I believe Jesus was never a god who became man

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Pax_Vobiscum_57 said:
So, which is it? Is Jesus perfect or not? Krishna is as artificial as the demon you call “Allah.”
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Dear Pax … please be very careful when speaking about other religions names for God. The Name Allah is from the Hebrew Name for God El and Eloi and is a dialect expression of the same.

These names can be proven to be linguistically cognate with each other and used in a similar manner since ancient times, even preceding the coming of the Muslim religion.

Regarding Krishna, we should also be very careful. The name Krishna in south India is Krista (Christa).

When the Portuguese arrived in Goa in the 14th century, they could not physically distinguish some Catholic church’s from Hindu temples. Of course, in the Catholic churches, the Divine Liturgy was in tact, but the icons, terminology, architecture, and so on, had very oriental characteristics. The mission of St. Thomas the Apostle and the impact of Christ’s message was very great and broad in India.

Modern scholarship show numerous areas of cross inculturation and some shared systems of belief. In southern India, there are Hindus and some Muslims in fact, that revere St. Thomas and still adhere to some Christian customs.

Various branches of HIndu philosophy are deemed compatible with Catholic ideals and the Holy See, considers them fit for serious study. Some scholars believe that they are an artifact resulting from St. Thomas’ mission. (Others will argue Christianity was influenced)
 
paarsurrey said:
Hi

I take refuge in God about my beloved Jesus mentioned in Quran who was never a god, only a servant of God Allah YHWH.

About the Catholic-god that is supposed to become flesh, I think just a little whole in the body to urinate was enough without a function for regeneration; but that never happened, he had the usual male sexual genetical organs, for nothing. I think it is more of a mistake on the part Catholic-god to start with. Jesus could not create his own body himself, in my opinion.

I love Jesus and Mary

Thanks
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Opinions are like noses - everybody has one. The problem with Islam is that it cannot grasp the metaphysical. Only what flawed human (read: Muhammad) logic can understand. God IS Omnipotent, and that’s why you cannot understand that He emptied Himself into the form of a human in order to save humanity.

Billy, I know exactly what I am saying. Allah is NOT the God of the Bible. Nor is Krishna (which, btw, Hinduism is polytheistic and they actually worship “deities”/idols). This is not the time to sing Kumbayah with all the nations. This is defending the Triune Godhead against false accusations.
 
Here is a good video on many things - but towards the last of it you will see that not only the Apostles witnessed the Crucifixion, but many others besides Josephus. These were not Christians at the time and one of them is a Babylonian Talmund entry.

Liar, Liar Cults on fire

Jesus’ crucifixion was written about by not only his prophets, but also includes Josephus (37-97AD) a Jewish historian who was ordered by Pontius Pilate to record the crucifixion of Jesus. He also mentions Jesus appearing to the apostles on the 3rd day. Lucien, a Greek satirist (120-180AD) was a critic of the Christians and Christ; and Tacitus (55-117AD) who was a great historian of Rome both wrote about the Crucifixian of Jesus.

And some illiterate pagan, 600 years later, made up a bunch of stories of not only the Old Testament, but the New Testament, says the Crucifixion didn’t happen because it didn’t fit into his agenda for islam. And no muslim asks for proof of the corruption of the Bible - or at least any that were allowed to live.

compare Jesus with mohammed:
Jesus - Permit the children to come to Me, and do not hinder them, for the Kingdom of God belongs to such as these. Luke 16:18
I tell you the truth, unless you change and become like little children, you will never enter the Kingdom of Heaven. Matthew 18:24
also Mark 9:37, Matthew 11:25

hadith - Dawud, narrated As-Saburah (also recorded by Ahmand and al-Hakim. Al-Syuti has given in a notation signifying that it is authentic.
Al-Albani has graded it hasan. Al-Albani, Sahih Al-Jami, vol.2, p. 1021.)
The prophet said: Order your children to pray at the age of seven. And beat them if they do not do so by the age of ten. And separate them in their bedding.

Another prisoner Uqba Ibn Abi Muait was decapitated in front of the prophet. Before being killed the prisoner cried out pitifully “o prophet, who will look after my children if I should die?”
The ‘great prophet of the religion of peace’ coldly spat out “HELLFIRE”, as the blade came down and spattered his clothese with Uqra’s blood. (Incident at the well of Badr, account by D.S.Margoliouth in his book ‘muhammad and the Rise of islam’.

There is more in this video about hadiths for beating women and the comparison between mohammed and Jesus’ message on that subject.
 
Hi

I think that the Catholic concept that it was the word that became flesh is very erroneous one, in my opinion. It would make both an errant word and errant flesh logically.

For example we have flesh in a body before us. We see the body has eyes; so it represents All- Seeing attribute of God, so it is OK. The body has ears; OK it represents the All-Hearing attribute of God. The body has feet OK; it may represent the Omni-Present attribute of God. So on and so forth; till we are left with the genital/sex parts of the body. What is the utility of these parts? If the genital-parts are in a perfect functioning order and without any defects and are not useless; through it a mortal could gain extension in life; through his off-spring, if he dies his off-spring would take over his work or responsibility. This way we could think that Word/God was Immortal. If it is not in a functioning order, it has defects or it is useless; then it is not god in flesh, it does not represent god in any way, in my opinion.

So the concept is wrong

I therefore would opt to love Jesus as mentioned in Quran

Thanks
 
paarsurrey,

Jesus is wedded to the Church, that is, the Church is His bride. The Spirit of Christ impregnates the Church, and the Church gives spiritual birth to believers.

Jesus said: “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God” (John 3:5)

I therefore would opt to love the real Jesus as mentioned in the Bible.

God bless,

Rony
 
paarsurrey said:
Hi

I take refuge in God about my beloved Jesus mentioned in Quran who was never a god, only a servant of God Allah YHWH.

About the Catholic-god that is supposed to become flesh, I think just a little whole in the body to urinate was enough without a function for regeneration; but that never happened, he had the usual male sexual genetical organs, for nothing. I think it is more of a mistake on the part Catholic-god to start with. Jesus could not create his own body himself, in my opinion.

I love Jesus and Mary

Thanks
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You know for a fact Jesus had the “usual male sexual genetical organs” ??

Yes or No
 
kellie said:
You know for a fact Jesus had the “usual male sexual genetical organs” ??

Yes or No
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Hi

Jesus of Quran, a normal human being (and of course a Messenger of God Allah YHWH) who must have got married and have children that proves, yes, Jesus was one of the perfect male human being.

I love Jesus of Quran.

Thanks
 
Hi

Then CatholicJesus is not a complete Word; the word must have had some superfulous or useless portions before Genesis, so when it opted to became flesh as our Catholics friends would believe, it had some usless parts manifested in the flesh, in my opinion. Maybe CatholicJesus could not leave anything in writings or dictated it to anybody; perhaps he let it being lost himself, having no utility for others.

I don’t believe this.

I therefore only love Jesus as mentioned in Quran.

Thanks
 
paarsurrey said:
Hi

Jesus of Quran, a normal human being (and of course a Messenger of God Allah YHWH) who must have got married and have children that proves, yes, Jesus was one of the perfect male human being.

I love Jesus of Quran.

Thanks
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I said FACT

Do you know for a fact that Jesus got married and had children ?

Yes or No
 
Are genital organs the basis for faith? It seemed that Paarsurey is trying to take the argument of faith to its lowest level because the Quran talks of human Jesus. This is a very simple analogy of his intention here in this thread. It is not for him to tell us how Jesus uses His genitals, because we are a believer of Jesus that is God in flesh and His message is not about the genitals but the more important message of Love and Redemption.

His argument is like those of the atheists who will only rationalize on the basis of facts. The genital arguments is not what Jesus came here for and therefore irrelevant to the message God wants us to follow. Paarsurey should just contemplate that matter to himself and perhaps will be able to answer what he is trying to understand. I would just ignore this topic and not answer him in this regard. If you do, I think he is laughing while reading your posts because he knew this matter is not even worthy to discuss.

Just because his quran portrays Jesus as human he can argue with us on genitals, no, we have no reason to doubt the completeness of Jesus’ body in flesh and believing that God is in Him means we do not need to doubt God’s capabilities in using those organs. God created us.
 
rikkk1958 said:
Are genital organs the basis for faith? It seemed that Paarsurey is trying to take the argument of faith to its lowest level because the Quran talks of human Jesus. This is a very simple analogy of his intention here in this thread. It is not for him to tell us how Jesus uses His genitals, because we are a believer of Jesus that is God in flesh and His message is not about the genitals but the more important message of Love and Redemption.

His argument is like those of the atheists who will only rationalize on the basis of facts. The genital arguments is not what Jesus came here for and therefore irrelevant to the message God wants us to follow. Paarsurey should just contemplate that matter to himself and perhaps will be able to answer what he is trying to understand. I would just ignore this topic and not answer him in this regard. If you do, I think he is laughing while reading your posts because he knew this matter is not even worthy to discuss.

Just because his quran portrays Jesus as human he can argue with us on genitals, no, we have no reason to doubt the completeness of Jesus’ body in flesh and believing that God is in Him means we do not need to doubt God’s capabilities in using those organs. God created us.
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Kamasutra is invented in India. They do have an art of having sexual relationship. It would be a waste for a person coming from India that the genital organ of a male is never used in a marriage, exept for urinating.
 
paarsurrey said:
Hi

I think that the Catholic concept that it was the word that became flesh is very erroneous one, in my opinion. It would make both an errant word and errant flesh logically.
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This belief is not exclusively Catholic. It is the foundation for Christianity as a whole. Jesus Christ was fully God and fully man.

Again, Islam is based on the flawed understanding and arrogance of some man who today would be placed upon the same rack as James Jones, David Koresh, Sun Myung Moon, and the like.

God is not logic. When you finally accept that, you will be on your way to truth. God bless.
 
paarsurrey said:
Hi

I think that the Catholic concept that it was the word that became flesh is very erroneous one, in my opinion. It would make both an errant word and errant flesh logically. …

So the concept is wrong

I therefore would opt to love Jesus as mentioned in Quran

Thanks
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Paarsurrey,

There are two modes of understanding:

1.) The powers of reason or logical speculation of the limited human mind

2.) The platform of Realization wherein God illumines the mind and liberating it from the human condition and dualism

Do you want to insist that Quran is the world’s only Holy book or source of God’s revelation?

Jesus can lift your mind above the realm of logical speculation and baptize in the stream of Holy Consciousness … the realm of knowing.

No one can escape Jesus. Look at Google search results:

** Results 1 - 10 of about 208,000,000 for Jesus
**

** Results 1 - 10 of about 45,700,000 for Muhammed.
**

**Results 1 - 10 of about 29,700,000 for Mohammed
**

** Results 1 - 10 of about 29,600,000 for Buddha**

**Results 1 - 10 of about 22,100,000 for Krishna
**
 
codebilly said:
Paarsurrey,

Do you want to insist that Quran is the world’s only Holy book or source of God’s revelation?
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Paar also believe the word of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad, and all scientist including Dan Brown, who support his idea about Jesus.
 
swariffin said:
Paar also believe …all scientist including Dan Brown, who support his idea about Jesus.
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Hi

There is no harm in believing what the scientists say if that is reasonable , rational and logical. They are respectful citizens of this world, like me and you. What is the harm in accepting their truthful facts?

Kindly express your views clearly.

I love Jesus

Thanks
 
paarsurrey said:
Hi

There is no harm in believing what the scientists say if that is reasonable , rational and logical. They are respectful citizens of this world, like me and you. What is the harm in accepting their truthful facts?

Kindly express your views clearly.

I love Jesus

Thanks
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Do you believe in illogical, unreasonable, and irrational scientist?? Respecting others is nothing to do with their logical state whatsoever. Whether they are logical or not, they must still be respected. But, believing is quite another issue.
 
Originally Posted by swariffin:
Paar also believe …all scientist including Dan Brown, who support his idea about Jesus.
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Hi

Even a writer of fiction should be respected and believed if he says TRUTH; nobody has exclusive rights on TRUTH, i think.

I love Jesus and Mary as mentioned in Quran.

Thanks
 
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