I am getting interested in eastern orthodoxy

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Joseklos

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Even though I am not part of any church and prefer to just go to whatever catholic church is near, I would like to attend an orthodox mass to see if I like it more than the roman catholic. I already did some research and they look pretty good. I don’t like how some roman catholics believe everything the pope says is right and I don’t like how the roman church was set up. The pope should not have that much power because he can be tempted to be corrupt. Anyway, there is just one problem. In my area there are no orthodox churches. There is something that looks like a byzantine catholic church but im not sure if it’s even a church. There is a orthodox church that is like 30 minutes away by car and my parents are roman catholic so why would they want to drive all the way there just so they can drop me off? what should I do?
 
Dear brother Joseklos,

Welcome!!!

You appear to be very young. I commend you for being concerned enough about your faith to search it out.

I am wondering how much you really know about the Catholic Faith in the first place. It appears you were baptized Catholic?

There are few here in the ECF who would adamantly and actively try to steer you away from the Eastern Orthodox Church. My personal concern has always been - “do you know enough about the Catholic Faith to be able to say it is not what you want?”

I am also wondering why “the look” of the Byzantine Catholic Church (it might be a mission) is an issue with your wanting to attend it.

Blessings,
Marduk
 
I am also wondering why “the look” of the Byzantine Catholic Church (it might be a mission) is an issue with your wanting to attend it.
I haven’t done much research on byzantine catholicism and the sign in front of the church says “byzantine catholic mission” and I don’t know if its a church or something else. Right now, I am trying to find a church that I am comfortable in. I was raised as a roman catholic but then I began to separate myself from it because of doubts. I wanted to join the lutheran church but then I decided to just be a christian without a church. Then I decided to simply follow the apostolic churches without being a “roman” or “eastern” catholic. However, mass is still important and I simply do not like some of the roman doctrines. So I am trying to look for the right church so I can attend mass there without having to worry about those doctrines that bother me.
 
You are not alone in the things you’re questioning. Many of us struggled with our faith when we were young. I hope you can find a thoughtful, faithful Catholic to talk with about what is bothering you. Maybe there is a youth minister in your parish or at the diocese who’d be good to talk with.

We Byzantine Catholics are Catholics. We are very different from the Latin (“Roman”) Church but we are in union with the Pope of Rome. The Orthodox are not in union with the Pope of Rome. We have many wonderful Orthodox Christians here on the CAF, also. We talk about doctrines in different ways. You can see some of that in this Eastern Catholicism Section if you start reading some of the threads here.

You can use this Find-A-Parish site to check for an Eastern Catholic Parish. If the Parish or mission has a website it should also be given on the Find-A-Parish page. Your parents might be supportive of you going to the Eastern/Byzantine Catholic Church. The worship there is the same Divine Liturgy as the Orthodox so you would see how that is different from the Roman Rite Mass you are used to. You can receive Eucharist in a Byzantine Catholic Church, and go to Reconciliation there, but not in an Orthodox Church. You can participate in all the other parts of an Orthodox Liturgy if you do go visit an Orthodox Church.

My parish has a very simple little “walk through the Liturgy” here. The website for St. Elias parish has lots of details about our Liturgy.

“Proud to be ByzanTEEN” is on Facebook , so does “I Love Being A Byzantine Catholic And I Will Never Change My Denomination” .

Have you ever checked out the resources at Busted Halo? 👍
 
Dear brother 5Loaves,

Can you please address brother Joseklos’ concern that a Byzantine Catholic mission is not a real church?

Thanks.

Blessings,
Marduk
You are not alone in the things you’re questioning. Many of us struggled with our faith when we were young. I hope you can find a thoughtful, faithful Catholic to talk with about what is bothering you. Maybe there is a youth minister in your parish or at the diocese who’d be good to talk with.

We Byzantine Catholics are Catholics. We are very different from the Latin (“Roman”) Church but we are in union with the Pope of Rome. The Orthodox are not in union with the Pope of Rome. We have many wonderful Orthodox Christians here on the CAF, also. We talk about doctrines in different ways. You can see some of that in this Eastern Catholicism Section if you start reading some of the threads here.

You can use this Find-A-Parish site to check for an Eastern Catholic Parish. If the Parish or mission has a website it should also be given on the Find-A-Parish page. Your parents might be supportive of you going to the Eastern/Byzantine Catholic Church. The worship there is the same Divine Liturgy as the Orthodox so you would see how that is different from the Roman Rite Mass you are used to. You can receive Eucharist in a Byzantine Catholic Church, and go to Reconciliation there, but not in an Orthodox Church. You can participate in all the other parts of an Orthodox Liturgy if you do go visit an Orthodox Church.

My parish has a very simple little “walk through the Liturgy” here. The website for St. Elias parish has lots of details about our Liturgy.

“Proud to be ByzanTEEN” is on Facebook , so does “I Love Being A Byzantine Catholic And I Will Never Change My Denomination” .

Have you ever checked out the resources at Busted Halo? 👍
 
I think it’s important to remember that “getting interested” isn’t the same as “feeling convinced of a church’s validity”, and “disliking” a doctrine isn’t mutually exclusive with “disagreeing” or actually having reason to reject it based on logic and research. I suggest you research the RCC and the doctrines you are having trouble with. Remember, the Pope as a man can do whatever, but only the doctrines are infallible; any corrupted action that might be taken are not to be looked at in an infallible context and don’t say anything against the validity of the RCC. Every church has had serious problems in the past, but that doesn’t mean we automatically reject the church. If you’re feeling drawn to Eastern-style masses, why not check out an Eastern Catholic parish? Melkite, etc…very similar, but of course not exactly the same.
God bless! 🙂 +
 
Ok I guess I will try to learn more about it and maybe attend a mass over there. Thank you all for your advise.
 
YES a Byzantine Catholic Mission is a church…it’s just not a full fledged parish as of yet.
They often are meeting in someone else’s space. They may not have their Divine Liturgy (Mass) every Sunday, or it may be at a time that isn’t the typical Sunday morning time because the priest serving them is from another place, another Byzantine Catholic Church where he is serving Liturgy on Sunday morning.

Have you looked to see if they have a website that would tell you more about them? Are they listed here on Byzantine Catholic Mission Parishes and Communities?

(I looked at Busted Halo after I suggested it to you and a picture of one of my friends is posted here! What a surprise! He didn’t even know they had his pic up 😃 )
 
Dear brother 5Loaves,

Can you please address brother Joseklos’ concern that a Byzantine Catholic mission is not a real church?

Thanks.
Blessings,
Marduk
I didn’t see this sooner but others took up your call.
FYI I’m a *Baba *, or Pani as my deacon likes to call me (he evidently thinks I’m married to the church, and my husband may be a saint but he isn’t clergy.). 🙂 “Brother” is a fair assumption, often made here, since I usually seem to be the only female EC on this EC forum… Why is that?
 
Sorry if this was covered, but isn’t a Byzantine Church, Catholic? I am under the influence from others that Byzantine is not Eastern Orthodox according to the Orthodox Christians. Also, they do not celebrate worship in the form of a “Mass”, but rather the “Divine Liturgy”. If there is a better way to say this please feel free to say it. I’d like to hear an Eastern Orthodox Christian clarification as well as Eastern Catholic version for clarity.

Thanks.
 
Even though I am not part of any church and prefer to just go to whatever catholic church is near, I would like to attend an orthodox mass to see if I like it more than the roman catholic. I already did some research and they look pretty good. I don’t like how some roman catholics believe everything the pope says is right and I don’t like how the roman church was set up. The pope should not have that much power because he can be tempted to be corrupt. Anyway, there is just one problem. In my area there are no orthodox churches. There is something that looks like a byzantine catholic church but im not sure if it’s even a church. There is a orthodox church that is like 30 minutes away by car and my parents are roman catholic so why would they want to drive all the way there just so they can drop me off? what should I do?
You really must research the doctrines you are worried about, perhaps ask others about them here, for 2 important reasons.
  1. From the Catholic point of view, leaving the Catholic Church can be seriously dangerous for the soul. In fairness, let us acknowledge that from the Orthodox point of view, for someone to leave their communion would also be spiritually dangerous. Do not take it lightly!
  2. Eastern Orthodoxy takes doctrine seriously. If you really have specific issues with the filioque, or with the Immaculate Conception as such, you may find a home there. But if you have trouble with authority, you will still find authority in Eastern Orthodoxy. They greatly honor Mary, so you cannot escape that. Eastern Orthodoxy is a place where ancient doctrine is preserved, you cannot pick and choose what to believe. Also, it is a place where spiritual discipline is taken seriously as well (confession, fasting, regular prayer, etc).
Easter Christians, please feel free to correct any mistakes I may have made.
 
The educated Catholic knows that the Eastern Church IS the Church (His Holiness said this himself) and their Eucharist IS THE Eucharist. I have seriously considered changing traditions [not converting, since the East IS the Church] (from Roman to Greek Orthodox) but I would have to lie to the pastor of the near by Cathedral if I wanted to receive, but I do not want to do that.
 
Sorry if this was covered, but isn’t a Byzantine Church, Catholic? I am under the influence from others that Byzantine is not Eastern Orthodox according to the Orthodox Christians. Also, they do not celebrate worship in the form of a “Mass”, but rather the “Divine Liturgy”. If there is a better way to say this please feel free to say it. I’d like to hear an Eastern Orthodox Christian clarification as well as Eastern Catholic version for clarity.

Thanks.
A Byzantine church is any church ( catholic or orthodox) that uses the Rite of Constantinople! (Byzantium).
 
The one thing that kept me from Orthodxy is that the Orthodox simply do not acocunt for the bulk of the Fathers writing on papal supremacy, and when they do, they don’t seem to hit it square between the eyes, they just sort of explain it away as “Well, it’s his orthodoxy that made him great, not his see of Rome by divine right.” But that does not account for all the sayings of the Fathers on the Primacy of Peter.

St. Maximus :

From the Catholic Encyclopedia:

"When in 641 John IV wrote his defence of Pope Honorius, it was re-echoed by St. Maximus in a letter to Marinus, a priest of Cyprus. He declares that Honorius, when he confessed one will of our Lord, only meant to deny that Christ had a will of the flesh, of concupiscence, since he was conceived and born without stain of sin. Maximus appeals to the witness of Abbot John Symponus, who wrote the letter for Honorius. Pyrrhus was now Sergius’s successor, but on the accession of the Emperor Constans in 642 he was exiled. Maximus then sent a letter to the patrician Peter, apparently the Governor of Syria and Palestine who had written to him concerning Pyrrhus, whom he now calls simply abbot. Pyrrhus was in Palestine and Peter had restrained him from putting forward his heretical views. Pyrrhus had declared that he was ready to satisfy Maximus as to his orthodoxy. The latter says he would have written to Peter before

**'but I was afraid of being thought to transgress the holy laws if I were to do this without knowing the will of the most holy see of Apostolic men, who ***lead aright the whole plenitude of the Catholic Church, and rule *it with order according to the divine law’. "

“For he only speaks in vain who thinks he ought to persuade or entrap persons like myself, and does not satisfy and implore the blessed pope of the most holy Church of the Romans, that is, the Apostolic see, which from the incarnate Son of God Himself, and also by all holy synods, according to the holy canons and definitions, has received universal and supreme dominion, authority and power of binding and loosing over all the holy Churches of God which are in the whole world — for with it the Word who is above the celestial powers binds and looses in heaven also. For if he thinks he must satisfy others, and fails to implore the most blessed Roman pope, he is acting like a man who, when accused of murder or some other crime, does not hasten to prove his innocence to the judge ***appointed by the law, ***but only uselessly and without profit does his best to demonstrate his innocence to private individuals, who have no power to acquit him.”

MAximus clearly says that the Church of ROme has Authority from Christ to bind and loose over all the other churches. Tell an Orthodox person to repeat these lines on Pain of his Orthodoxy, and see what happens; for they revere St. Maximus very much.

" For from the coming down of the incarnate Word amongst us, all the Churches in every part of the world have held that greatest Church alone as their base and foundation, seeing that according to the promise of Christ our Saviour, the gates of hell do never prevail against it, that it has the keys of a right confession and faith in Him, that it opens the true and only religion to such as approach with piety, and shuts up and locks every heretical mouth that speaks injustice against the Most High."

For the cementing of our unity cannot be firm unless we be bound by the bond of love into an inseparable solidity: because “as in one body we have many members, but all the members have not the same office; so we being many are one body in Christ, and all of us members one of another. The connexion of the whole body makes all alike healthy, all alike beautiful: and this connexion requires the unanimity indeed of the whole body, but it especially demands harmony among the priests. And though they have a common dignity, yet they have not uniform rank; inasmuch as even among the blessed Apostles, notwithstanding the similarity of their honourable estate, there was a certain distinction of power, and while the election of them all was equal, yet it was given to one to take the lead of the rest. From which model has arisen a distinction between bishops also, and by an important ordinance it has been provided that every one should not claim everything for himself: but that there should be in each province one whose opinion should have the priority among the brethren: and again that certain whose appointment is in the greater cities should undertake a fuller responsibility, through whom the care of the universal Church should converge towards Peter’s one seat, and nothing anywhere should be separated from its Head.

Pope st. leo I letters 14:12
 
Even though I am not part of any church and prefer to just go to whatever catholic church is near, I would like to attend an orthodox mass to see if I like it more than the roman catholic. I already did some research and they look pretty good. I don’t like how some roman catholics believe everything the pope says is right and I don’t like how the roman church was set up. The pope should not have that much power because he can be tempted to be corrupt. Anyway, there is just one problem. In my area there are no orthodox churches. There is something that looks like a byzantine catholic church but im not sure if it’s even a church. There is a orthodox church that is like 30 minutes away by car and my parents are roman catholic so why would they want to drive all the way there just so they can drop me off? what should I do?
I am 18 at the moment, and let me just say that the Catholic Church is the way to go. If you don’t wanna take my word for it, read a copy of Jimmy Akin’s The Fathers Know Best: Your Essential Guide to the Teachings of the Early Church. It helps to explain very much about why Catholics believe what they do, and backs it up with writings from the Church Fathers (some of the first men to write about Christianity). Some of the Church Fathers are even considered Saints. The ideas in this book are about as orthodox as you can get as they are from some of the first men to write on Christianity.
 
Sorry if this was covered, but isn’t a Byzantine Church, Catholic? I am under the influence from others that Byzantine is not Eastern Orthodox according to the Orthodox Christians. Also, they do not celebrate worship in the form of a “Mass”, but rather the “Divine Liturgy”. If there is a better way to say this please feel free to say it. I’d like to hear an Eastern Orthodox Christian clarification as well as Eastern Catholic version for clarity.

Thanks.
Byzantine refers to the rite. The Eucharistic liturgy of the Byzantine churches is called the Divine Liturgy. Nearly all Eastern Orthodox churches celebrate according to the Byzantine rite, while a considerable number of Eastern Catholic churches are Byzantine rite (e.g. Melkite, Ukrainian, Ruthenian) as well.

“Mass” is the Eucharistic liturgy of the Latin church and is derived from the Latin prayer at the end of the Latin Eucharistic liturgy: ite missa est “Go the Mass is ended.”
 
actually, ite missae est means “Go forth, it is sent.”

Ite=Go
Missae=Sent Forth
Est=It is; to be.

SO the Mass is the missae, the “Sending Forth” or “Offering” of the sacrifice of Christ to the Triune God.
 
actually, ite missae est means “Go forth, it is sent.”

Ite=Go
Missae=Sent Forth
Est=It is; to be.

SO the Mass is the missae, the “Sending Forth” or “Offering” of the sacrifice of Christ to the Triune God.
Yes, you are correct. My bad.
 
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