I gave in to the temptations

[mattjd]

Avoid PORN, pray the rosary when you are tempted,

Great suggestion. One that works for me all the time, in all areas of my life. The power of the rosary to ward off Satan can not be underestimated.

I will say one for you,

Matt

 

[Annn]

Support groups can be good; I have heard a number of posters on the board talk about Courage meetings, which are for people who wish to live in alignment with Church teaching on this issue.

For clarification: are you also sexually attracted to women (your wife)?

 

[Peter_Dawson]

Please help me. Im a 26 year old married guy. I have been plagued by homosexual temptations since I was a teenager, I just cant get rid of them. They just pop into my head all the time.

I have fantasised, masturbated and looked at pornography. However over the last couple of years I have started actively seeking out sexual contact with oher men even though I know this is so sinful, disgusting and wrong. Nothing had come of this until last nght when I met with a man I met online.

I cant believe I have done this. I feel so, so ashamed. So dirty. I have never felt guilt like this. I pray and strongly believe in trying to live my faith well. God has given me so many blessings in my life and this is how I repay him?

What should I do? I am so sorry for what I have done. Im just so worried the feelings will come back. Does anyone have any suggestions how to beat this?

Please pray for me.

Chris

Hi, chrisc82.

Calm down. Calm down. Calm down.

If you have homosexual feelings, it might be “wiring” or imprinting, or it might be something changeable like a neurosis. Who knows?

Whether or not you have a “homosexuality machine” in your head, the end of your Opening Post sounds like you are obsessing. Note that in worrying about feelings coming back, the door was already open and you were functionally saying, “Come back in, bad feelings!”

Next, God is not just a loving forgiver, he is also an understander. If your post was essentially honest, then God knows that you are already essentially a mess. He’s not going to be too hard on someone who cracked in response to the persistent calling of the current dynamics of his body and mind. Weakness is probably involved, and therefore sin, but it is probably only a factor. So relax. Relax.

People are complex. There are some things which you should think about, as a consequence.

(1) You seem to have no faith, on the subject at hand. To an important extent, “faith” = “not worried, God will take care of it.” Yet, you are worried.

So, pray briefly and quietly for faith; then, pray once, only, for help on this issue. Your prayer will be answered.

(2) Next, your attitude toward your problem stinks. Everything about it is bad. Giant, ongoing, non-insightful, repetitive guilts which have you thinking about that which you don’t want to come back in to your head = obsession. Note that guilts have you thinking, thinking, thinking about the thing, thus generating much of the problem you fear.

Consider, please, what you are NOT thinking about – I have problems, too, but I also have an operating sense of humor. Do you? Your sense of humor seems to be zero. Have you prayed to God, with faith, about lack of sense of humor? If your internal answer is, “Of course not! I’ve got homosexual feelings and actions to deal with!” then you have already lost the battle.

God put us here to make people around us smile. Are you doing that? If your internal answer is, “Of course not! I’ve got homosexual feelings and actions to deal with!” then you have already lost the battle.

(3) You also seem very alone. No one here knows enough about you to give you really good advice. Is your marriage your first marriage? When you’re not obsessing, are you able to function heterosexually? Or, is your wife being deprived of a normal, healthy sexual relationship by all of the chaos in your head? Do you even know what a normal, healthy heterosexual reltionship is?

You probably need counseling. Seek out counseling services of your local Diocese. A nice, gentle, liberal Catholic therapist can really help you screw your head back on correctly. But I think that your goal should not be, “WIPE OUT THOSE HOMOSEXUAL FEELINGS!!!” That may be a fools errand, if you have “pre-wiring” or imprinting of a homosexual nature. Instead, your goal should be functionally complete and relaxed insight, so that you have a pretty good concept of what is going on, inside, to the point where you can deal with homosexual feelings in a relaxed fashion, and to the extent that you have heterosexual feelings, to, you can keep your marital promises to your wife.

Next, no one here knows anything about your wife. So, we can’t make neighborly suggestions about confiding in her.

But a wife is a wife. Assuming that she is normal, you owe her truth. What is sexier: A man with no homosexual feelings, who cuts his wife out of the truth equation; or a man with homosexual feelings, who holds his wife’s hand and says, “Honey, I need your help,” and then explains why? You might be surprised at her strength. Women are amazing. That is why God put them here.

SUMMATION: The big thing for me, in my response, here, is your need to pray (a) *with faith *(b) *once * to God for help. Don’t wear out the carpet. That’s a LACK of faith, not faith. Pray for good faith, and then pray for help, and I can assure you that it will come. God ALWAYS answers prayers.

The next biggest thing is this: Notice, no one here is SMILING. You’ve got no SENSE OF HUMOR. This comprises a complete failure, more important than any failure in the sex department.

And I can prove that to you, too: Heterosexuality, and the rest of life, is intended by God to be FUN. Someone who is ongoingly gravely serious about sex issues has just failed to be sexy and failed at life. If you have no humor, if you can’t make the people around you laugh, you have failed at everything, sex, family, life, and work.

I used to be such a sad sack. I was so, so, so serious and lost. It took me years, and prayer, to figure ouit how to be stupid and funny, but I did it!

You seem intelligent. So, you should be able to develop a good sense of humor.

Next, go hunt down a nice Diocesan counselor, and establish a good doctor/patient relationship with him.

Finally, consider making use of the help of the friend God gave you, your wife. If you think she can take it, intertwine fingers, tell her that you need her help, and 'fess up. How much you 'fess up depends on the circumstanmces. She’ll get around to asking you, “Have you done ‘it’ with a guy?” Women are different than men. Men worry about the physical. Wives worry about the emotions – “Do you love him?”

I’m not a psych, friend. I’m not an expert. But I hope that the above helps a little.

 

[Other_Eric]

Hi, chrisc82.

Calm down. Calm down. Calm down.

I'm afraid I must contradict the general spirit of this advice in the strongest language. The OP's problems seem to stem from him focusing a little *too much* on his own wants and desires. Further, the guilt that the OP is experiencing is a natural consequence of the disgusting choice that he has made. That he feels guilt is a good thing. I should be more worried if he felt none. I therefore earnestly repeat my advice for the OP to obtain a therapist and an annulment.

 

[Exalt]

Chris,

I really understand where you’re coming from here, and I want you to know that you don’t *have *to do all these things that these other people are suggesting. Many people on these forums have suggested that you turn more and more to prayer, confession, sacraments, etc - but my opinion is that these aren’t long-term solutions to a problem like yours.

We don’t know much more about you other than you have had homosexual feelings since you were a teenager, that these feelings have not dissipated over the course of the last decade, and that they are so strong that you feel compelled to act on them in one way or another. Furthermore, you’re married.

You’re also plagued with guilt. I one-hundred percent completely understand exactly why you feel that way, and can anticipate what kind of pattern you’ve been living. One day, you feel okay - like you’re on top of your homosexual feelings and everything’s okay - but the next day, you feel tempted. You try and suppress it.You tell it to go away. You want it to go away. But the next day, your defenses are worn down. It’s all feels like it’s all you can think about it. You know it’s wrong but you want it anyway. So, you break down. You say “**** it” - feel a surge of desire and emotion and want to act on your feelings, so you log on the computer, you look at porn, you jack off - and, in this case, you went especially far and sought out a sexual partner in the real world.

As soon as it’s over, or perhaps the next day, you feel floored. You hate yourself. You feel as if you’ve committed the worst sin in the world. You feel weak. You feel defeated. You feel conquered. And then, if you follow the same line of thinking as others on this forum, you seek out religious remedy. You go to confession, for example, or enter into a state of penance and prayer, and feel forgiven. You feel clean again. You feel okay. But the next day, or a day later or two days later - the feelings come back and the cycle continues.

I know this because I lived it.

I followed the advice of the Catholic Church, and conservative Catholics like those on these forums, and sought to control and fight back against my desires with prayer, fasting, sacraments, and religious involvement. At the advice of my conservative Catholic supporters, I sought out professional therapy with a Catholic, conservative psychologist as well as regular visits with a priest for confession and counseling. But for me there finally came a time when I realized that I was stuck in an endless loop of confession and giving in - and it was weighing heavily on my mind. Every time I “gave in” to my temptations I felt worse. It wrecked my emotions. It tore up my mind. I felt as if my heart was being ripped in half. One side of me genuinely felt a certain way - and that part of me felt it was okay and natural and fine - and the other side of me was filled with contempt for the other side, and righteousness in the knowledge that God was firmly against homosexuality.

As you know, the Catholic Church teaches that homosexuality is a sin against God. The Catholic Church calls homosexuality a “trial”, admits that it’s genesis isn’t known, and commands that everyone who experiences homosexuality must be called to chastity. But - Why? Why is homosexual romance and sexual expression absolutely wrong? The primary reasons cited by the Church and those who claim to represent her ideology revolve around ancient scripture and the concept that homosexuality isn’t “natural.” Well, the arguments from scripture aren’t a good basis for morality on their own, otherwise a great host of Biblically-sanctioned crimes would be fine, such as slavery, the murder of children (the attempted murder of Isaac by his father Abraham, Jephthah’s immolation of his daughter, the slaughter of the children of Jericho by Joshua, the slaughter of the children of Egypt by divine power, etc), the death penalty, genocide (the “cleansing” of the Promised Land by Joshua), and many others.

So, the only pillar the argument against homosexuality has to stand on is the idea that it’s unnatural. Well, there are many different ways to think about this idea. In this concept’s infancy, this idea clearly meant the order of the world as is readily apparent in nature. But we now know that homosexuality plays a large role in dolphin societies, in lions, gorillas, chimpanzees, and thousands of other social mammals. (We’re social mammals too, remember.) So, the interpretation of this idea has changed over time, and now is basically another way of saying “how God designed human beings.” Of course, when you ask: “*How do we know *how God designed human beings?” scripture is usually cited, bringing us back to the previous point.

But for the sake of argument, let’s say for a moment that homosexuality is not natural. Let’s say that it actually is just a random odd side effect of evolutionary development and doesn’t really help our species advance itself from a naturalistic, biological perspective. We come to a critical question: Are all things that are unnatural inherently immoral? Of course not. Is a car immoral? Cars are absolutely unnatural, a product of human ingenuity, and a cause of a huge number of very unnatural, artificial problems - pollution and habitat destruction (roads, bridges) just to name two. Are shoes immoral? They’re obviously artificial and unnatural too. So are clothes - scientists believe human beings originally developed in the warm tropics, where clothes aren’t necessary to survive. Is shaving immoral? How about fingernail polish? Air conditioning? Computers? Airplanes? If homosexuality is immoral because it is unnatural, than all these other unnatural things must be immoral too. But they’re not. The natural-ness of something, therefore, is a terrible way to judge the morality of something.

(Continued below)

 

[Exalt]

(Continued from above)

So, if there’s no good reason to believe that homosexuality is wrong, why continue believing in it? That’s where I was three years ago. On the one hand, I had my Church which I was brought up to believe and the teachings I was conditioned to accept - but on the other hand, my logic told me that there was no good reason to continue believing it, and a huge part of my heart believed homosexuality was okay. I was tired of the guilt-cycles. I was tired of lying to myself and to others. I was tired of believing things that didn’t make sense. So I stopped believing them.

And the guilt is gone, of course. The problem is solved - but not the way that I might have expected three years before that, praying to God to take my painful sacrifice away. Sure, working through all the fallout - both personal and emotional - took a long time, and it was many months before I felt comfortable talking openly about what I had experienced.

But now, three years since I made that fateful conclusion that homosexuality was not immoral, I can tell you honestly that I’m a better person because of it. I am more whole. I know exactly where I stand. I know exactly what I believe and exactly who I am. And I don’t wake up every day wishing I was different. I am very comfortable with my identity, and it doesn’t involve getting so worked up with guilt and desire that I have to act out by finding nameless men on the internet. My relationships are steady, measured, romantic, and grown-up - and I’m happy.

Of course, your particular circumstances are very different. You’re married, first of all. You also did - and this is coming from a thoroughly secular nonbeliever - a very bad thing by cheating on your wife. It was wrong, and if you choose to tell her, you better be ready to take full responsibility for the consequences.

So, here’s my recommendation: You need to take personal, internal responsibility for what happened, for who you are, what you feel, and what you’re going to do. You need to take an honest inventory of what your experiences, attractions, and relationships you have - and come to an honest conclusion about what gender you’re attracted to and to what degree you’re attracted to them. The modern (and I believe correct) position on sexual attraction is that it’s on a continuum. One might be very attracted to one gender and only slightly attracted to the other, or equally attracted to both, not attracted to either, or one’s preferences can change regularly. What you need to figure out is exactly where you are on that attractedness scale. If after an honest inquiry you do not believe that you are attracted to women to a degree that is acceptable for a healthy relationship with your wife, you might need to consider the possibility of no longer continuing with your marriage - after carefully and honestly discussing the issue with her.

Furthermore, you need to take a careful look at your beliefs about homosexuality. Are they reasonable? Do they make objective, logical sense? Do I believe that the Bible can be a reliable source of morality - even if it’s the only source being used? Do I believe that homosexuality is unnatural? If so, do I believe that all unnatural thing are wong? If not, what makes homosexuality different? Does my reasoning make sense, when I look at it as objectively as possible?

I highly highly highly recommend talking to a trusted friend who knows you, who can be objective, and who will keep your opinions and findings confidential. I also highly recommend seeking out not just religious guidance for these important religious issues - but also seek out the advice of a secular, nonreligious friend for his perspective too.

If your goal is just to continue along the status quo of guilt/remorse/desire/acting-out, then by all means follow the advice of these people. Heck, if you decide that you think their advice can help, by all means go ahead and give it a try. But in a few years, you’ll be right back in the same place you are now, just as you have been for the past few years. There are big issues here - and it won’t be solved by prayer or fasting or confession, and it can’t be cured by talk therapy. If you want lasting, real, positive change - if you want to be a grown up - if you want to face the truth and look honestly and objectively at the facts (both about yourself and the moral/religious issues tied up in this) - then I highly recommend that you figure out where you stand in terms of attraction, find a trusted, objective friend who will love you no matter what, and then work out where you stand with measured logic and reason. I feel confident that you will come to a similar conclusion as myself - that there is nothing wrong with homosexuality, and that the solution to the guilt problem is to acknowledge that you have these feelings - that it’s okay to have these feelings - that you’re not a bad person for being bisexual or gay - and that there’s no real need to feel guilty when you feel attraction towards another man.

It’s amazing what that, alone, will do for you. The propensity towards acting out goes down when you aren’t living these vicious cycles of remorse and guilt.

(Continued Below)

 

[Exalt]

(Continued from above)

Of course, my suggestions don’t help when it comes to your wife. I was single at the time when I was seriously grappling these issues, and had no illusions about my exclusively homosexual desires. If you come the honest conclusion that you are bisexual, it’s very possible that you will be able to continue your relationship with your wife just fine. But, on the other hand, if you come to the honest conclusion that you’re gay - and you always have been, since you were a teen, then that’s another situation altogether. That’s a situation that would need some honest conversations between yourself and your wife that needs to take into account countless variables that I can’t even begin to enumerate here. I’ve heard stories from families where one man is genuinely gay and his wife completely acknowledges and is okay with it, but they stay together for companionship and for the children. And, likewise, I’ve heard stories where the relationship could not last and separation was the only solution - along with dozens of stories in between. The important part, of course, is being honest and taking responsibility for your own feelings.

I wish you the very best, Chris, and I respect your courage for standing up for what you believe is right. I hope you take the path of reason and logic, wherever it leads you.

PS: My apologies if there are some misspellings there, it’s a bit late where I am and I caught your post right before going off to bed. Hehe.

 

[mesurman]

(Continued from above)

Of course, my suggestions don’t help when it comes to your wife. I was single at the time when I was seriously grappling these issues, and had no illusions about my exclusively homosexual desires. If you come the honest conclusion that you are bisexual, it’s very possible that you will be able to continue your relationship with your wife just fine. But, on the other hand, if you come to the honest conclusion that you’re gay - and you always have been, since you were a teen, then that’s another situation altogether. That’s a situation that would need some honest conversations between yourself and your wife that needs to take into account countless variables that I can’t even begin to enumerate here. I’ve heard stories from families where one man is genuinely gay and his wife completely acknowledges and is okay with it, but they stay together for companionship and for the children. And, likewise, I’ve heard stories where the relationship could not last and separation was the only solution - along with dozens of stories in between. The important part, of course, is being honest and taking responsibility for your own feelings.

I wish you the very best, Chris, and I respect your courage for standing up for what you believe is right. I hope you take the path of reason and logic, wherever it leads you.

PS: My apologies if there are some misspellings there, it’s a bit late where I am and I caught your post right before going off to bed. Hehe.

Exalt,

Your profile says you are not Catholic. This is a Catholic Web Site. Homosexual acts and adultery are mortal sins whether YOU think that they are or not. The OP has a problem and has committed mortal sins, which he has as I glean from his post he has confessed. Your advice is telling him to go for it which is against all church teaching. Not good.

 

[GraceDK]

Please help me. Im a 26 year old married guy. I have been plagued by homosexual temptations since I was a teenager, I just cant get rid of them. They just pop into my head all the time.

I have fantasised, masturbated and looked at pornography. However over the last couple of years I have started actively seeking out sexual contact with oher men even though I know this is so sinful, disgusting and wrong. Nothing had come of this until last nght when I met with a man I met online.

I cant believe I have done this. I feel so, so ashamed. So dirty. I have never felt guilt like this. I pray and strongly believe in trying to live my faith well. God has given me so many blessings in my life and this is how I repay him?

What should I do? I am so sorry for what I have done. Im just so worried the feelings will come back. Does anyone have any suggestions how to beat this?

Please pray for me.

Chris

Tell your wife everything. Talk about seeking an annulment together on the basis that you are not suited for marriage and has not been from the beginning.

Go to the doctor and get tested for HIV and STDs.

Talk to the best priest in the area and seek counsel and help from other homosexual Catholics in your area so you can support each other in the struggle against sin.

Understand this, brother. Jesus has carried your sins up on the Cross, and has already reconciled you to the Father. You are soo tightly grasped in His Arms right now that you dont even have a clue. He loves you so much.
But you need to keep your self and others out of harms way now and do your part of that.
The Bible says: when we sin we conceive and give birth to death into our life.
You are lucky if you havent been infested with a serious disease.
You will be given a second chance to live your life right.
But please, release your wife from living in a lie, alright. You have sinned first and foremost against her.

The world has not gone under and you are not alone. We pray for you.

:hug1:

 

[GraceDK]

I’m afraid I must contradict the general spirit of this advice in the strongest language. The OP’s problems seem to stem from him focusing a little too much on his own wants and desires. Further, the guilt that the OP is experiencing is a natural consequence of the disgusting choice that he has made. That he feels guilt is a good thing. I should be more worried if he felt none. I therefore earnestly repeat my advice for the OP to obtain a therapist and an annulment.

Yet we must remember that the guilt and sin of the OP is no bigger than mine and yours. Pornography, premarital sex and adultery with a person of the opposite gender are just as repulsive as homosexual sin, let us not forget that.
Also let me point out to you that our brother here is already crushed in repentance. You dont need to make sure he feels any worse. Your job is to bear fruit with the compassion that was in Christ, not kick a man who is already lying on the ground.

 

[GraceDK]

Chris,

. I am not so sure that telling you wife about it is best since that may hurt her when the problem is you and your life. !

Right… so… If your wife is a lesbian and has sex with a woman you will also say its between her and God… When you get married you become one flesh and you have one life together… okay? So… what is the nonsense? Where is your conscience.

Did you not read Jesus said: “Go and reconcile with your brother before coming to the alter to give your present?. Then come”.
You want the lady to live on a lie and the man to live on a lie… I simply dont get people like you.

 

[YipYupYep]

(Continued from above) Furthermore, you need to take a careful look at your beliefs about homosexuality. Are they reasonable? Do they make objective, logical sense? Do I believe that the Bible can be a reliable source of morality - even if it’s the only source being used?
(Continued Below)

My heart goes out to you. God bless you brother. Your in big trouble.

I have read very carefully all that you have written. Your understanding of your situation seems right on up to the point where you do not just drop your cross under its bone crushing weight; you deny its existence.

We all have sin. If you have committed a sin of homosexual sex, that’s your sin for you to deal with. You post seems to me to be a much more grievous sin of scandal. Will you not only pay a debt to Gods judgment for your sin, but this brother ( the OP ) and who ever else may fall into sin as a result of reading it?

 

[Exalt]

My heart goes out to you. God bless you brother. Your in big trouble.

I have read very carefully all that you have written. Your understanding of your situation seems right on up to the point where you do not just drop your cross under its bone crushing weight; you deny its existence.

We all have sin. If you have committed a sin of homosexual sex, that’s your sin for you to deal with. You post seems to me to be a much more grievous sin of scandal. Will you not only pay a debt to Gods judgment for your sin, but this brother ( the OP ) and who ever else may fall into sin as a result of reading it?

First of all, I concede that it would be incorrect to say that I came to my conclusions about homosexuality only out of pure logic and reason. That’s impossible; I’m not a Vulcan. I’m a human being and emotions play a role in my decision making, as I said in my original three posts.

But it would be equally incorrect to say that my conclusion was only the result of emotion, as if I simply became “crushed” under the weight of my “cross.” Logic, reason, and careful thought played a huge role. Indeed, I would say that my emotions were more informed by my thoughtful reason than any kind of anger or feelings of helplessness.

As far as your accusation of scandal, if such a thing as “sin” exists - and God exists - and Catholicism is true - and homosexuality is a sin, even when the reality of these doctrines make no sense to me from a position of thoughtful reason, then, yes, I suppose I would be guilty of scandal and would be thrown in a lake of fire to burn in Hell for all eternity, as you infer in your post. But because I find the concept of the existence of God or the truth of Catholicism as likely as the Flying Spaghetti Monster, I’m really not afraid of Hell - any more than I would be afraid of His Noodly Appendages for denying the existence of the FSM. (Besides, it doesn’t really reflect well on a supposedly loving God to throw his children in fire for coming to honest conclusions about the world based on evidence, using the heart and mind that he supposedly gave them, now does it?)

 

[Exalt]

Exalt,

Your profile says you are not Catholic. This is a Catholic Web Site. Homosexual acts and adultery are mortal sins whether YOU think that they are or not. The OP has a problem and has committed mortal sins, which he has as I glean from his post he has confessed. Your advice is telling him to go for it which is against all church teaching. Not good.

Well, he asked for advice on what he should do. I just gave him my honest perspective, for what it was worth. I don’t encourage him to do anything other than be honest with himself and take responsibility for his own feelings and actions.

 

[YipYupYep]

But because I find the concept of the existence of God or the truth of Catholicism as likely as the Flying Spaghetti Monster,

How convenient for you.

I’m really not afraid of Hell - any more than I would be afraid of His Noodly Appendages for denying the existence of the FSM.

Huh?

(Besides, it doesn’t really reflect well on a supposedly loving God to throw his children in fire for coming to honest conclusions about the world based on evidence, using the heart and mind that he supposedly gave them, now does it?)

I don’t think anyone said anything about burning in hell. Only God knows. However! I would say that homosexual sex is hell here on earth. I can not imagine a more evil and disgusting thing than men sodomizing each other. If there is a hell to come, we will find out. The hell here on earth is in front of you right now. The un recovered homosexual is living it.

Here on earth there is no arrival. Only a never ending journey. My advice: Pick up your cross and take it one day at a time. If you fall, pull yourself back up, dust yourself off and get back in the battle of the refinement of the spirit.

 

[Exalt]

I don’t think anyone said anything about burning in hell. Only God knows. However! I would say that homosexual sex is hell here on earth. I can not imagine a more evil and disgusting thing than men sodomizing each other. If there is a hell to come, we will find out. The hell here on earth is in front of you right now. The un recovered homosexual is living it.

Well, obviously preference is at issue with that. Obviously a straight person would not be attracted to - or have any interest in - two men involved in sexual intimacy. But just because you’re completely repulsed by it doesn’t mean that it would be “hell” for me or any other gay people. Obviously, preferring sexual intimacy with another man is part of what it means to be attracted to the same sex. I don’t really understand your point.

By the way, there’s way more to being gay than the actual physical act of sex, as I talked about earlier. It’s not like the average gay person is just going out every weekend and having random clandestine sex with strangers. I’ve found that sort of behavior is symptomatic of a closeted, uncomfortable same-sex-attracted person who cycles through shame/guilt/temptation/outbursts rather than a comfortable, well-adjusted socially healthy gay person, as I talked about earlier in this thread. In fact, some of the best, long term, committed relationships I’ve known have been between two guys or two gals. It’s love and intimacy and romance, really, that gay people want and care about, just like most straight people. Sexual intimacy is often just a private expression of that - and it generally isn’t other people’s concerns, to be honest. (You don’t see me accusing Catholics of having “disgusting” sex with their wives, after all!)

Here on earth there is no arrival. Only a never ending journey. My advice: Pick up your cross and take it one day at a time. If you fall, pull yourself back up, dust yourself off and get back in the battle of the refinement of the spirit.

I have no idea what you’re talking about here.

 

[YipYupYep]

Well, obviously preference is at issue with that.

Obvious? Not to me.

Obviously a straight person would not be attracted to - or have any interest in - two men involved in sexual intimacy. But just because you’re completely repulsed by it doesn’t mean that it would be “hell” for me or any other gay people. Obviously, preferring sexual intimacy with another man is part of what it means to be attracted to the same sex. I don’t really understand your point.

Yes you do.

rather than a comfortable, well-adjusted socially healthy gay person,

There is no such thing on this earth.

(You don’t see me accusing Catholics of having “disgusting” sex with their wives, after all!)

Honestly. This is getting too far out for me. Its laughable and sad at this same time.

Goodbye and the best of luck to you.

 

[Other_Eric]

Well, obviously preference is at issue with that. Obviously a straight person would not be attracted to - or have any interest in - two men involved in sexual intimacy. But just because you’re completely repulsed by it doesn’t mean that it would be “hell” for me or any other gay people. Obviously, preferring sexual intimacy with another man is part of what it means to be attracted to the same sex. I don’t really understand your point.

By the way, there’s way more to being gay than the actual physical act of sex, as I talked about earlier. It’s not like the average gay person is just going out every weekend and having random clandestine sex with strangers. I’ve found that sort of behavior is symptomatic of a closeted, uncomfortable same-sex-attracted person who cycles through shame/guilt/temptation/outbursts rather than a comfortable, well-adjusted socially healthy gay person, as I talked about earlier in this thread. In fact, some of the best, long term, committed relationships I’ve known have been between two guys or two gals. It’s love and intimacy and romance, really, that gay people want and care about, just like most straight people. Sexual intimacy is often just a private expression of that - and it generally isn’t other people’s concerns, to be honest. (You don’t see me accusing Catholics of having “disgusting” sex with their wives, after all!)

I have no idea what you’re talking about here.

I think you need to let go of the romantic idea that there is any sort of culture beyond the sexual act that forms a constituent part of the homosexual identity. The "diversity" extolled by homosexual propaganda and the "stereotypes" maligned therein puts the lie to the notion that there is anything more to "being gay" than slavishly catering to every sexual impulse.

I also think that you miss YipYupYep’s point when he refers to the same-sex sexual act as being a bit of Hell on Earth. It does not seem to me that he is calling the act unpleasant. Obviously, as you have implied, the act is pleasurable for those who consent to it. I think what YipYupYep refers to is that the act, by its very nature, reduces another person to the level of a sexual object for a purely hedonistic end. The act is self-centered, rather than self-giving, and so is, in that sense, Hell on Earth.

Keeping the above in mind, we must turn back to the original post wherein we are presented with an individual who committed adultery and could have exposed his wife to any number of sexually transmitted diseases thereby. This individual’s 45 minutes or so of pleasure have led to an emotional nadir, which is very much reminiscent of Hell. He pursued the only thing germane to the homosexual experience – orgasm – without any thought of anyone but himself. In all, the OP presents a potent example of everything that the so-called gay community is.

 

[Exalt]

I think you need to let go of the romantic idea that there is any sort of culture beyond the sexual act that forms a constituent part of the homosexual identity. The “diversity” extolled by homosexual propaganda and the “stereotypes” maligned therein puts the lie to the notion that there is anything more to “being gay” than slavishly catering to every sexual impulse.

You’re wrong. You’re saying that every single gay person on the planet “slavishly caters to every sexual impulse,” as if that’s the only thing we’re concerned about or care about. For sure, there are gay people who have deep problems and make sex their primary concern, but that’s not true for most of us. There are heterosexual men and women, too, who only care about sex, but you don’t make sweeping generalizations about them.

Here’s your claim: You believe that there is nothing more to the “culture” of being gay than “slavishly catering to every sexual impulse.” You’re wrong on two fronts. Number one, though a kind of ‘gay culture’ might exist in a very limited way, very few gay person that I know would say that they are actively involved in that culture. On the contrary, they live normal lives. They go to work, they pay their taxes, they spend time with their friends, they play community sports and some even spend large portions of their time volunteering. The only difference between them and an average straight person, is that it so happens that they are in love with another man or another woman. For those that are involved in long-term committed relationships, they go on regular dates, they live together, and though I’m sure sex happens, it’s not really my concern, and I rarely ever ask about it. They seem genuinely happy. For the rest, they date just like normal straight people. There are not many significant differences.

I also think that you miss YipYupYep’s point when he refers to the same-sex sexual act as being a bit of Hell on Earth. It does not seem to me that he is calling the act unpleasant. Obviously, as you have implied, the act is pleasurable for those who consent to it. I think what YipYupYep refers to is that the act, by its very nature, reduces another person to the level of a sexual object for a purely hedonistic end. The act is self-centered, rather than self-giving, and so is, in that sense, Hell on Earth.

Keeping the above in mind, we must turn back to the original post wherein we are presented with an individual who committed adultery and could have exposed his wife to any number of sexually transmitted diseases thereby. This individual’s 45 minutes or so of pleasure have led to an emotional nadir, which is very much reminiscent of Hell. He pursued the only thing germane to the homosexual experience – orgasm – without any thought of anyone but himself. In all, the OP presents a potent example of everything that the so-called gay community is.

It’s clear that what the OP did was very bad, and I did my best to explain my own opinion about the matter in another post above.

However, it’s not “everything the so-called gay community is.” Do you completely ignore evidence to the contrary? When presented with examples of specific gay couples, do you rationalize how *really, underneath the surface *all they care about is sex, and that they’re probably just propaganda tools? I mean, you sound a little bigoted and prejudiced, to be quite honest, which I’m sure you’re not.

 

[m134e5]

Please help me. Im a 26 year old married guy. I have been plagued by homosexual temptations since I was a teenager, I just cant get rid of them. They just pop into my head all the time.

I have fantasised, masturbated and looked at pornography. However over the last couple of years I have started actively seeking out sexual contact with oher men even though I know this is so sinful, disgusting and wrong. Nothing had come of this until last nght when I met with a man I met online.

I cant believe I have done this. I feel so, so ashamed. So dirty. I have never felt guilt like this. I pray and strongly believe in trying to live my faith well. God has given me so many blessings in my life and this is how I repay him?

What should I do? I am so sorry for what I have done. Im just so worried the feelings will come back. Does anyone have any suggestions how to beat this?

Please pray for me.

Chris

Remember that God loves you very much, and knows your struggles. He will not let you down if you ask for help. There are support groups for people with your struggle- www.couragerc.org is the website for one of them (make sure, if you find a ministry other than courage, that it is in line with the Church’s teachings). Now, you need to go to confession as soon as possible- I can’t sugar coat the fact that this was a very wrong thing to do, but God’s love and mercy is greater than your sin.

It’ important with struggles like this that you don’t allow yourself too much time alone. Find a good group of Catholic men who you can get to know- solid friendships with good, virtuous men can be very helpful. Don’t talk to them about this struggle or anything, but it can be helpful to know that you do not need to act out sexually with another man to know that you can appreciate each other’s company. The Knights of Columbus has great ideals- and it can be a great organization- but you may have trouble finding a council where you aren’t 30 years younger than everybody else. If joining it isn’t the best thing for you right now, reading their literature could still prove helpful. www.couragerc.org also may have some resources to help you. See if there is a chapter of Courage in your area (see the website above).

You need to find something to do with your down time other than go online. Read, go to adoration (I STRONGLY RECOMMEND THIS ONE), go for a walk, learn a new hobby- anything that is moral and can get your mind off of whatever is causing you to fall in this way. There may be a very difficult battle ahead for you- and you may find some setbacks along the way, but if you persevere, you will be victorious.

I will pray for you.