have several different " single genetic ancestor(s)". None of these sites I’m familiar with and have no idea how their study ws conducted…

I’m thinking of the show either on Discovery channel or National Geographic Channel where a guy tests the blood from people all over the world. In it he’s testing someone from Mongolia and is able to conclusively tell him how long his family has lived there… You might know the show. Anyway, the whole point of the show was to demonstrate the possibility and even liklihood of a single genetic father (I believe it was male but could be wrong). Hope that helps… Anyway, I’m getting off topic here.

The point was to show that something seemingly ridiculous from the Bible was/is likely to have scientific evidence to support it. And not to dismiss something just because we don’t understand it yet…
 
psyche23 said:
I don’t think so. The name sounds familiar, but I thought that was a different study… I’ll have to check that website I posted and make sure I got the right one…
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I vaguely remember hearing about some male analogue of Mitochondrial Eve. I’m too fuzzy-headed to dredge up details, and too tired to look it up.

I definitely remember that neither Mito Eve nor Whatever Adam is really an ancestor to all living humans, in the Biblical Adam and Eve sense.

Further details will have to wait for sleep, precious sleep.
🙂
 
psyche23 said:
he only allows it to happen because of free will. It’s our fault we die in general, not his.
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It is not our fault. It is not like some of us can just decide not to. He created death, and sin. If not, someone more powerful did.

Of course, there is always the possibility that he is just an imaginary friend that got out of hand…
 
lkddav said:
I like looking in the mirror in the morning and know what i am looking at. I see a bipedal primate, somewhere along the way we developed a self conscious, I know i am going to die. When i die i will cease to exist.

I don’t have a problem with this. It’s called reality. I don’t need a sky daddy to make me feel better or make me happy. My life is what i make it, and i have made it happy.

It’s actually very simple. 🙂
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Not just simple though. Also beautiful and ennobling. 🙂
 
Psyche23,

The Genesis account of creation cannot be taken in a “literalist” fashion. This becomes quite obvious when we look at the sequence of what God did day by day. There are actually two accounts in Genesis of what God did and the order in which He did it.

In the first account God creates man last[see Gen 1:26] In the second account we are told that God created the heavens and the earth and that he then created man followed by the plants and animals.[See Gen 2:7 and what follows]

This is the first and most obvious clue that the creation narrative is not to be taken in a literalist fashion. There is a purpose in the two accounts. They both show in their own way that man is the pinnacle of God’s creation. The two accounts are simply two different ways of making the point. Likewise, the accounts are designed to show that God created everything out of nothing and that God is the Supreme Being above all things.

Genesis also shows that there is a special relationship between God and man. The first account with its elaboration of days makes this quite clear to the Jewish reader. The seventh day is the key to this point. God made everything for man, but God made man for himself. God established a covenant relationship with man and Adam walked with God. We know that there is a covenant relationship because the number 7 is the number of the covenant. In Hebrew the word covenant literally means to “seven yourself.”

Man was made on the sixth day as were the beasts but man was made for the seventh day. This is also the source for the number 666. It’s origen can be found in the sixth day when the animals/beasts were made. God created man for the seventh day, but if man remains in the sixth day he is no better than the beasts. The language and numbers are significant and they tell us things about God and man. They are not to be taken in a literalistic fashion.

The days also represent the passage of time. They do not have to represent a 24 hour cycle. The apostle Peter tells us “But do not ignore this one fact, beloved, that with the Lord one day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.”[2 Peter 3:8]
The apostle is telling us how the Jews understood time in the eyes of God. The passage of time in Genesis is most likely extremely long and this is the way that the inspired writer would get the message across without attempting to give a precise historical and scientific time table. Afterall, the bible is a spirtitual book. Although it contains some scientific facts and many historical facts, it is not a science or history book. Anyone that fails to look at scripture this way will fail to see its truth and beauty.
 
_A said:
Belief gets in the way of learning.
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Everyone believes something: that there is a God, that there are no gods, that there may be gods or no gods. Fact is you just don’t know. Atheists and agnostics are as faithful in their positions as any of the rest of us.
 
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